HULK #1 CLUB : THE PUNY LITTLE MAN LEAGUE

[mysterio]

 

If the seller sold that book using that description to a good friend of yours who was just getting into collecting, would you feel good about it?

 

If my friend bought an $8000 book without understanding what he was buying he'd deserve whatever he got.

 

Maybe I'm missing something but if the work done is explained clearly, I don't have a problem with anything else.

 

Call it semantics, or spin, or embellishing, or hornswoggling, or whatever you want, but to me that is a book with a blue label (which previously has been established through ten plus years of use by CGC as denoting an unrestored original comic) with a euphemism to minimize what in effect is restoration.

 

But the purple label is no longer being used even if it was in effect for 13 years. Things changed.

 

Now it's a blue label with a purple stripe.

 

I genuinely don't get the reaction you guys are having but then as I said previously, I've long thought that all books should be in the same colored label and words should be used to convey what was done to the book, Voldemart or not.

 

 

I find it a bit ironic that you'd blame your hypothetical friend for not understanding what he bought in this case. It is clearly restoration.

 

CGC still has a purple label.

 

As for conservation, the article announcing it says conservation must be professionally done. This means that CGC would give this book a purple label for "amateur conservation".

[Junkdrawer]

I think a tear seal actually would be to conserve a book, to keep it from splitting further, to protect its existence into the future. Restoration would be the act of making the book look and appear like it is new again. Color touch is never to conserve.

[mschmidt]

CGC would put it in a purple holder as a restored book, as they only acknowledge "conservation" when it's professionally done (and that would be the label with the purple stripe). I would imagine that's why the book was subbed to CBCS in the first place.

 

:thumbsup:

[VintageComics]

CGC still has a purple label.

 

OK, I'll be honest, I genuinely didn't know that. Forgive me.

 

As for conservation, the article announcing it says conservation must be professionally done. This means that CGC would give this book a purple label for "amateur conservation".

 

OK, so this is a disagreement over what service the two different companies provide rather than what the seller did, I think.

 

Whether it was his intention to deceive or not is another thing entirely.

 

So CGC's definition of 'conservation' is when it's professionally done - meaning when Kenny adds a piece to the book for CCS.

 

If it's done with non-archival glue it's not considered conservation and it's considered....restoration I suppose?

 

Again, the buyer must have known a piece was added and a tear seal was repaired because it was on the label and in the listing. As far as I'm concerned, that's enough disclosure for a legitimate sale.

 

Remember, 15 years ago people were saying that CGC holders in general were going to prevent people from knowing what they're buying and look at us now.

 

Anyhow, I just offered my perspective. You guys are free to disagree. (thumbs u

[mschmidt]

But the purple label is no longer being used even if it was in effect for 13 years. Things changed.

 

Now it's a blue label with a purple stripe.

 

I genuinely don't get the reaction you guys are having but then as I said previously, I've long thought that all books should be in the same colored label and words should be used to convey what was done to the book, Voldemart or not.

 

 

The purple label is still being used for Restored books, Roy - what's changed is that CGC now has a new blue label with a purple stripe at the top for Conserved books.

 

It's not like the Voldemort company is even consistent about these things - they have a different label color for a signed & witnessed book, another for the books "authenticated" by the company nobody's heard of, and yet, for the books where it makes the most sense to actually point out that the book has had resto work done, they give them a universal label and put the resto notation where it blends in with the rest of the label text. A scammer's dream come true :doh:

[VintageComics]

The purple label is still being used for Restored books, Roy - what's changed is that CGC now has a new blue label with a purple stripe at the top for Conserved books.

 

It's not like the Voldemort company is even consistent about these things - they have a different label color for a signed & witnessed book, another for the books "authenticated" by the company nobody's heard of, and yet, for the books where it makes the most sense to actually point out that the book has had resto work done, they give them a universal label and put the resto notation where it blends in with the rest of the label text. A scammer's dream come true :doh:

 

I already stated above that I was mixed up.

 

I do agree and have stated already in the past that I was not a fan of the text on the CBCS labels. (thumbs u

 

 

[gadzukes]

I don't think the actual selling price was ever posted here.

