ASM 39 or ASM 40,..which one is the better image ?

[DiceX]

I KNOW youre just saying that to be difficult!!!

 

Not difficult. Just my personal opinion.

 

Romita would die hapy if he drew one cover as skillfully as ASM 21 for just one example...

 

Need I say more than this?

 

They didnt not LET him draw MJ, he QUIT.

 

Thanks, Mr Ditko!

 

Losing Ditko's style for Romita's cute faces but bland vanilla layouts.

 

Yeah. Let's have a look at that "style".

I need a vomit graemlin for that cover.

 

How about this one?

OOOOOOH! The DRAMA!!

 

Another dramatic one...

Spidey looks like he would be more comfortable with a stick shoved up his [#@$%!!!].

He must have swiped those poses from a drawing Romita did in elementary school.

 

Hey! Let's look at some "vanilla blands"...

 

How about the action in this one?

 

Or how about the beauty of this one?

 

Ditko...BAH!

[DiceX]

Mr. A is gonna' get your asss for sayin' that, Dice.

 

I can handle myself in a Ditko vs Romita flame war, anyday.

[FFB]

I've always been partial to the first two Prowler covers. Anyone who can make a guy in a hood armed with window washing supplies look scary and sinister is, by definition, a master of his craft (scans swiped from ebay -- not my copies).

[heartened]

Dice X,

 

The #98 is by Gil Kane, actually.

 

But, I agree. I prefer Romita's style much more than Ditko's. I will say, though, that I appreciated Ditko's work a lot more once I saw some of his original art.

[esquirecomics]

I am almost embarrassed to post this beat up, horrible copy of ASM 39 (yes, I vote for 39), but fortunately a recent addition (no, not considered restoration )) at least provides some form of decency. Thank you FlyingDonut.

 

[jimm94]

You can be a fan of Romita without trashing Ditko, ya know...

[FlyingDonut]

Give me the clean, tasty lines of Ross Andru or Gil Kane any day.

[Aman619]

 

you can thank the colorist for 98% of the effect of this cover. Squint and look at only the line work, but dont do it after eating lunch or youll lose it!

 

 

 

 

 

geddoudahere! thats a GREAT Ditko cover!!

 

 

 

 

 

admittedly not a great effort.....

 

 

 

 

this one either...

 

 

 

 

I agree that this is a powerful layout well drawn...

BUT - - - compare Romita tortured bloated awkward Spidey to the stature of Ditkos corner Spidey simply standing there radiating power and confidence daring you to make your move! In that small throwaway pose Ditko captured the essence of Spidey (guess he didnt have a tissue handy!

 

 

 

 

 

I LOOVE Gil KANE!! Romita couldnt wipe his arse either!!

 

 

 

 

 

Oh what a tangled piece of [#@$%!!!]!!! Horrible! How could you pick THIS cover. Romita did lots of covers far better than this!!

 

Im not saying Romits sucks, but compared to Ditko's singular style and effectiveness, its no comparison IMO. Havent we done this before, mmn?

[delekkerste]

 

geddoudahere! thats a GREAT Ditko cover!!

 

Are we looking at the same cover here? The one where Ditko drew Spidey with the physique of "Cousin Paulie" from the "Rocky" movies??

 

 

admittedly not a great effort.....

 

You are much more charitable than I would be. If this wasn't an early/historic Spidey issue, we would be laughing at this cover art together.

 

 

BUT - - - compare Romita tortured bloated awkward Spidey to the stature of Ditkos corner Spidey simply standing there radiating power and confidence daring you to make your move!

 

I give Ditko points for (a) character design/development and (b) creative use of perspective in his panels. But, "radiating power"?? His characters have irregular anatomies, generic expressions and "radiate" about as much power as a bucket of wet noodles. Where's the detail? Where's the realism? His artwork is bland and dated. The only reason anyone thinks he's a great artist is because of the two points I made above and because of the memories associated with those early Spidey issues. If he drew Spidey in the 1970s or 1980s, we wouldn't speak any higher of him than Pollard, Frenz or Romita Jr. Don't believe me? Well, how reverently do people speak of Ditko's later non-Spidey work? His artwork doesn't fare too well without that nostalgia, does it?

 

 

I LOOVE Gil KANE!! Romita couldnt wipe his arse either!!

 

I like Gil Kane, but his art is overrated. What's up with those weird, geometric faces he was always prone to drawing? Overall, he was solid, but definitely a cut below the greats like Romita. Like one of those baseball players who had a long, solid career but just lacked the inherent greatness to get inducted into the HOF. On the other hand, Ross Andru is highly underrated. His run on Spidey was solid (though, it deteriorated a bit later on, when he was drawing lame characters like "Stegron"...)

