FFB Posted April 8, 2005 Share Posted April 8, 2005 that's a beauty!!!!!!! i probably bought a couple of these back in the day, but they didn't stay in my collection......... Thanks Harry. Too bad you didn't buy and keep back in the day, I'd be more than happy to take them off your hands today! Today's contribution (#@% glare! ): At least the glare marks themselves are shaped like BOOMERANGS! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
tth2 Posted April 8, 2005 Author Share Posted April 8, 2005 At least the glare marks themselves are shaped like BOOMERANGS! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
burntboy Posted April 8, 2005 Share Posted April 8, 2005 that's a beauty!!!!!!! i probably bought a couple of these back in the day, but they didn't stay in my collection......... Thanks Harry. Too bad you didn't buy and keep back in the day, I'd be more than happy to take them off your hands today! Today's contribution (#@% glare! ): a thing of beauty - only issue 13 of the SA Flash................... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ComicBookGuy Posted April 9, 2005 Share Posted April 9, 2005 Beautiful books, Tim! Those Flashes are amazing. And... Congratulations on getting this thread pinned; it is well-deserved and LONG overdue! If I wasn't so busy with work right now and with the Dennis thread I would be posting some more of my 10 centers, but I look forward to seeing the new posts each day from everyone and look forward to posting some more stuff on here in the near future. Joe Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
tth2 Posted April 9, 2005 Author Share Posted April 9, 2005 Thanks Harry and Joe. I was going to continue my pattern of alternating Flashes with Turoks, but since there is such enthusiasm for the Flashes, I'll post my last 10 cent Flash a bit early. Interesting stat to put things in perspective: except for the CGC 9.4 copy of Flash 105, every single copy of Flash between 105-120 that CGC has graded out as a 9.4 is on this thread. Yup, all 4 of them. And there are a few who suspect that the 9.4 Flash 105 is a resub of the 9.2 copy that Robert Roter sold on Heritage last year. For many of these issues, the best copy is at best a 9.0. Now, I'm not pointing out this stat to aggrandize myself for being the owner of these 4 (okay, maybe a little ), but rather to ask, "Where the heck are the HG early Flashes?" 3 of these (111, 116, 117) were all found and submitted by Ron Murry 4 years ago (along with a 9.2 Flash 110 ). Since then only the 120 has emerged (and the 105). I know the census is not the end-all and be-all, because it only represents books that people have been willing to submit. But I'm confounded that NOTHING has emerged in the past 4 years. Are they really this rare, or are owners really this reluctant to get theirs graded (presumably for sale)? These are all solid 4-figure books, and some of the earlier issues (particularly 110) are solid 5-figure books, so the monetary incentive seems to be there. Anyways, enough talk. Without further ado, Flash 120 (with the standard M-shaped glare ): Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Scrooge Posted April 9, 2005 Share Posted April 9, 2005 Tim, those are great books for sure and you have every bragging rights. It is still amazing to me that any books survived in that grade in the first place. As you know, even Harry's copies are not all grading that high! Allow me for a small hijack (sp?) of the thread but it seems to me I had seen that guy before or is it its long lost cousin. Is it me or are these very similar-looking? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
tth2 Posted April 9, 2005 Author Share Posted April 9, 2005 Allow me for a small hijack (sp?) of the thread but it seems to me I had seen that guy before or is it its long lost cousin. Is it me or are these very similar-looking? If it's a 10 cent book, it's not a hijacking! Definitely seems to be a family resemblance... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
lou_fine Posted April 9, 2005 Share Posted April 9, 2005 "Where the heck are the HG early Flashes?" 3 of these (111, 116, 117) were all found and submitted by Ron Murry 4 years ago (along with a 9.2 Flash 110 ). Since then only the 120 has emerged (and the 105). I know the census is not the end-all and be-all, because it only represents books that people have been willing to submit. But I'm confounded that NOTHING has emerged in the past 4 years. Are they really this rare, or are owners really this reluctant to get theirs graded (presumably for sale)? These are all solid 4-figure books, and some of the earlier issues (particularly 110) are solid 5-figure books, so the monetary incentive seems to be there. tth2; Somewhere in there I believe you answered your own question. Books are usually slabbed only for the express purpose of obtaining a higher value when placed into the market for sale. HG early SA DC's are seen to be extremely rare relative to HG Marvels and most likely not placed into the market by their owners since they cannot be easily replaced. Hence no reason to have them slabbed at this point in time. I beleive this is the exact same reason why GA collectors are not having their HG GA books slabbed. With HG SA Marvels, I believe it is a completely different story as virtually any book (with very few exceptions) can be replaced as long as you are willing to pony up the cash. Since HG early Marvels are viewed as replaceable, this results in less of a reluntance to placed them into the market and therefore, more and more of them being slabbed in order to cash in on the current high market values. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
