State of the Market Going into 2015

[J.Sid]

Todd's Hulk run has been gaining over the last year.

[AKA Rick]

Todd's Hulk run has been gaining over the last year.

 

I think anything Todd McFarlane is going up, even his old "Infinity Inc." pages which used to easily be had for under $300 and even in the $100-150 range, are commanding bigger dollars. I think fans just want something, anything by him, even if his original style doesn't resemble the style that he developed/evolved later.

 

I think it's similar to how the 1970's Jack Kirby stuff has gained value over the course of the years, where before there was a bigger focus only on the 1960's material, and most of his 1970's work could be had for under $1k, just less than half a decade ago.

[Mephisto]

Man you guys are old

[jjonahjameson1]

Todd's Hulk run has been gaining over the last year.

 

I think anything Todd McFarlane is going up, even his old "Infinity Inc." pages which used to easily be had for under $300 and even in the $100-150 range, are commanding bigger dollars. I think fans just want something, anything by him, even if his original style doesn't resemble the style that he developed/evolved later.

 

I think it's similar to how the 1970's Jack Kirby stuff has gained value over the course of the years, where before there was a bigger focus only on the 1960's material, and most of his 1970's work could be had for under $1k, just less than half a decade ago.

 

I've noticed that, too. You also get more art with Todd's Infinity Inc. pages as they are larger size...I think 13x19 or 13x20, something like that.

[Rodey]

Just in my world of New Warriors collecting, I've seen a steady climb upwards from Mark Bagley's run. Some prices have doubled. There's been a little climb other New Warriors art, at least from the 90's.

 

(I know my world is just a tiny part and may not reflect anything.)

[Ronan Killack]

I expect a flat 2015 in our 'market'. Not to draw too many comparisons to actual financial markets, but our 'market' has been buttressed by a generally strong financial market, almost free money and tons of liquidity. That usually speaks to momentum driven markets - and I certainly think ours falls into that category over the last few years. I've been crash-testig my collection over the last two years - and have been making sure to both re-assess my collecting strategy more frequently and to stick to that strategy. It's safe to say that I plan to be that much more disciplined in 2015. Some will point to the extreme price points our market continues to achieve - both publicly and privately - in 2014 as further evidence of both future growth and stability. Those data points are the ones that make me nervous...

[suspense39]

I reall have no idea where it's headed, only the auction houses and some dealers have enough data to really make an educated guess

[zhamlau]

Really fascinating reads. I think on some level we all agree when pages stopped being lettered (and eventually penciled/inked separately) is going to be the main break in comic art. Everything that came before it, was the same process essentially. Penciller lays it out, inker establishes it, and letter completed the process to give us the same basic pages we have seen from the 30's til around 1996. All pages are basically the same, just the size and content changed. I think eventually all art will be lumped up in that regard. This was the basic sets of original art as i see it.

 

Analog

1. Platinum 1930-1938

2. Golden 1938-1950

3. Horror/Transition 1950-1956

3. Silver 1956-1970

4. Bronze 1970-1985

5. Copper 1986-1991

6. Chromium/Foil 1991-1996

 

Digital

1. 1996-2007 (penciled/inked still but not lettered)

2. 2007-present ( potentially penciled/inked/lettered separately)

 

I really think if you want to track how art prices move, you have to really be clear about what era and tier of piece you are referring to. I believe stuff from the "digital" era really wont climb as much as "analog" material and just wont ever hit the heights. There can of course be exceptions, Walking Dead or Jim Lee/Alex Ross material. But outside of highlights the fact that fundamentally the art process and pages themselves being different animals entirely I think will cut off most collectors. Therefore prices just will have a harder time upswinging.

 

Conversely I think copper and "chromium/foil" stuff will start catching up with the rest of that era because its basically still the same material, just done in a different year. That's where I see the market prices jumping greatly.

 

Oh well, rambling again.

[delekkerste]

Unlike many here, I actually do still read some new comics and enjoy them. That said, aside from the Walking Dead, I have almost zero interest in collecting OA from the digital age. Between decompressed storytelling, no word balloons and covers which are often stock poses and have little/nothing to do with the interiors, these pieces simply do not stand up very well on their own. I think TWD art has been an exception, though, as the storylines have, frankly, been more memorable and have been reinforced by the TV show as well. Also, Kirkman, et. al. have built a new universe from scratch, and we've watched it unfold over the past 11 years, so you can readily identify important developments in the story and art.

 

It's harder to care about properties which have been around for 50+ years (i.e., most Marvel/DC properties). Don't get me wrong, I think there is still good writing and art, but, in the grand scheme of things, these characters are mostly very well established, so the current stories just aren't that important in furthering the characters' history and development. And, gimmicky deaths and such just seem like that - gimmicks to revive interest in characters whose best stories have already largely been told. Granted, once in a while someone like the Brubaker/Epting team will come along and tell some really great stories with really pretty art as well with an established character like Captain America. But, even then, the sparse, wordless, decompressed physical art itself just doesn't leave a lot to be desired, IMO in terms of collectibility.