 

It sold for $8000.

 

Also, it seems like I've been reading in the posts here that a piece was added. no piece was added. The label says "Corner reinforced on back cover. Tear seal to back cover"

 

The seller went out of his way to give extra info on the "conservation" saying, "1/4" corner reinforcement and 2" tear seal, both are to the back cover."

 

When I started reading the posts here about this auction I thought it was a deceptive sale, but now looking at the auction description.... Because the seller gave "extra" clarity by saying the exact dimensions of the tear seals, I don't think the seller was trying to deceive at all.

 

Do the terms "reinforced" and "tear seals" always mean glue? Or could that be tape too?

 

I'm thinking if the glue or tape can be removed (which is not unreasonable to think), this would grade out as a 3.0-4.0 Blue Label CGC Hulk 1. Which, looking at GPA, puts it's value in the $8700 to $16,500 range.

 

I think the buyer knew what he/she was doing.

 

i wish I would have seen this auction... After doing the research, I might have made an offer myself.

[gadzukes]

I hope the Voldemort labels keep evolving. I sent an order to them (just to try them out) and I have to say, I'm not super thrilled. I personally don't love the labels. I also thought the service was going to be much faster than CGC, but it wasn't at all. VERY slow. I will say that the grading seemed very tight on what I got back (no gift grades), so I have no hesitations when I buy the Voldemort books on ebay. In fact, they seem to sell for slightly less than CGC so I feel like I'm getting a discount. Maybe the strategy right now is to buy a Voldemort label at a discount, crack it open and submit to CGC.

[VintageComics]

I'm thinking if the glue or tape can be removed (which is not unreasonable to think), this would grade out as a 3.0-4.0 Blue Label CGC Hulk 1. Which, looking at GPA, puts it's value in the $8700 to $16,500 range.

 

I think the book actually sold on the cheap side for what it actually is based on what we know.

 

 

[gadzukes]

I'm thinking if the glue or tape can be removed (which is not unreasonable to think), this would grade out as a 3.0-4.0 Blue Label CGC Hulk 1. Which, looking at GPA, puts it's value in the $8700 to $16,500 range.

 

I think the book actually sold on the cheap side for what it actually is based on what we know.

 

 

Yes, exactly +1 I think the seller & buyer both knew what they were doing. The seller wouldn't have put the extra info if he was trying to deceive, and the buyer is probably thinking "tape removal" and "resubmit to CGC"

[VintageComics]

If it's reinforced it's likely archival tape, which can easily be removed.

 

I'm just not one of those people to think the sky is falling when something happens and it was pretty clear to me based on the way the transaction was handled (someone didn't hit the BIN and the book was priced in the range of what an unrestored 3.0 would go for) that both had a good idea of what they were doing.

[RockyMullins]

I don't think I ever posted this in here, but please put me in the club! I've had this book for over 10 years or so, and don't plan to ever let it go.

 

 

Do you guys think I should restore this guy...it is pretty beat up? How much would it be, ballpark?

[drbanner]

A lot of folks have been clamoring for a single label to be used for all books, and then to include notes on the label itself about what has been done to the book (and better yet, to also include notes on the books' defects). A lot of other folks don't like change.

 

CGC would probably move towards a single label color/type, except that now they're married to the colored label system and charging $$ for grader's notes, so those will never go away. But, the new "Conserved" label allows them all kinds of flexibility with how they label books manipulated through their in-house pressing, conservation, cleaning, and restoration service so it's a new world out there folks!

 

Competition is a good thing in any marketplace. (thumbs u

[drbanner]

I don't think I ever posted this in here, but please put me in the club! I've had this book for over 10 years or so, and don't plan to ever let it go.

 

 

Do you guys think I should restore this guy...it is pretty beat up? How much would it be, ballpark?

I wouldn't get it restored, but I would definitely send it to CGC to press it and straighten it out before grading it. CGC presses books in-house now before grading them, so it's one stop shopping and the book will look a lot better aesthetically without that gnarly spine roll. (thumbs u

[Dick Pontoon]

That spine already looks pretty rough. The spine roll may not be able to be fixed without risk of further damage. I'd recommend consulting with an expert before doing anything with it.

