seems like no more adam hughes con sketches

[Speedy-D]

To be clear, I dont care what they do as I can not afford 400$ for a sketch. BUT!

 

One could argue that anyone with 'investment' in mind when they buy or sell anything is a 'flipper'. Even if the intention is to sell it 20 years down the line.

 

I love comic art, AH is top 5 for me.

Not really. A flipper is someone who seeks out bargains for immediate resale at a higher price, to make a quick buck.

[john72tex]

I guess I'll never have an original Adam Hughes piece now. I'm not paying astronomical prices on Ebay.

[Stormsurge]

Wow that sketch is totally amazing and I'm not even a WW fan! To bad one jerk off had to spoil it for everyone... It's not like its easy getting sketches done for anyone these days.

[Royd]

As Mod/Owner of the Hughes-Fans Yahoo group (7850 members and growing) for the past 10 years, I've been dealing with numerous posts on this issue at the group and elsewhere so when I checked in here to find a similar thread, I was relieved to see some very reasonable discussion

 

As a side note, people might be interested to know that Jeff Scott Campbell did a Black Cat piece for the same flipper at the Boston show and it was also offered on ebay. Jeff spoke of the individual's actions at his Facebook page saying that the guy asked for a sketch for his 10 year old son to which Jeff asked whether his son might like Spider-Man instead but the guy insisted on Black Cat....I wonder why....

 

A number of people messaged this guy on ebay and he said that he'd decided to sell the sketches (on the day he got them) because he found out he'd lost his job (he apparently lost his job on a Sunday) *sigh* I guess his son never got his Black Cat sketch since his father lost his job ....riiiiight! Best,

 

Royd

http://groups.yahoo.com/group/hughes-fans/

[Stringer]

I imagine there will still be pieces selling for reasonable prices on eBay from time to time. I really didn't have to pay a lot for my Hughes Indiana Jones sketch card on eBay. However, it was a sketch card and not a fully blown Hughes commission.

 

http://www.comicartfans.com/GalleryPiece.asp?Piece=548516&GSub=86226

[mrpunch0]

welp this sux... personalize them

 

Everyone throws that out there as a possible solution – but if sketches are going for $2000 - $3000 do you really think a little "To Dave" is going to keep someone from bidding? I'd still buy it.

 

Bottom line is Adam kept his prices "low" for as long as he could so as many of his fans could get a sketch as possible. He just finally got sick of being taken advantage of. And while that means I'll never get another sketch from him, that's fine with me.

[Brian Peck]

Some people will not buy anything personalized to someone else. For me it doesn't bother me that much in regards to a sketch or published page.

[Menace]

JSC reaction to the situation.

 

http://www.bleedingcool.com/2011/05/04/j-scott-campbell-keeps-sketching-but-knows-the-risks/

[Artboy99]

Couldn't the guy at least wait a month? I mean I don't think it is the fact people sell. I think it is the fact people lie and beg then put it up 20 minutes after they get it. I only sell if I get an upgrade.

 

When artist see their art for sale on ebay for exuberant prices by people who specifically bought the art to sell it makes them feel like worker monkeys and whores.

 

It kind of degrades them and cheapens their work.

 

These guys are human beings and have feelings. They want to go to conventions to have a good time and meet people and perhaps make a living. They are not simply here for our amusement.

 

The fact that they sign and do sketches is simply a biproduct of them attending different festivals & conventions.

 

The quicker people realize that the better off we will be.

 

Not all artists feel this way, I being one of them. If I sell a piece for 500.00 and later see it listed / sell on Ebay for 800.00, I don't care.

[mrpunch0]

Not all artists feel this way, I being one of them. If I sell a piece for 500.00 and later see it listed / sell on Ebay for 800.00, I don't care.

 

Adam has said it's not all about the money. (But I'm sure watching a $200 sketch sell for $2000 burns a little.) He's kept his prices way below market value for years so his many fans have a shot at getting one. And when he goes out of his way to do a sketch for a guy – at the expense of every other fan on the list – and that sketch ends up on eBay hours later? That's the problem.

 

Every fan who was at that show and didn't get a chance to pay for that sketch (and many have been trying for years) is ticked off.

The artist ends up feeling used.

The only winner is the flipper who just turned a, $1,800 profit.

[mrpunch0]

Some people will not buy anything personalized to someone else. For me it doesn't bother me that much in regards to a sketch or published page.