[Hekla]

 

Digital

1. 1996-2007 (penciled/inked still but not lettered)

2. 2007-present ( potentially penciled/inked/lettered separately)

 

Also (more recently)

3. Digital only with a 'one-and-only' print

4. Mostly digital only with covers & splashes hand drawn

[Nexus]

Besides the reasons you list, for a lot of collectors, especially long-time established collectors, modern OA holds little interest because it has no prestige/cachet. Unless it's cheesecake, modern OA rarely gets any accolades on CAF. That's further reflected in the annual "Best Of" vote, where modern OA get buried by pricier vintage OA (unless, again, we're talking cheesecake, but that's usually in the lower profile categories like commissions and con sketches).

 

To me, if you're truly a fan of the comics medium, then you appreciate all comics. Regardless of age, genre, country of origin. Most collectors are primarily superhero comic book fans, and then, only those from a specific period (i.e. from their youth).

 

Nothing wrong with that, collect what you enjoy. But these reasons should be noted as well to get a fuller view of the landscape.

 

 

[Bronty]

Sure. People are often as impressed or more impressed by the price tag than by the art. They don't always admit it to themselves but its true.

[delekkerste]

To me, if you're truly a fan of the comics medium, then you appreciate all comics. Regardless of age, genre, country of origin. Most collectors are primarily superhero comic book fans, and then, only those from a specific period (i.e. from their youth).

 

I definitely appreciate comics from all ages and mediums. That said, I do think there is a valid distinction to be made between the physical art itself from the vintage eras and the digital age.

[Lago32]

Regarding the digital evolution in the creation of comics nowadays, I've been very curious as to how conflicted the artist's are about it. More specifically, on one hand they must love the multiple efficiencies it allows them but on the other hand I have to imagine that the potentially drastic financial hit that they would take from selling ink-over-blueline-digital-pencil "originals" would not be too appealing.

 

 

[Bronty]

Regarding the digital evolution in the creation of comics nowadays, I've been very curious as to how conflicted the artist's are about it. More specifically, on one hand they must love the multiple efficiencies it allows them but on the other hand I have to imagine that the potentially drastic financial hit that they would take from selling ink-over-blueline-digital-pencil "originals" would not be too appealing.

 

 

True but they are lucky they've had originals to sell for this long. The mainstream illustration industry hasn't produced physical art in 20 years.

[Nexus]

I expect a flat 2015 in our 'market'. Not to draw too many comparisons to actual financial markets, but our 'market' has been buttressed by a generally strong financial market, almost free money and tons of liquidity. That usually speaks to momentum driven markets - and I certainly think ours falls into that category over the last few years. I've been crash-testig my collection over the last two years - and have been making sure to both re-assess my collecting strategy more frequently and to stick to that strategy. It's safe to say that I plan to be that much more disciplined in 2015. Some will point to the extreme price points our market continues to achieve - both publicly and privately - in 2014 as further evidence of both future growth and stability. Those data points are the ones that make me nervous...

 

The question then is if a flat 2015 represents a blip or the start of a trend? Too early to say, I know...but if enough collectors believe the latter, and react accordingly, then 2015 could turn out to be a favorable buying environment.

 

For myself, I expect 2015 to be like every other year since I've been collecting: If you are selling something I want-- at a price I can live with-- I will be buying.

 

 

[vodou]

Regarding the digital evolution in the creation of comics nowadays, I've been very curious as to how conflicted the artist's are about it. More specifically, on one hand they must love the multiple efficiencies it allows them but on the other hand I have to imagine that the potentially drastic financial hit that they would take from selling ink-over-blueline-digital-pencil "originals" would not be too appealing.

 

 

True but they are lucky they've had originals to sell for this long. The mainstream illustration industry hasn't produced physical art in 20 years.

Except for Hard Case Crime. God Bless 'Em

[Hekla]

Regarding the digital evolution in the creation of comics nowadays, I've been very curious as to how conflicted the artist's are about it. More specifically, on one hand they must love the multiple efficiencies it allows them but on the other hand I have to imagine that the potentially drastic financial hit that they would take from selling ink-over-blueline-digital-pencil "originals" would not be too appealing.

 

 

I think that's why some are moving to the hybrid model so they can sell the hand drawn covers, splashes, and key panel pages while being going all digital with the typical panel page that may struggle to sell. This process has several advantages (for the artist). Nexus could probably provide more insight/detail into this practice.

[Brian Peck]

Besides the reasons you list, for a lot of collectors, especially long-time established collectors, modern OA holds little interest because it has no prestige/cachet. Unless it's cheesecake, modern OA rarely gets any accolades on CAF. That's further reflected in the annual "Best Of" vote, where modern OA get buried by pricier vintage OA (unless, again, we're talking cheesecake, but that's usually in the lower profile categories like commissions and con sketches).

 

To me, if you're truly a fan of the comics medium, then you appreciate all comics. Regardless of age, genre, country of origin. Most collectors are primarily superhero comic book fans, and then, only those from a specific period (i.e. from their youth).

 

Nothing wrong with that, collect what you enjoy. But these reasons should be noted as well to get a fuller view of the landscape.

 

 

The medium of original comic art isn't all the same. Comparing vintage oa with dialog on the art and the modern without the art are totally different animals. I collect comic art for the story so the modern OA has little appeal for me outside of the artistic merit.

[J.Sid]

1.) There have been vintage Byrne X-Men pages that I hesitated on (and missed out on) because they didn't have balloons on the page.

 

2.) Conversely, there are Hellboy pages from the mid-2000s (while he was still lettering them) which I am interested in.

 

So to me, it's less about the vintage of the art than it is the lettering. The page/art is incomplete (to me) without it.