X-O Manowar discussion, arriving May 2

[aggr1103]

It will be interesting to see how these books do in comparison to the stuff Shooter put out at Dark Horse.

 

I think each book made it to what - 3,4 issues?

4 issues for Magnus and Turok, 8 issues for Dr. Solar.

 

Greg was it low issue sales that led to the cancellation?

[400yrs]

In 2010, it was revealed that Valiant had hired Jim Shooter to be Editor-In-Chief, but Shooter left Valiant unannounced

to go to Dark Horse and do Magnus, Dr. Solar, and Turok. Valiant sued Shooter, but dropped the suit.

 

It will be interesting to see how these books do in comparison to the stuff Shooter put out at Dark Horse.

 

I think each book made it to what - 3,4 issues?

 

I don't think there's any chance of them cutting the line that quick.

 

The Dark Key stuff was pure .

[BadDeacon]

Greg was it low issue sales that led to the cancellation?

Isn't it always low sales that lead to cancellation of an "ongoing"

 

The question is WHY sales were so low. Low quality books that were chronicly late.

[aggr1103]

Greg was it low issue sales that led to the cancellation?

Isn't it always low sales that lead to cancellation of an "ongoing"

 

The question is WHY sales were so low. Low quality books that were chronicly late.

 

Was that Shooters fault?

[Gatsby77]

are any of the people that worked on the original series of this working on the new series or have anything to do with it ? Also kind of wondering what started this relaunch , kind of funny to just have everything back up & running again imo... guess I need to wiki some valiant history

 

One thing that's cool is that in 1992, X-O launched as an amalgam of Conan the Barbarian and Iron Man. Sort of "what if a neanderthal had the Iron Man armor?"

 

And the art was done by BWS (classic Conan artist) and Bob Layton (classic Iron Man artist).

 

Fast forward to this reboot, and the art is done by Cary Nord, original artist for the 2000s Dark Horse version of Conan the Barbarian.

 

Symmetry, a generation apart!

[thirdgreenham]

For anyone who cares: 4 X-O covers for sale on eBay bidding starts at $150.

 

2 regular covers, 1:20, and 1:50

 

 

[valiantman]

Greg was it low issue sales that led to the cancellation?

Isn't it always low sales that lead to cancellation of an "ongoing"

 

The question is WHY sales were so low. Low quality books that were chronicly late.

 

My guess is that Dark Horse's business model is to help creators publish their own works (Hellboy),

or to print licensed books for larger properties who have massive backing (Star Wars).

 

To do Magnus, Dr. Solar, and Turok, Dark Horse had to pay to license the characters,

and to have Jim Shooter in charge means that Dark Horse had to pay Jim Shooter.

 

I'm thinking Dark Horse doesn't do much of the "we pay" model, they seem to do the "you pay us" model.

 

The sales figures probably didn't support the cost structure,

and the sales were a reflection of the content, marketing, quality, timeliness, etc.

[A-DONIS]

For anyone who cares: 4 X-O covers for sale on eBay bidding starts at $150.

 

2 regular covers, 1:20, and 1:50

 

 

and 0 bids it is

[valiantman]

For anyone who cares: 4 X-O covers for sale on eBay bidding starts at $150.

 

2 regular covers, 1:20, and 1:50

 

and 0 bids it is

That's a nice graphic in the auction though.

[Shaven Kev-migration]

For anyone who cares: 4 X-O covers for sale on eBay bidding starts at $150.

 

2 regular covers, 1:20, and 1:50

 

and 0 bids it is

That's a nice graphic in the auction though.

 

Smart bidders snipe at the end. How many watcher do you have?

[synch]

i thought you couldn't post ebay links here forum rules & all that

[mschmidt]

i thought you couldn't post ebay links here forum rules & all that

 

You're not allowed to post links to your own ebay auctions outside of the designated "Comics Market - Sales Advertising - Ebay, Dealers, etc." area ... posting links to other peoples' auctions have never been against the rules, though.

[synch]

ah

 

[Gatsby77]

[

I'm thinking Dark Horse doesn't do much of the "we pay" model, they seem to do the "you pay us" model.

 

The sales figures probably didn't support the cost structure, and the sales were a reflection of the content, marketing, quality, timeliness, etc.

 

But that's the same model Image uses. They basically force creators for new books to work for nothing/subsistence for the first 3-4 issues; only then--if sales support the book's survival, do they start getting paid "market" rate.

 

My take on Dark Horse's line is two-fold:

 

1) Shooter's writing was too archaic by modern standards. What was charming and worked for the line 20 years ago doesn't fly by today's (higher) writing standards--see modern issues of Daredevil or Detective--far more sophisticated than they were a generation ago.

 

2) Dark Horse did little to promote the line (not that they should have had to, but I doubt the books made them much money, if any with print runs down around 6-8k.

 

I'd like to see the new Valiant settle into a small niche spot akin to IDW--5-6 core titles, with an additional 3-4 rotating through as short miniseries (ala the Aliens and Predator model that seemed to work for Dark Horse).

 

Even Acclaim managed this, with Shadowman, Bloodshot, and Troublemakers being genuinely good books that all lasted about 20 issues or so.

[aggr1103]

 

My take on Dark Horse's line is two-fold:

 

1) Shooter's writing was too archaic by modern standards. What was charming and worked for the line 20 years ago doesn't fly by today's (higher) writing standards--see modern issues of Daredevil or Detective--far more sophisticated than they were a generation ago.

 

2) Dark Horse did little to promote the line (not that they should have had to, but I doubt the books made them much money, if any with print runs down around 6-8k.

 

In hindsight I think I was asking questions about whether or not their failure was Shooter's fault based on what I've read and learned through Shooter's blog. I always enjoyed Shooter's writing, but his blog (which is a world of great info) gives me the feeling that he is pretty arrogant and a control freak. When I heard that Shooter was doing the "Dark Key" books I was wondering what his angle was. I just couldn't imagine Shooter publishing a book for a company he didn't have some sort of stake or control in.

[Schmakt]

I thought the writing was fine... but the art was just terrible... I rather wanted to keep reading (perhaps just b/c I wanted to support Shooter and the characters, but still...), but I just couldn't stand to look at the interior art anymore. That's what did it for me.

 

Maybe I already said that earlier...

 

Just got my copy of X-O... excited to get home and read it.

[synch]

I thought the writing was fine... but the art was just terrible... I rather wanted to keep reading (perhaps just b/c I wanted to support Shooter and the characters, but still...), but I just couldn't stand to look at the interior art anymore. That's what did it for me.

 

Maybe I already said that earlier...

 

Just got my copy of X-O... excited to get home and read it.

 

for second i thought you were talking about the new XO & was all but now I am all

[Shaven Kev-migration]

The art is the weak point in almost all of Dark Horse's titles...except Hellboy, and always has been. Great covers usually though.

[synch]

So I am thinking I will only get the pull box variant covers for the #1s ... thinking about it .... all these variants for each book?? that is a heck of a lot of coin! More than I am willing to spend imo!

[Lebowski]

The art is the weak point in almost all of Dark Horse's titles...except Hellboy, and always has been. Great covers usually though.

 

Goon has pretty much the best art of damn near any indy title, forget just Dark Horse. Recognize, beeyotch.