HULK #1 CLUB : THE PUNY LITTLE MAN LEAGUE

[mysterio]

I am glad no one decided to educate themselves and make predictions as to what the restoration/conservation was. I mean its not like everyone doesn't know that "THEY" give free graders notes. So here it is so we can stop making hypothetical of how the seller duped the buyer:

 

general cover wear

 

small staining center front cover-see interior

 

2/3" corner crease reinforced with glue bottom left back cover

 

lo spine stress, creases, wear breaks color

 

1" stain area bottom back cover

 

4" tear seal middle top back cover in center

 

Glue Glue Glue Glue Glue. No pieces added, no colour touch. as for CGC this would be in the same holder a CONSERVED label.

 

It doesn't say what the tear was sealed with, so that part is still unclear. Also, the addition of glue to the book may or may not be conservation or restoration. That doesn't seem cut and dried either. Whichever way you look at it, conservation has to be done by a professional, per CGC's statement, so that book would still be in a purple CGC label as the CBCS label itself says "amateur".

[Iceman399]

I am glad no one decided to educate themselves and make predictions as to what the restoration/conservation was. I mean its not like everyone doesn't know that "THEY" give free graders notes. So here it is so we can stop making hypothetical of how the seller duped the buyer:

 

general cover wear

 

small staining center front cover-see interior

 

2/3" corner crease reinforced with glue bottom left back cover

 

lo spine stress, creases, wear breaks color

 

1" stain area bottom back cover

 

4" tear seal middle top back cover in center

 

Glue Glue Glue Glue Glue. No pieces added, no colour touch. as for CGC this would be in the same holder a CONSERVED label.

 

No, it would not. As has been mentioned several times already, the book has had amateur resto work done - CGC's conserved label is only for professional work.

 

I must be missing where CGC says that on their label designations:

 

Conserved (blue/purple)

 

This label is applied to any comic book with specific repairs done to improve the structural integrity and long-term preservation. These repairs include tear seals, support, staple replacement, piece reattachment and certain kinds of cleaning.

[mysterio]

I am glad no one decided to educate themselves and make predictions as to what the restoration/conservation was. I mean its not like everyone doesn't know that "THEY" give free graders notes. So here it is so we can stop making hypothetical of how the seller duped the buyer:

 

general cover wear

 

small staining center front cover-see interior

 

2/3" corner crease reinforced with glue bottom left back cover

 

lo spine stress, creases, wear breaks color

 

1" stain area bottom back cover

 

4" tear seal middle top back cover in center

 

Glue Glue Glue Glue Glue. No pieces added, no colour touch. as for CGC this would be in the same holder a CONSERVED label.

 

No, it would not. As has been mentioned several times already, the book has had amateur resto work done - CGC's conserved label is only for professional work.

 

I must be missing where CGC says that on their label designations:

 

Conserved (blue/purple)

 

This label is applied to any comic book with specific repairs done to improve the structural integrity and long-term preservation. These repairs include tear seals, support, staple replacement, piece reattachment and certain kinds of cleaning.

 

If you keep reading, it says "Because all conservation repairs must be professionally done and slight in nature (A-1), the label will simply say “Conservation” with no designation of quality or quantity on the label." This is why there is no professional or amateur noted on conservation, because there is no option in this case.

 

Link

[Iceman399]

Anyone who thinks this restored book for $8000 was a "deal" is dreaming. As I said earlier, another professionally (slight) restored hulk 1, 5.0 just went for $4700 barely two months ago.

 

 

-J.

 

Trimmed + Colour Touch + Staples Cleaned =/= glued piece

[Iceman399]

I am glad no one decided to educate themselves and make predictions as to what the restoration/conservation was. I mean its not like everyone doesn't know that "THEY" give free graders notes. So here it is so we can stop making hypothetical of how the seller duped the buyer:

 

general cover wear

 

small staining center front cover-see interior

 

2/3" corner crease reinforced with glue bottom left back cover

 

lo spine stress, creases, wear breaks color

 

1" stain area bottom back cover

 

4" tear seal middle top back cover in center

 

Glue Glue Glue Glue Glue. No pieces added, no colour touch. as for CGC this would be in the same holder a CONSERVED label.

 

No, it would not. As has been mentioned several times already, the book has had amateur resto work done - CGC's conserved label is only for professional work.