 

Oh, I know. But we've seen enough AH sketches sell on eBay to know that personalization isn't going to keep it from reselling. It may keep some bidders out – but a good AH sketch will still go for a good price.

[comix4fun]

Couldn't the guy at least wait a month? I mean I don't think it is the fact people sell. I think it is the fact people lie and beg then put it up 20 minutes after they get it. I only sell if I get an upgrade.

 

When artist see their art for sale on ebay for exuberant prices by people who specifically bought the art to sell it makes them feel like worker monkeys and whores.

 

It kind of degrades them and cheapens their work.

 

These guys are human beings and have feelings. They want to go to conventions to have a good time and meet people and perhaps make a living. They are not simply here for our amusement.

 

The fact that they sign and do sketches is simply a biproduct of them attending different festivals & conventions.

 

The quicker people realize that the better off we will be.

 

Not all artists feel this way, I being one of them. If I sell a piece for 500.00 and later see it listed / sell on Ebay for 800.00, I don't care.

 

 

If someone whined and moaned and cried and lied and conned you into getting the sketch at the expense of someone who might really appreciate your work I think you might care. That's what really happened here.

[Shaun C89]

I think it is an unfortunate situation. I admire that AH kept his prices so low for so long knowing what he could get via eBay auction. I don't want to sound harsh but I would like to see AH and other artists do less conventions and stay at home and do more work that could be published for everybody to enjoy.

[AKA Rick]

I think the basis of this whole issue, going back to the crux of it all is someone actually did lie, cheat and steal here.

 

He lied to Campbell and Hughes by fabricating a story in an attempt to get favortisim through sympathy.

 

He cheated the system which is based on artists who try to appease as many fans in the name of fandom, not profiteering by lying.

 

He stole, and this is a loose term not an accusation of theft of property, but did steal the opportunity for another person, hopefully a true fan, to get a sketch.

 

The reality is this... if Adam Hughes or any other top named artist wanted to maximize their own profit potential, they'd go with the pure eBay play, do a silent auction at the conventions (basically put a list out on opening day and the Top Paying Bidders gets the Sketches, adhering to the laws of supply and demand)... but up until now, they've not.

 

It's hard to bash people like Adam Hughes in that, he's been generous to afford the majority of his fans something. He offers signatures and conversation for free. He sometimes has donation based sketches at an affordable $5-10, that goes directly to charity. He's charged way below market value (I remember when he was only charging $150) on the masterpiece styled show commissions and still has a list that exceeds the supply (his ability to maybe do 3-5 a show) by at least 10x, knowing (via his single eBay auctions) he could easily charge $2,000-3,000 and here will be happy buyers (but not wanting to alienate the fans who can't afford that much, so at the time keeping 'em at a fair lower price).

 

So, to me, Adam Hughes had up until this point, a system that allowed fans at every economic level, an opportunity to take something home from a convention.

 

Adam Hughes system was also the most fair of all. It put the humanity into the process. Rather than allow "fans" (true or not) to wait in line hours early to be first, or those who get those "exhibitor / dealer / professional / press" badges and use them to get on commission lists early... his system reasonably allowed for most to get a fair opportunity. Couple that with the system of picking characters within a long list, out of order, that allowed him to draw characters he felt like drawing as well as politely declining those he didn't feel like drawing or declining those people who he felt were suspicious in nature as well as selecting true patient fans who may not always be the top 10 people to get on the list, but are at every show in gracious people.

 

I heard Neal Adams went through the same thing years ago when profiteering folks under the guise of fans manipulated the system to get drawings they'd sell online, so Neal decided to price his pieces at that "fair market / direct to consumer" level, in an attempt to eliminate the "middle man" so that these profitering folks basically go away since there was no room for them to make money at the new prices.

 

People have to remember, the artists come to the shows to promote their material and meet the fans, as well as being fans themselves (wanting to leave the table, shop around, have a nice meal, visit their peers, etc.)... not just sit at a table all day and eat crappy convention hot dogs and chips for a quick lunch, put their head down and draw all day like machines. If that were the case, why travel to conventions? They could do just the same in the comfort of their own home. It's also part business to hold meetings with publishers, and for some artists, yes, to make money on commissions, sell prints, etc. - - but as a social business, what seems to be missing lately is mutual respect... both sides of the fence sometimes too. Artists who take money but don't do the commissions for long periods of time (different thread different topic). Fans need to give the artists a little slack and breathing room. The hardest part is, they can't please everyone, and someone always goes home disappointed if not angry because of false expectations.