tth2 Posted April 9, 2005 Author Share Posted April 9, 2005 "Where the heck are the HG early Flashes?" 3 of these (111, 116, 117) were all found and submitted by Ron Murry 4 years ago (along with a 9.2 Flash 110 ). Since then only the 120 has emerged (and the 105). I know the census is not the end-all and be-all, because it only represents books that people have been willing to submit. But I'm confounded that NOTHING has emerged in the past 4 years. Are they really this rare, or are owners really this reluctant to get theirs graded (presumably for sale)? These are all solid 4-figure books, and some of the earlier issues (particularly 110) are solid 5-figure books, so the monetary incentive seems to be there. tth2; Somewhere in there I believe you answered your own question. Books are usually slabbed only for the express purpose of obtaining a higher value when placed into the market for sale. HG early SA DC's are seen to be extremely rare relative to HG Marvels and most likely not placed into the market by their owners since they cannot be easily replaced. Hence no reason to have them slabbed at this point in time. I beleive this is the exact same reason why GA collectors are not having their HG GA books slabbed. With HG SA Marvels, I believe it is a completely different story as virtually any book (with very few exceptions) can be replaced as long as you are willing to pony up the cash. Since HG early Marvels are viewed as replaceable, this results in less of a reluntance to placed them into the market and therefore, more and more of them being slabbed in order to cash in on the current high market values. Very true Lou, and if it were only 1 year after Ron broke his issues out I definitely wouldn't be asking the question. But it's 4 years later, and nada. During the same period of time, some HG copies of other early SA DCs (GL, Atom, JLA, Showcase, B&B, etc.) have slowly seeped out into the market. I would have expected that the simple passage of time and the law of averages would cause SOME HG issues of Flash to slowly dribble out into the census, if for no other reason than the 3 D's: death, divorce, debt. Is it just a statistical anomaly? And don't underestimate the power of money. When books start becoming worth "real" money, that translates into real material assets or real improvements in lifestyle, and the temptation to sell becomes greater. The guy who I bought some great GLs from said the books had simply appreciated to the point that it made a genuine difference to him: he could take the proceeds and make a decent downpayment on a really nice car. Similarly, perhaps some serious DC collectors want to buy a house, or upgrade to a better house, or put their kids through college? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
namisgr Posted April 9, 2005 Share Posted April 9, 2005 I think virtually all of the ten cent DC Superhero books are scarce in high grade. I did a quick perusal of the census for early GL, and found #3 has only a single 9.2 copy, #4 only two in 9.2, #6 only one, and #7 only one above 8.5. There is a similar paucity of NM ten cent Supes (#140 has none above 9.0; #141 only 2 above 8.5, etc.). Perhaps the NM 10 cent DC books are indeed stashed in private collections, but an alternative possibility is that for many of the issues, there may not be any surviving NM copies. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
lou_fine Posted April 9, 2005 Share Posted April 9, 2005 Very true Lou, and if it were only 1 year after Ron broke his issues out I definitely wouldn't be asking the question. But it's 4 years later, and nada. During the same period of time, some HG copies of other early SA DCs (GL, Atom, JLA, Showcase, B&B, etc.) have slowly seeped out into the market. I would have expected that the simple passage of time and the law of averages would cause SOME HG issues of Flash to slowly dribble out into the census, if for no other reason than the 3 D's: death, divorce, debt. Is it just a statistical anomaly? And don't underestimate the power of money. When books start becoming worth "real" money, that translates into real material assets or real improvements in lifestyle, and the temptation to sell becomes greater. The guy who I bought some great GLs from said the books had simply appreciated to the point that it made a genuine difference to him: he could take the proceeds and make a decent downpayment on a really nice car. Similarly, perhaps some serious DC collectors want to buy a house, or upgrade to a better house, or put their kids through college? tth2; Oh, so you was the insane insufficiently_thoughtful_person who paid those outragous prices of around $3K to $5K for Ron's HG early Flash books that I read about a few years in the pages of CBG. It now looks like you was a pretty good visionary at the time. Speaking of houses, have the real estate market in HK started to recover from the beating which it took a few years ago. With house prices passing $500K on the poor side of town and approaching $1M on the west side of the city here, my wife keeps nagging me that I should have listened to her a few years ago and sold my books off to buy an additional rental house. She's probably actually right since real estate prices here has gone up by almost 20% per year the last two years and appears to be headed for another 20%+ year without any end in sight. She never stops telling me that a rental home only requires a down payment at time of purchase and produces a steady stream of income while you own it. Comic books, on the hand, requires full payment at time of purchase with income (and possibly profit) only at the time of resale. Thank god she's forgotten that I was able to purchase a lot of my books using monthly rental revenue money or else she would even more. I used to be able to argue that the capital appreciation was higher on comic books by constantly referring to year over year gains showing up in the NM column of the OS guide. Course I never referred to the stagnant prices that were constantly showing up in the left hand columns of the OS guide. She would just scoff at me and say that all of these prices were made up by a bunch of fat old men sitting around a table dreaming up numbers to justify spending more time on their little toys. Anyways, my argument would work since real estate prices was only going up by around 5% per year in the late 90's. Now I am resorting to the argument of asset diversification since I claim that I don't want to tie up all of my money into real estate. Any other good arguments that you guys can come up with here in the ongoing debate with our significant others. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
tth2 Posted April 9, 2005 Author Share Posted April 9, 2005 I did a quick perusal of the census for early GL, and found... #7 only one above 8.5. Of course, that "one" above 8.5 happens to be a 9.6! If Robert Roter would just let his 9.4 GL #5 go at a non-insane price, it could join the rest of its 9.4 early GL brethren in Hong Kong! It would look so nice sitting between the #2 and the #7... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
tth2 Posted April 9, 2005 Author Share Posted April 9, 2005 Oh, so you was the insane insufficiently_thoughtful_person who paid those outragous prices of around $3K to $5K for Ron's HG early Flash books that I read about a few years in the pages of CBG. It now looks like you was a pretty good visionary at the time. Actually, I was NOT the insane insufficiently_thoughtful_person who actually won the eBay auctions when those books went up for sale. Being naive at the time, my "aggressive" bids ended up being about 1/5 of the final prices once the big boys (Dallas Stephens, Roter, Wilson, Nathanson and the actual winner, a private collector) piled in. I'd never seen anything like it. I just happened to be the very happy person who happened to be hanging around when this private collector later decided to exit comics and asked me if I'd be interested in buying the books from him. Speaking of houses, have the real estate market in HK started to recover from the beating which it took a few years ago. With a vengeance. Prices are almost back to where they were during the 1997 bubble, and just about 100% above where they were 2 years ago when things bottomed out during SARS. You can't touch a nice 1000 square foot flat in a nice area for less than US$1.2 million right now, and really big luxury properties are absolutely insane. She would just scoff at me and say that all of these prices were made up by a bunch of fat old men sitting around a table dreaming up numbers to justify spending more time on their little toys. Has your wife been talking with MY wife? The similarities are uncanny! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ComicBookGuy Posted April 9, 2005 Share Posted April 9, 2005 Now I am resorting to the argument of asset diversification since I claim that I don't want to tie up all of my money into real estate. Any other good arguments that you guys can come up with here in the ongoing debate with our significant others. I think you are right about the diversification argument. Diversification is very important especially since rates are on the rise and real estate will most likely plateau as a result. Real estate is great since it typically goes up and at the worst stays the same, but it can go down a little. I've got my money in real estate, stocks, t-bills, cash, and comics. No matter what happens, I'm covered. Also she should realize she's lucky your hobby isn't drinking, cause then you flush your fun at the end of the day. With comics, they're with you when you wake up and ALMOST always worth more in the morning as long as they're pre-1975. Joe Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
adamstrange Posted April 9, 2005 Share Posted April 9, 2005 Tim: Beautiful Flashes. Now get your own scanner that works!!!! Lou Fine: You are helping to preserve and promote America's cultural heritage. Like many important things in life, it's not about the money. (P.S. This, like every other argument we give you, won't work. So when you are ready to sell, PM me!) Tim: Sweet GL7. Tim & Lou: I don't think I can add anything to what I've said in a previous entries on this topic when I first started posting. But in the interest of upping my count, I'll try anyway. They're tough to find but there are definitely more high grade copies out there, even in 9.4. I've seen dozens of 9.4 copies of different DC books from the late 50s -- many from runs where it's almost a miracle that they even exist in 9.0. Now these are usually isolated books and you will rarely see more than one 9.4 copy of any single issue. My view is the these high grade books are like roaches and many more are hidden behind the walls than you see running around the kitchen. Will we see mulitple 9.6s and multiple 9.4s on most of the issues like many of the Marvels? It would sure surprise the heck out of me. Might we see a lot more 9.0s and above? Yes. Will they go to CGC and the market in the timeframe you would like? Probably not. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
FFB Posted April 9, 2005 Share Posted April 9, 2005 It's heeeeeeeere!!!! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
adamstrange Posted April 9, 2005 Share Posted April 9, 2005 (edited) That's an excellent copy given how tough that issue is to find. Congratulations! Edited April 9, 2005 by adamstrange Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
tth2 Posted April 9, 2005 Author Share Posted April 9, 2005 Congrats, Scott! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
FFB Posted April 9, 2005 Share Posted April 9, 2005 That's an excellent copy given how tough that issue is to find. Congratulations! Thanks. The scan is magnifying the appearance of the crease compared to how the book looks in hand, so I took a picture (ignore the glare from the Mylar at top middle of book). Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JohnBull Posted April 9, 2005 Share Posted April 9, 2005 Excellent! It's easy to knock the 'pedigree' designation, but the guy obviously had some very nice books. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