 

I must be missing where CGC says that on their label designations:

 

Conserved (blue/purple)

 

This label is applied to any comic book with specific repairs done to improve the structural integrity and long-term preservation. These repairs include tear seals, support, staple replacement, piece reattachment and certain kinds of cleaning.

 

If you keep reading, it says "Because all conservation repairs must be professionally done and slight in nature (A-1), the label will simply say “Conservation” with no designation of quality or quantity on the label." This is why there is no professional or amateur noted on conservation, because there is no option in this case.

 

Link

 

(thumbs u

 

Silly they have to link through several articles to get the full explanation and if you aren't aware of that one article good luck finding it.

[gadzukes]

I am glad no one decided to educate themselves and make predictions as to what the restoration/conservation was. I mean its not like everyone doesn't know that "THEY" give free graders notes. So here it is so we can stop making hypothetical of how the seller duped the buyer:

 

general cover wear

 

small staining center front cover-see interior

 

2/3" corner crease reinforced with glue bottom left back cover

 

lo spine stress, creases, wear breaks color

 

1" stain area bottom back cover

 

4" tear seal middle top back cover in center

 

Glue Glue Glue Glue Glue. No pieces added, no colour touch. as for CGC this would be in the same holder a CONSERVED label.

 

So these notes would constitute the first actual lying being shown by the seller. The seller said 1/4" corner crease & 2" tear seal. These notes are quite a difference between what the seller said.

 

But, I still think this comic is worth $8000 in today's market.

 

BTW, very cool about the free graders notes.

[Jaydogrules]

I am glad no one decided to educate themselves and make predictions as to what the restoration/conservation was. I mean its not like everyone doesn't know that "THEY" give free graders notes. So here it is so we can stop making hypothetical of how the seller duped the buyer:

 

general cover wear

 

small staining center front cover-see interior

 

2/3" corner crease reinforced with glue bottom left back cover

 

lo spine stress, creases, wear breaks color

 

1" stain area bottom back cover

 

4" tear seal middle top back cover in center

 

Glue Glue Glue Glue Glue. No pieces added, no colour touch. as for CGC this would be in the same holder a CONSERVED label.

 

So these notes would constitute the first actual lying being shown by the seller. The seller said 1/4" corner crease & 2" tear seal. These notes are quite a difference between what the seller said.

 

But, I still think this comic is worth $8000 in today's market.

 

BTW, very cool about the free graders notes.

 

I will have to respectfully disagree with you gadzukes. Even on a good day that 5.0 with proper restoration labeling and disclosure would have been a $5k book MAX. You can easily see how terrible the "tear seals" are on the back of the book. That could not be undone without destroying the back cover. And that is not even taking into account what kind of hacking would have to be done to get rid of all the glue. That book would be a 1.5, maaaaaaybe 1.8 on a good day.

 

The buyer overpaid egregiously.

 

-J.

[gadzukes]

I am glad no one decided to educate themselves and make predictions as to what the restoration/conservation was. I mean its not like everyone doesn't know that "THEY" give free graders notes. So here it is so we can stop making hypothetical of how the seller duped the buyer:

 

general cover wear

 

small staining center front cover-see interior

 

2/3" corner crease reinforced with glue bottom left back cover

 

lo spine stress, creases, wear breaks color

 

1" stain area bottom back cover

 

4" tear seal middle top back cover in center

 

Glue Glue Glue Glue Glue. No pieces added, no colour touch. as for CGC this would be in the same holder a CONSERVED label.

 

So these notes would constitute the first actual lying being shown by the seller. The seller said 1/4" corner crease & 2" tear seal. These notes are quite a difference between what the seller said.

 

But, I still think this comic is worth $8000 in today's market.

 

BTW, very cool about the free graders notes.

 

I will have to respectfully disagree with you gadzukes. Even on a good day that 5.0 with proper restoration labeling and disclosure would have been a $5k book MAX. You can easily see how terrible the "tear seals" are on the back of the book. That could not be undone without destroying the back cover. And that is not even taking into account what kind of hacking would have to be done to get rid of all the glue. That book would be a 1.5, maaaaaaybe 1.8 on a good day.

 

The buyer overpaid egregiously.

 

-J.