 

 

Im not saying Romits sucks, but compared to Ditko's singular style and effectiveness, its no comparison IMO.

 

Ditko deserves accolades for being part of the bedrock upon which Marvel was built, but his artwork has not, IMO, withstood the test of time. To my modern eyes, it looks bland and horribly dated.

[FFB]

I LOOVE Gil KANE!! Romita couldnt wipe his arse either!!

 

I like Gil Kane, but his art is overrated. What's up with those weird, geometric faces he was always prone to drawing? Overall, he was solid, but definitely a cut below the greats like Romita. Like one of those baseball players who had a long, solid career but just lacked the inherent greatness to get inducted into the HOF. On the other hand, Ross Andru is highly underrated. His run on Spidey was solid (though, it deteriorated a bit later on, when he was drawing lame characters like "Stegron"...)

 

Exactly. I was reading ASM#100 last night and thought the same thing. Kane's faces just look weird. They always struck me as looking like he adhered a little too closely to the "basic geometric building blocks" that artists sketch when they are laying out a scene.

 

Personally, I've never been that much of a fan of Ross Andru. I tend to view him much the same way as you described Kane -- decent, but never great.

[dm226]

I always thought Gil Kane's art showed too many "up the nose" angles. This only worked for me for his Morbius art. Perhaps we can start a thread of "Gil Kane nostril-shot-poses" to rival that of the Robin SP......

[burntboy]

I always thought Gil Kane's art showed too many "up the nose" angles. This only worked for me for his Morbius art. Perhaps we can start a thread of "Gil Kane nostril-shot-poses" to rival that of the Robin SP......

 

well, i'm certainly no expert, but here's a Gil Kane cover ("wash" by jack adler) that isn't "up the nose" and is a beautiful portrayal of the human form IMO...........

 

[delekkerste]

Personally, I've never been that much of a fan of Ross Andru. I tend to view him much the same way as you described Kane -- decent, but never great.

 

I wouldn't put him in the HOF category either, but I thought his run was solid and his clean and realistic style suited the book well. Kane's work was pretty good, though not as consistent - I loved the art for ASM #121, for example, but some of those issues in the early #100s look a little questionable (like #103-#104 - Gwen Stacy in a bikini, good, Kraven with the wacked out face, bad, Gog the monster who looks like he was created out of building blocks, horrible).

 

However, all of these guys look like veritable Michelangelos compared to the artists that have drawn Spidey over the past 15 years IMO (I find McFarlane's art to be every bit as bad as Liefeld's, which is only superceded in its atrociousness by Erik Larsen's attempt to mimic his style in the early 1990s. And, JRJR's work on ASM and Ramos's work on PPSS the past few years have literally been some of the worst artwork ever seen in comics).

[Sharkey]

ASM21 or 29 or 32. Romita is a phenomenal artist, but it took him a while to get the hang of Spider-Man being like a Spider, man.

 

Ditko is the definitive Spider-Man artist.

 

Ditko blows.

Ditko drew UGLY people. I hate that most of the Spidey characters were first drawn by Ditko, because they have kept that same basic look for all these years.

That's probably the reason they never let him draw MJ, because they wanted at least one hot chick in the title. They waited until he left before letting a real artist chisel her out.

 

Ditko is only definitive because he was the first.

His stuff looks like it was done by a third grader next to Romita's work.

Comparing Ditko to Romita is like comparing Rob Liefeld with Dave Stevens. No contest.

 

 

Don't get your panties in a bunch, Dice.

 

Did I say Romita was a hack or that his art wan't superb? NO. Did I COMPARE them? NO. Romita is a great artist. A GREAT artist. And yeah, that man could draw hot women.

 

However, when it comes to the book overall, I prefer the way Ditko drew Spider-Man. Romita draws great-looking people. Ditko draws quirky people. Peter Parker is supposed to be a nerd! He looks like a doofy wallflower in the Ditko issues. Jazzy John made him look like a GQ model (except that Peter likes girls). To me, the switchover from Ditko (my first impression of Spider-Man) to Romita wasn't smooth. The styles were so different. Look at Amazing Spider-Man annual 3, you could tell Romita just wasn't used to trying to draw a guy who was supposed to be quirky.

 

You can slam Ditko with a tirade, but it doesn't change the fact that there people like me who prefer Ditko's style on Spider-Man. That's taking NOTHING away from Romita who I think is a phenomenal artist and a great all-around guy.

 

'Course, if you want a flame war, I'll be happy to oblige.

[DESTRO-migration]

[Sharkey]

Yeah, that's a sweet cover! Romitaman has a lot of REALLY nice stuff, don't he?

[Sharkey]

I always thought Gil Kane's art showed too many "up the nose" angles. This only worked for me for his Morbius art. Perhaps we can start a thread of "Gil Kane nostril-shot-poses" to rival that of the Robin SP......

 

Kane had great style, but even kids, our local bunch of comic geeks used to make fun of his "nostril-damus" tendencies. We used to call his comics "The Green Booger" and "The Amazing Booger-Man" whenever he'd do one of those angles!!!

[DESTRO-migration]

Yup,..sweeeeeeeeeet.

 

Romita-man sold it though,...50K plus in trade AND Cash is what he told me.

 

I swear,......I wish I had scooped this stuff up,..oh well,,...theres always 'Spectacular Spiderman' and 'Web of'

 

[Aman619]

geddoudahere! thats a GREAT Ditko cover!!

 

Are we looking at the same cover here? The one where Ditko drew Spidey with the physique of "Cousin Paulie" from the "Rocky" movies??

 

can you not feel the tension hes exerting on the ropes? thats a great Spidey drawing. I have qualms about the dark blue bkgnd and Chameleons hed inset covering Kravens foot, but th elayout is strong and welldrawn to me... Paulie??

 

 

BUT - - - compare Romita tortured bloated awkward Spidey to the stature of Ditkos corner Spidey simply standing there radiating power and confidence daring you to make your move!

 

I give Ditko points for (a) character design/development and (b) creative use of perspective in his panels. But, "radiating power"?? His characters have irregular anatomies, generic expressions and "radiate" about as much power as a bucket of wet noodles. Where's the detail? Where's the realism? His artwork is bland and dated. The only reason anyone thinks he's a great artist is because of the two points I made above and because of the memories associated with those early Spidey issues. If he drew Spidey in the 1970s or 1980s, we wouldn't speak any higher of him than Pollard, Frenz or Romita Jr. Don't believe me? Well, how reverently do people speak of Ditko's later non-Spidey work? His artwork doesn't fare too well without that nostalgia, does it?

 

"I shouldnt have used "radiating power" in this context. What I was referring to was the inherent power Spidey exudes in what is actually a relaxed pose. Cool and confident. As say James Bond radiateds power standing in a casino, get it? Casual but alert, poised and ready. Ditko could convey all that in what would be for Romita just a guy standing there looking 'pretty' and well-dressed.

 

You may be right that some of Ditkos allure is inextricably attached to Spidey nostalgia for many people. But Im pretty sure Im looking at his line work alone. Where I agree on this is your point about his later work. He was most similar and tightest on Captain Atom afterwards, but even there, not seeing the simple red and blue Spidey costume always diminished that work to me. As for his later work, to me it loosened up and deteriorated at a pace equal to Kirby's slackening of detail etc over the same period. Plus, Ditko retreated further into his patented st piece favorite imagery which was far simpler and more unattractive and stiff than watered down Kirby ever got (till the very end)

 

 

 

I LOOVE Gil KANE!! Romita couldnt wipe his arse either!!

 

I like Gil Kane, but his art is overrated. What's up with those weird, geometric faces he was always prone to drawing? Overall, he was solid, but definitely a cut below the greats like Romita. Like one of those baseball players who had a long, solid career but just lacked the inherent greatness to get inducted into the HOF. On the other hand, Ross Andru is highly underrated. His run on Spidey was solid (though, it deteriorated a bit later on, when he was drawing lame characters like "Stegron"...)

 

Gil Kane has pizazz... and an advanced over the top approach to musculature that is a design oriented to me as Kirby's. He is most similar to me to teh famed Tarzan artist (whose name sadly evades me at the moment) in his exaggeration of anatomy for effect. And, yes, Gil was perhaps too fond of th eup th enose look and drew his faces mostly as self-portraits. He and Romita are similar in that they are second tier professionals compared to the greats... but I give the edge to Kane for his creativity.

 

As for Ross Andru? sigh, I true professional artist that can draw rings around 99% of th epeople on the planet. But just no cpmparison in the greatness area. A solid professional is all.

 

Im not saying Romits sucks, but compared to Ditko's singular style and effectiveness, its no comparison IMO.

 

Ditko deserves accolades for being part of the bedrock upon which Marvel was built, but his artwork has not, IMO, withstood the test of time. To my modern eyes, it looks bland and horribly dated.

 

much of Ditkos work is, well, not his best or among the best ever done. But his BEST stuff??? Pure balletic poetry in motion. To me his greatness is undeniable, but that is not a blanket statement for every piece he ever drew....

[burntboy]

is that B&B 25 cover Ross Andru?? the faces remind me of SA Wonder Woman and the Metal Men..............