Walking Dead #1 Black Label vs White Label - an Answer! UPDATED 2/4/14 2 2

[maloney414]

As soon as you can definitively tell me how many of the CGC submissions were CPR'd, and tell me how many copies of TWD #1 are still in private collections, I will recant my statements here.

 

 

 

As dragonmanagement said, you are completely missing the point. It's impossible to have the exact number, best thing that anyone can get is an accurate, educate guess bassed on limited but reliable data. That's how statistics work.

 

Since several have tried to explain how statistics work, and you still argue against it, you probably won't ever get it. Based on the data though, I would have to say the numbers are there to support less black labels vs white labels, in fact, the numbers are not even close to 50/50 black labels vs white labels.

 

I have a hard time taking anything seriously that has, at best, 20% of the known copies as its sample for survey. I know you are extrapolating using that data, I just don't trust that extrapolation. Same as I don't trust anyone telling me that "America wants X because our poll of .001% of the population says so." I trust the 20% population data more, and I don't trust it at all.

 

 

And as I had to re-iterate in my last post above, I have never said there weren't less. If I say I agree with Kirkman, then I am saying there are less black versions than white. Jeez.

 

 

 

-slym

 

Hey slym

 

I'm the one who started the Walking Dead FAQ thread

 

You should read question 1 before continuing the conversation.

 

If you say you agree with Kirkman, then you are saying there are less white versions than black. Jeez.....

[retrothecollector]

As soon as you can definitively tell me how many of the CGC submissions were CPR'd, and tell me how many copies of TWD #1 are still in private collections, I will recant my statements here.

 

 

 

As dragonmanagement said, you are completely missing the point. It's impossible to have the exact number, best thing that anyone can get is an accurate, educate guess bassed on limited but reliable data. That's how statistics work.

 

Since several have tried to explain how statistics work, and you still argue against it, you probably won't ever get it. Based on the data though, I would have to say the numbers are there to support less black labels vs white labels, in fact, the numbers are not even close to 50/50 black labels vs white labels.

 

I have a hard time taking anything seriously that has, at best, 20% of the known copies as its sample for survey. I know you are extrapolating using that data, I just don't trust that extrapolation. Same as I don't trust anyone telling me that "America wants X because our poll of .001% of the population says so." I trust the 20% population data more, and I don't trust it at all.

 

 

And as I had to re-iterate in my last post above, I have never said there weren't less. If I say I agree with Kirkman, then I am saying there are less black versions than white. Jeez.

 

 

 

-slym

 

Hey slym

 

I'm the one who started the Walking Dead FAQ thread

 

You should read question 1 before continuing the conversation.

 

If you say you agree with Kirkman, then you are saying there are less white versions than black. Jeez.....

 

Your slabbed collection is amazing Maloney. jus sayin

[maloney414]

Thanks!

[slym2none]

As soon as you can definitively tell me how many of the CGC submissions were CPR'd, and tell me how many copies of TWD #1 are still in private collections, I will recant my statements here.

 

 

 

As dragonmanagement said, you are completely missing the point. It's impossible to have the exact number, best thing that anyone can get is an accurate, educate guess bassed on limited but reliable data. That's how statistics work.

 

Since several have tried to explain how statistics work, and you still argue against it, you probably won't ever get it. Based on the data though, I would have to say the numbers are there to support less black labels vs white labels, in fact, the numbers are not even close to 50/50 black labels vs white labels.

 

I have a hard time taking anything seriously that has, at best, 20% of the known copies as its sample for survey. I know you are extrapolating using that data, I just don't trust that extrapolation. Same as I don't trust anyone telling me that "America wants X because our poll of .001% of the population says so." I trust the 20% population data more, and I don't trust it at all.

 

 

And as I had to re-iterate in my last post above, I have never said there weren't less. If I say I agree with Kirkman, then I am saying there are less black versions than white. Jeez.

 

 

 

-slym

 

Hey slym

 

I'm the one who started the Walking Dead FAQ thread

 

You should read question 1 before continuing the conversation.

 

If you say you agree with Kirkman, then you are saying there are less white versions than black. Jeez.....

 

Dang. I had that all mixed up all along. I really thought Kirkman said it was the other way.

 

My bad. Sorry about that, everyone. I'd eat some crow, but my foot is in my mouth right now.