 

Jaydog this FF 1 just came back from CGC as a Blue Label 3.0. Would you say this CT scrape on the "front" cover which runs almost the entire length of the comic is comparable to the damage on the "back" of the Hulk 1. The front of that Hulk 1 has no glue or tape whatsoever and it looks really nice to me. Sure, once you try to remove the tape or glue from the back cover it'll do some damage, but I think it could easily stay at the 3.0 because of how nice the front cover is. Visually, with that nice front cover... I think $8000 was an ok price for that comic.

 

It's just my opinion, and it's ok if we disagree, but I'm sure there are some boardies who would agree with both of us on this. Who knows, it might even be a 50/50 split.

[mysterio]

That FF #1 makes me want to cry.

[VintageComics]

I am glad no one decided to educate themselves and make predictions as to what the restoration/conservation was. I mean its not like everyone doesn't know that "THEY" give free graders notes. So here it is so we can stop making hypothetical of how the seller duped the buyer:

 

general cover wear

 

small staining center front cover-see interior

 

2/3" corner crease reinforced with glue bottom left back cover

 

lo spine stress, creases, wear breaks color

 

1" stain area bottom back cover

 

4" tear seal middle top back cover in center

 

Glue Glue Glue Glue Glue. No pieces added, no colour touch. as for CGC this would be in the same holder a CONSERVED label.

 

So these notes would constitute the first actual lying being shown by the seller. The seller said 1/4" corner crease & 2" tear seal. These notes are quite a difference between what the seller said.

 

But, I still think this comic is worth $8000 in today's market.

 

BTW, very cool about the free graders notes.

 

I will have to respectfully disagree with you gadzukes. Even on a good day that 5.0 with proper restoration labeling and disclosure would have been a $5k book MAX. You can easily see how terrible the "tear seals" are on the back of the book. That could not be undone without destroying the back cover. And that is not even taking into account what kind of hacking would have to be done to get rid of all the glue. That book would be a 1.5, maaaaaaybe 1.8 on a good day.

 

The buyer overpaid egregiously.

 

-J.

 

You're extremely opinionated and argumentative, and I've noticed that from other threads but you rarely back down, even if you're wrong.

 

So a 4" tear would make the book a 1.5 or a 1.8?

 

You could split the cover down the entire spine and the book would grade a 1.5 or a 1.8 if it was in 3 pieces.

 

Bottom line? Since nobody has this book in hand it's all just empty talk.

 

I do agree that based on the notes, that the seller misrepresented the book (ie. 4" vs 2" tear seal description) but again if I were in the market for a such a book I generally pay little attention to what a seller says and do my own research.

 

Good job on getting the notes, whoever got them - I was too darn lazy to do it.

[Jaydogrules]

I am glad no one decided to educate themselves and make predictions as to what the restoration/conservation was. I mean its not like everyone doesn't know that "THEY" give free graders notes. So here it is so we can stop making hypothetical of how the seller duped the buyer:

 

general cover wear

 

small staining center front cover-see interior

 

2/3" corner crease reinforced with glue bottom left back cover

 

lo spine stress, creases, wear breaks color

 

1" stain area bottom back cover

 

4" tear seal middle top back cover in center

 

Glue Glue Glue Glue Glue. No pieces added, no colour touch. as for CGC this would be in the same holder a CONSERVED label.

 

So these notes would constitute the first actual lying being shown by the seller. The seller said 1/4" corner crease & 2" tear seal. These notes are quite a difference between what the seller said.

 

But, I still think this comic is worth $8000 in today's market.

 

BTW, very cool about the free graders notes.

 

I will have to respectfully disagree with you gadzukes. Even on a good day that 5.0 with proper restoration labeling and disclosure would have been a $5k book MAX. You can easily see how terrible the "tear seals" are on the back of the book. That could not be undone without destroying the back cover. And that is not even taking into account what kind of hacking would have to be done to get rid of all the glue. That book would be a 1.5, maaaaaaybe 1.8 on a good day.

 

The buyer overpaid egregiously.

 

-J.

 

You're extremely opinionated and argumentative, and I've noticed that from other threads but you rarely back down, even if you're wrong.

 

So a 4" tear would make the book a 1.5 or a 1.8?

 

You could split the cover down the entire spine and the book would grade a 1.5 or a 1.8 if it was in 3 pieces.