[gadzukes]

I don't think I ever posted this in here, but please put me in the club! I've had this book for over 10 years or so, and don't plan to ever let it go.

 

 

Do you guys think I should restore this guy...it is pretty beat up? How much would it be, ballpark?

I wouldn't get it restored, but I would definitely send it to CGC to press it and straighten it out before grading it. CGC presses books in-house now before grading them, so it's one stop shopping and the book will look a lot better aesthetically without that gnarly spine roll. (thumbs u

 

As many flaws at this has, it's still a sweet book.

Definitely have the spine roll taken out of it and flatten out some of those flaps that are folded over.

[RockyMullins]

I don't think I ever posted this in here, but please put me in the club! I've had this book for over 10 years or so, and don't plan to ever let it go.

 

 

Do you guys think I should restore this guy...it is pretty beat up? How much would it be, ballpark?

I wouldn't get it restored, but I would definitely send it to CGC to press it and straighten it out before grading it. CGC presses books in-house now before grading them, so it's one stop shopping and the book will look a lot better aesthetically without that gnarly spine roll. (thumbs u

 

I like that thought...I don't own any CGC books, as I like to hold them, but been wondering about a grade on this one for some time...and I can always crack it after!

[Jaydogrules]

If it's reinforced it's likely archival tape, which can easily be removed.

 

I'm just not one of those people to think the sky is falling when something happens and it was pretty clear to me based on the way the transaction was handled (someone didn't hit the BIN and the book was priced in the range of what an unrestored 3.0 would go for) that both had a good idea of what they were doing.

 

This is highly unlikely. Highly. If it was just "tape and glue" that would have (should have) been noted on the label.

 

Restoring a comic book by "reinforcing" it generally involves adding foreign material to the book. Not just taping it with tape that can easily be removed.

 

If that's all it would have taken the seller would not have sent it to CBCS to take advantage of their loose labeling and restoration disclosure and would have simply un-restored the book himself and gotten the book in a proper blue label holder.

 

The far likelier scenario is that the book would have been completely mangled by attempting to undo the amateur restoration that was done to it, possibly dropping the book all the way down to a 1.5 or 1.8.

 

Anyone who thinks this restored book for $8000 was a "deal" is dreaming. As I said earlier, another professionally (slight) restored hulk 1, 5.0 just went for $4700 barely two months ago.

 

Whomever was conned into buying this book with its seemingly blue label and an "embellishing" seller overpaid by AT LEAST 3 grand.

 

Mschmidt's point about this other company's labeling system is well taken- they colour code a label to let you know when they have "verified" a dead guy's signature, but they think a book that has been monkeyed with belongs in a blue label holder like an original book, but just with a few "notes" in fine print, that, in fact, state the book is restored. And some people think this is better? Better for who?

 

-J.

[Iceman399]

I am glad no one decided to educate themselves and make predictions as to what the restoration/conservation was. I mean its not like everyone doesn't know that "THEY" give free graders notes. So here it is so we can stop making hypothetical of how the seller duped the buyer:

 

general cover wear

 

small staining center front cover-see interior

 

2/3" corner crease reinforced with glue bottom left back cover

 

lo spine stress, creases, wear breaks color

 

1" stain area bottom back cover

 

4" tear seal middle top back cover in center

 

Glue Glue Glue Glue Glue. No pieces added, no colour touch. as for CGC this would be in the same holder a CONSERVED label.

[mschmidt]

I am glad no one decided to educate themselves and make predictions as to what the restoration/conservation was. I mean its not like everyone doesn't know that "THEY" give free graders notes. So here it is so we can stop making hypothetical of how the seller duped the buyer:

 

general cover wear

 

small staining center front cover-see interior

 

2/3" corner crease reinforced with glue bottom left back cover

 

lo spine stress, creases, wear breaks color

 

1" stain area bottom back cover

 

4" tear seal middle top back cover in center

 

Glue Glue Glue Glue Glue. No pieces added, no colour touch. as for CGC this would be in the same holder a CONSERVED label.

 

No, it would not. As has been mentioned several times already, the book has had amateur resto work done - CGC's conserved label is only for professional work.