 

 

 

 

-slym

[Jaydogrules]

Hi All!

 

Newbie to the boards here (though a long time collector). Had to throw in with slym on this topic though:

 

With much love to the amateur statisticians on the board, I'm sorry guys, but there is nothing "rare" about black label Walking Dead #1's. The mere fact that you can find 7-10 of those available for sale online, on just one site alone (ebay) at any given time bears this out. As of writing this, there are nine available for sale on ebay, each seller calling it "rare" on their listing, which, frankly, just looks a little silly. It really doesn't even matter what the actual proportions are of white-to-black, there are more than enough of either floating around at any given time that they are both readily available, and thus no price difference is warranted. I do believe that there was a brief blip in time recently when, yes, black labels did seem to get a slightly higher auction price. But people no longer seem to be drinking the "black is rarer" Kool-Aid as tons of the black labels have flooded to market, or sellers are at least now making it a point to point them out in their listings, that slight price difference seems to have evaporated since the summer, and whites and blacks have both settled into the same price range when they are up for auction. And the sellers who are offering theirs at exorbitant "buy it now" prices are disappointed as their books are sitting there with no takers, regardless of the label color. I think slym is also right to take Kirkman at his word when he (Kirkman) made his statement on this issue. The man just has no reason to joke around about such an innocuous issue, and he certainly is more in the know than any of us. I think in the end, we can all agree that it's a great book to own as a collector and a reader, and those of us who have one of either label color (or both!) should feel proud to have such a great book that has so quickly become an integral part of modern pop culture.

 

On another note.....can anyone tell me or refer me to a link that explains how to set up a signature line? I have searched and not been able to find any instructions on how to do that.

 

Thanks in advance!

 

-J.

[maloney414]

Hi All!

 

Newbie to the boards here (though a long time collector). Had to throw in with slym on this topic though:

 

With much love to the amateur statisticians on the board, I'm sorry guys, but there is nothing "rare" about black label Walking Dead #1's. The mere fact that you can find 7-10 of those available for sale online, on just one site alone (ebay) at any given time bears this out. As of writing this, there are nine available for sale on ebay, each seller calling it "rare" on their listing, which, frankly, just looks a little silly. It really doesn't even matter what the actual proportions are of white-to-black, there are more than enough of either floating around at any given time that they are both readily available, and thus no price difference is warranted. I do believe that there was a brief blip in time recently when, yes, black labels did seem to get a slightly higher auction price. But people no longer seem to be drinking the "black is rarer" Kool-Aid as tons of the black labels have flooded to market, or sellers are at least now making it a point to point them out in their listings, that slight price difference seems to have evaporated since the summer, and whites and blacks have both settled into the same price range when they are up for auction. And the sellers who are offering theirs at exorbitant "buy it now" prices are disappointed as their books are sitting there with no takers, regardless of the label color. I think slym is also right to take Kirkman at his word when he (Kirkman) made his statement on this issue. The man just has no reason to joke around about such an innocuous issue, and he certainly is more in the know than any of us. I think in the end, we can all agree that it's a great book to own as a collector and a reader, and those of us who have one of either label color (or both!) should feel proud to have such a great book that has so quickly become an integral part of modern pop culture.

 

On another note.....can anyone tell me or refer me to a link that explains how to set up a signature line? I have searched and not been able to find any instructions on how to do that.

 

Thanks in advance!

 

-J.

 

 

Welcome to the boards!

 

Your response brings up the same confusion that keeps popping up. Specifically, the term "rare." As I've said numerous times, there is significant evidence the black label is less common; however, the difference isn't great enough to demand a consistent price bump. (see #1 of the FAQ thread.).

 

The word "rare" has been abused for sure. There is definitely carnival barking on eBay, with people using the word rare to try and imply they are scarce. They are not scarce.

 

Sig line stuff:

Click on the tab at the top of the page "my stuff"

Then select "my profile"

On the profile page scroll down to "signature" to type things in the space provided.

If you want to add pictures, links, etc... there is a link right there "UBBCode" with all the instructions how to do that. (thumbs u

(Pictures have to have a web address. You can create that by posting your pictures on a site like photobucket. Then use the commands.)