 

A great show coming up is the BIG WOW COMIC FEST on May 21-22 in San Jose, CA that's always had a casual and fan friendly atmosphere. http://www.super-con.com/ - I hope to hear good stories about the event !!!

 

[Bronty]

hughes should just up his convention prices to $1500. The fact that these maggots do is because of the huge gap in prices between what he charges and his market. The wider the spread the more the opportunity for d-bags. If he wants to help out his fans he can still charge a price that is under market to a degree but enough to lessen the avalanche of d-bag opportunists. Its too bad he was soured but it was kind of inevitable when he's giving away $2000 to each person that signs up

[Kevin76]

I'm a big fan of Neal's but I disagree... Neal is WELL past his prime in terms of his ability, sadly. On the other hand, AH is right in his sweet spot and if you truly ignore who's "modern" and who's "vintage" Hughes is a great artist too. Very different, but very good. I couldn't even tell you what he's done or where he's been published but the work does speak for itself.

 

Well past his prime? What is he a basketball player? Can't quite make those jump shots or passing plays like he used too? Yes his style has changed a bit in terms of his rendering that doesn't look as great as when he was on Batman/Green Lantern, but from a "technical" stand point, That never changes for the worst. A lot more to drawing than how pretty the line work is.

[Kevin76]

Ok i've read through this thread a bit,here's my opinion. He prolly feels taken advantage of. Ya know, Adam draw this, Adam draw that, then they go and sell it. Thinking he's doing his fans a favor,Are all these people even fans? Probably not. Anyhow, How long does it take him to do a drawing? 20 mins? let's see...that's 3 sketches an hour @200.00 each. 7 hour show...1 downtime for food,bathroom,stretching legs...6 hours of drawing ...$1200.00 per show, 3 day show..$3600 in cash per show, then travel to another city and do it all over again...

 

I don't feel bad for Adam.

[comix4fun]

. Anyhow, How long does it take him to do a drawing? 20 mins? let's see...that's 3 sketches an hour @200.00 each. 7 hour show...1 downtime for food,bathroom,stretching legs...6 hours of drawing ...$1200.00 per show, 3 day show..$3600 in cash per show, then travel to another city and do it all over again...

 

I don't feel bad for Adam.

 

 

 

My sketch took him 5+ hours to complete.

[Bronty]

Well past his prime? What is he a basketball player?

 

--I wish. You can't lose height the way you can lose artistic ability.

 

Can't quite make those jump shots or passing plays like he used too?

 

--he can't even get up and down the floor to have the opportunity to *take* the shot, let alone make it.

 

Yes his style has changed a bit

 

-- ya think

 

in terms of his rendering that doesn't look as great as when he was on Batman/Green Lantern,

 

--understatement

 

but from a "technical" stand point, That never changes for the worst.

 

--couldn't disagree more. drawing is like any learned skill. A lot of practice will make you better and a lack of practice or diminished manual dexterity or flat diminished motivation can make you worse.

 

A lot more to drawing than how pretty the line work is.

 

-- yeah but don't pizz on my leg and tell me its raining. No matter how good somebody was, certain guys can and do deteriorate. And certain guys can and do get better with age. I wish I had .0001% of the artistic skill Neal had, OK? And I respect his ability IMMENSELY. But his jump shot ain't what it used to be.

 

 

 

 

[Bronty]

I'm a big fan of Neal's but I disagree... Neal is WELL past his prime in terms of his ability, sadly. On the other hand, AH is right in his sweet spot and if you truly ignore who's "modern" and who's "vintage" Hughes is a great artist too. Very different, but very good. I couldn't even tell you what he's done or where he's been published but the work does speak for itself.

from a "technical" stand point,

 

from a technical standpoint you could argue he wasn't that great in his heyday. there are certainly lots of gimpy anatomy and occasional awkward perspective in Neal's work even in his heyday. But he had so much god given verve and talent and dynamism that you overlooked that happily and begged for more on your hands and knees. But "technical" drawing ability? In some respect the one thing you might fault him on, even in his heyday. You could see or suspected he was partially self-taught. And now that he is a bit older that lack of foundation comes through louder now that the work doesn't have the glorious finish that it used to have.

 

That said, best artist of the bronze age for my money.