 

Bottom line? Since nobody has this book in hand it's all just empty talk.

 

I do agree that based on the notes, that the seller misrepresented the book (ie. 4" vs 2" tear seal description) but again if I were in the market for a such a book I generally pay little attention to what a seller says and do my own research.

 

Good job on getting the notes, whoever got them - I was too darn lazy to do it.

 

Tell me what I'm "wrong" about and I'll acknowledge it. And you find me "argumentative" and "opinionated" on a message board ? Go figure. Welcome to the Internet. I would say if anything you have the minority opinion here.

 

As far as this hulk 1 is concerned, it's readily apparent just by looking at the back cover that it would likely be decimated to try to undo that horrible "tear seal" job. Scraping off colour touch is one thing. Tearing up the back cover and chopping off glue on the spine is another.

 

This book was not bought for its "potential". It was bought as a restored book. And in its current state it is certainly not an $8,000 book. Per recent comps, on a good day and with proper restoration labeling and disclosure, it's about a $5k book. With a mangled, perhaps even with half the back cover essentially removed it would "at best" be a 1.8. And that's only because the front cover looks decent.

 

-J.

[VintageComics]

Tell me what I'm "wrong" about and I'll acknowledge it. And you find me "argumentative" and "opinionated" on a message board ? Go figure. Welcome to the Internet. I would say if anything you have the minority opinion here.

 

As far as this hulk 1 is concerned, it's readily apparent just by looking at the back cover that it would likely be decimated to try to undo that horrible "tear seal" job. Scraping off colour touch is one thing. Tearing up the back cover and chopping off glue on the spine is another.

 

This book was not bought for its "potential". It was bought as a restored book. And in its current state it is certainly not an $8,000 book. Per recent comps, on a good day and with proper restoration labeling and disclosure, it's about a $5k book. With a mangled, perhaps even with half the back cover essentially removed it would "at best" be a 1.8. And that's only because the front cover looks decent.

 

-J.

 

You're exaggerating again by using words like 'decimated', chopping ,mangled, etc. which do nothing to further the discussion.

 

I have no idea how you can tell the condition of the back cover from one lousy back cover photo but from what I can see, if you remove that piece in the center of the cover and split open a 4 inch tear, you still have a book that is going to grade at least a 2.5 IMO, making it a $7500 book. If it grades a 3.0 it's roughly a $9000 book - both grades would offer excellent front cover eye appeal and a 3.0 is a very possible grade. I've seen worse looking 3.0 books.

 

And you are making assumptions about why the buyer purchased the book - speculation at best.

 

If I was in the market for an $8000 copy of Hulk, from what I've seen so far, there are worse copies out there.

 

I will give you that the seller was misleading if he misstated the size of the defects, but even then this doesn't look like a terrible purchase. But what do I know?

[Jaydogrules]

Tell me what I'm "wrong" about and I'll acknowledge it. And you find me "argumentative" and "opinionated" on a message board ? Go figure. Welcome to the Internet. I would say if anything you have the minority opinion here.

 

As far as this hulk 1 is concerned, it's readily apparent just by looking at the back cover that it would likely be decimated to try to undo that horrible "tear seal" job. Scraping off colour touch is one thing. Tearing up the back cover and chopping off glue on the spine is another.

 

This book was not bought for its "potential". It was bought as a restored book. And in its current state it is certainly not an $8,000 book. Per recent comps, on a good day and with proper restoration labeling and disclosure, it's about a $5k book. With a mangled, perhaps even with half the back cover essentially removed it would "at best" be a 1.8. And that's only because the front cover looks decent.

 

-J.

 

You're exaggerating again by using words like 'decimated', chopping ,mangled, etc. which do nothing to further the discussion.

 

I have no idea how you can tell the condition of the back cover from one lousy back cover photo but from what I can see, if you remove that piece in the center of the cover and split open a 4 inch tear, you still have a book that is going to grade at least a 2.5 IMO, making it a $7500 book. If it grades a 3.0 it's roughly a $9000 book - both grades would offer excellent front cover eye appeal and a 3.0 is a very possible grade. I've seen worse looking 3.0 books.

 

And you are making assumptions about why the buyer purchased the book - speculation at best.

 

If I was in the market for an $8000 copy of Hulk, from what I've seen so far, there are worse copies out there.

 

I will give you that the seller was misleading if he misstated the size of the defects, but even then this doesn't look like a terrible purchase. But what do I know?

 

I don't disagree with you in theory. However I do not believe that book can be un-restored. Amateur resto is tough to un-do, and you would have to literally cut away large pieces of that book to remove all of the foreign material to try to get it into a blue label. That alone would turn off many buyers, because it would be obvious what had been done to it, and that the book has been repeatedly messed with.

 

That's why I say as is (a badly restored book) it is about a $5k book. Maybe. If someone is "hoping" to do something else to this book just to maaaaybe break even, they are likely in for a big disappointment. My 2 cents.

 

-J.

[porcupine48]

What a headache...

[Junkdrawer]

Tell me what I'm "wrong" about and I'll acknowledge it. And you find me "argumentative" and "opinionated" on a message board ? Go figure. Welcome to the Internet. I would say if anything you have the minority opinion here.

 

As far as this hulk 1 is concerned, it's readily apparent just by looking at the back cover that it would likely be decimated to try to undo that horrible "tear seal" job. Scraping off colour touch is one thing. Tearing up the back cover and chopping off glue on the spine is another.

 

This book was not bought for its "potential". It was bought as a restored book. And in its current state it is certainly not an $8,000 book. Per recent comps, on a good day and with proper restoration labeling and disclosure, it's about a $5k book. With a mangled, perhaps even with half the back cover essentially removed it would "at best" be a 1.8. And that's only because the front cover looks decent.

 

-J.

 

You're exaggerating again by using words like 'decimated', chopping ,mangled, etc. which do nothing to further the discussion.

 

I have no idea how you can tell the condition of the back cover from one lousy back cover photo but from what I can see, if you remove that piece in the center of the cover and split open a 4 inch tear, you still have a book that is going to grade at least a 2.5 IMO, making it a $7500 book. If it grades a 3.0 it's roughly a $9000 book - both grades would offer excellent front cover eye appeal and a 3.0 is a very possible grade. I've seen worse looking 3.0 books.

 

And you are making assumptions about why the buyer purchased the book - speculation at best.

 

If I was in the market for an $8000 copy of Hulk, from what I've seen so far, there are worse copies out there.

 

I will give you that the seller was misleading if he misstated the size of the defects, but even then this doesn't look like a terrible purchase. But what do I know?

 

I don't disagree with you in theory. However I do not believe that book can be un-restored. Amateur resto is tough to un-do, and you would have to literally cut away large pieces of that book to remove all of the foreign material to try to get it into a blue label. That alone would turn off many buyers, because it would be obvious what had been done to it, and that the book has been repeatedly messed with.

 

That's why I say as is (a badly restored book) it is about a $5k book. Maybe. If someone is "hoping" to do something else to this book just to maaaaybe break even, they are likely in for a big disappointment. My 2 cents.

 

-J.

Again, amateur resto isn't about the quality of work but more do the materials used. A professional could have done the work and the tear seals are likely of a material that got it the amateur notation. Having unrestored far worse to universal, I think this Hulk 1 is certainly doable. I agree with Roy and it is a possible 3.0 with eye appeal. Totally split and detached cover it could still get a 2.0. I just think it's better than that

[Jaydogrules]

Tell me what I'm "wrong" about and I'll acknowledge it. And you find me "argumentative" and "opinionated" on a message board ? Go figure. Welcome to the Internet. I would say if anything you have the minority opinion here.

 

As far as this hulk 1 is concerned, it's readily apparent just by looking at the back cover that it would likely be decimated to try to undo that horrible "tear seal" job. Scraping off colour touch is one thing. Tearing up the back cover and chopping off glue on the spine is another.

 

This book was not bought for its "potential". It was bought as a restored book. And in its current state it is certainly not an $8,000 book. Per recent comps, on a good day and with proper restoration labeling and disclosure, it's about a $5k book. With a mangled, perhaps even with half the back cover essentially removed it would "at best" be a 1.8. And that's only because the front cover looks decent.

 

-J.

 

You're exaggerating again by using words like 'decimated', chopping ,mangled, etc. which do nothing to further the discussion.

 

I have no idea how you can tell the condition of the back cover from one lousy back cover photo but from what I can see, if you remove that piece in the center of the cover and split open a 4 inch tear, you still have a book that is going to grade at least a 2.5 IMO, making it a $7500 book. If it grades a 3.0 it's roughly a $9000 book - both grades would offer excellent front cover eye appeal and a 3.0 is a very possible grade. I've seen worse looking 3.0 books.

 

And you are making assumptions about why the buyer purchased the book - speculation at best.

 

If I was in the market for an $8000 copy of Hulk, from what I've seen so far, there are worse copies out there.

 

I will give you that the seller was misleading if he misstated the size of the defects, but even then this doesn't look like a terrible purchase. But what do I know?

 

I don't disagree with you in theory. However I do not believe that book can be un-restored. Amateur resto is tough to un-do, and you would have to literally cut away large pieces of that book to remove all of the foreign material to try to get it into a blue label. That alone would turn off many buyers, because it would be obvious what had been done to it, and that the book has been repeatedly messed with.

 

That's why I say as is (a badly restored book) it is about a $5k book. Maybe. If someone is "hoping" to do something else to this book just to maaaaybe break even, they are likely in for a big disappointment. My 2 cents.

 

-J.

Again, amateur resto isn't about the quality of work but more do the materials used. A professional could have done the work and the tear seals are likely of a material that got it the amateur notation. Having unrestored far worse to universal, I think this Hulk 1 is certainly doable. I agree with Roy and it is a possible 3.0 with eye appeal. Totally split and detached cover it could still get a 2.0. I just think it's better than that

 

And this is why I disagree.

 

http://www.ebay.com/itm/like/311261881442?rmvSB=true

 

That's about how much of the back cover would have to be completely cut away to get rid of that junk that was done to it.

 

The fact that it would be on the back cover is why I would give it a 1.8. Maybe.

 

And if the book could have been so easily un-restored, I am pretty sure the seller (especially THIS seller) would have simply done that and gotten himself a "$13,000" blue label book, instead of sending it to CBCS for the sole and obvious purpose of getting it into a holder with very favourable restoration disclosure (favourable for him, that is).

 

-J.

 

[gadzukes]

I wish the winner was a boardie so we could see what he's going to do with it, and possibly see the outcome.

 

[VintageComics]

What a headache...

 

Only if you don't know what you're doing.

 

Personally I think the buyer paid a fair price, but then my cup is half full.

[porcupine48]

What a headache...

 

Only if you don't know what you're doing.

 

Personally I think the buyer paid a fair price, but then my cup is half full.

I'm a half full fellow myself.I think as long as the buyer is happy,we all should be.

[MasterChief]

I am glad no one decided to educate themselves and make predictions as to what the restoration/conservation was. I mean its not like everyone doesn't know that "THEY" give free graders notes. So here it is so we can stop making hypothetical of how the seller duped the buyer:

 

general cover wear

 

small staining center front cover-see interior

 

2/3" corner crease reinforced with glue bottom left back cover

 

lo spine stress, creases, wear breaks color

 

1" stain area bottom back cover

 

4" tear seal middle top back cover in center

 

Glue Glue Glue Glue Glue. No pieces added, no colour touch. as for CGC this would be in the same holder a CONSERVED label.

 

So these notes would constitute the first actual lying being shown by the seller. The seller said 1/4" corner crease & 2" tear seal. These notes are quite a difference between what the seller said.

 

But, I still think this comic is worth $8000 in today's market.

 

BTW, very cool about the free graders notes.

 

I will have to respectfully disagree with you gadzukes. Even on a good day that 5.0 with proper restoration labeling and disclosure would have been a $5k book MAX. You can easily see how terrible the "tear seals" are on the back of the book. That could not be undone without destroying the back cover. And that is not even taking into account what kind of hacking would have to be done to get rid of all the glue. That book would be a 1.5, maaaaaaybe 1.8 on a good day.

 

The buyer overpaid egregiously.

 

-J.

 

You're extremely opinionated and argumentative, and I've noticed that from other threads but you rarely back down, even if you're wrong.

 

Come on, Roy. Stop trying to undermine his credibility by attacking his character.

 

His comments are not extreme by any means.

 

Nor are they "emotional" (another of the cards you play when the debate's not going your way).

 

It's a good discussion thus far. So let's not derail it with ad hominem.

 

Thanks!