 

[bffnut]

(Hey, bffnut, can you work that up? How many new data points would have to be recorded in order to support Kirkman's estimates?)

 

Already done, my friend! :Thumbsup:

 

Using the formula provided by the text, only 150 samples would be needed if you wanted a CI of 95% and an error of 8%, assuming the occurrence is 50/50. Only 144 would be needed if the ratio is 40/60. Even with a margin of error of 5%, only 369 to 384 samples would be needed.

[bffnut]

Thanks for adding your input, Maloney. I have a quick link in my sig line to your WD FAQ. It comes in very handy.

 

Jay, like Maloney said, I'm not trying to say that the black label is "rare" but rather that there is less of it than the white label. There have been arguments as to which there were less of; as stated in the FAQ, Kirkman believed the white to be less rare, but anecdotally, the black seemed to be in less supply. I simply wanted to use statistics to get a better picture.

[dragonmgmt]

Thanks. Missed that in your original post.

 

(Hey, bffnut, can you work that up? How many new data points would have to be recorded in order to support Kirkman's estimates?)

 

Already done, my friend! :Thumbsup:

 

Using the formula provided by the text, only 150 samples would be needed if you wanted a CI of 95% and an error of 8%, assuming the occurrence is 50/50. Only 144 would be needed if the ratio is 40/60. Even with a margin of error of 5%, only 369 to 384 samples would be needed.

[dragonmgmt]

I have a hard time taking anything seriously that has, at best, 20% of the known copies as its sample for survey. I know you are extrapolating using that data, I just don't trust that extrapolation. Same as I don't trust anyone telling me that "America wants X because our poll of .001% of the population says so." I trust the 20% population data more, and I don't trust it at all.

 

And this, ladies and gentlemen, is why remediation is necessary in post-secondary institutions.

 

Sheesh.

 

slym, just admit that statistics isn't your thing and that you're trusting your gut on this one. That would be more honest than trying to takedown an entire field of study.

[Balham's Finest]

I have a hard time taking anything seriously that has, at best, 20% of the known copies as its sample for survey. I know you are extrapolating using that data, I just don't trust that extrapolation. Same as I don't trust anyone telling me that "America wants X because our poll of .001% of the population says so." I trust the 20% population data more, and I don't trust it at all.

 

And this, ladies and gentlemen, is why remediation is necessary in post-secondary institutions.

 

Sheesh.

 

slym, just admit that statistics isn't your thing and that you're trusting your gut on this one. That would be more honest than trying to takedown an entire field of study.

 

You are being a bit of a knob about this. That's pretty much exactly what his post that you quoted says. What more do you want? Let him have his opinion and kick back feeling smug about how deep your understanding of stats is.

[comicsnyc22]

Are we arguing over which is worth more, or the actual amount of each available?

[retrothecollector]

Are we arguing over which is worth more, or the actual amount of each available?

I think the # of prints b vs. w not the amount...... well not yet anyways.

[ThoseBackPages]

OWN BOTH!

 

 

[bffnut]

I was looking into the actual amount of the physical copies of each.

 

[retrothecollector]

OWN BOTH!

 

 

As soon as the bubble burst. I will own both sir.

[ThoseBackPages]

YES!!!!

[the authority]

OWN BOTH!

 

 

Problem solved.

[slym2none]

I have a hard time taking anything seriously that has, at best, 20% of the known copies as its sample for survey. I know you are extrapolating using that data, I just don't trust that extrapolation. Same as I don't trust anyone telling me that "America wants X because our poll of .001% of the population says so." I trust the 20% population data more, and I don't trust it at all.

 

And this, ladies and gentlemen, is why remediation is necessary in post-secondary institutions.

 

Sheesh.

 

slym, just admit that statistics isn't your thing and that you're trusting your gut on this one. That would be more honest than trying to takedown an entire field of study.

 

You are being a bit of a knob about this. That's pretty much exactly what his post that you quoted says. What more do you want? Let him have his opinion and kick back feeling smug about how deep your understanding of stats is.

 

I guess no one saw where I totally misunderstood everything and thought Kirkman was saying there were more black editions than white when that is exactly opposite of what he says, and I apologised for being wrong and ruffling all sorts of feathers.

 

 

 

 

-slym

[bffnut]

I saw it slym. You're golden :thumbsup: