theCapraAegagrus Posted March 23, 2022 Share Posted March 23, 2022 On 3/23/2022 at 10:17 AM, kimik said: Exaclty. And it should have, to be honest. Combining the top two properties for DC should have been a slam dunk $1B movie. Seems like a pointless threshold to me. It didn't lose money. It made 90% of what they "expected". William-James88 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bosco685 Posted March 23, 2022 Author Share Posted March 23, 2022 On 3/23/2022 at 10:25 AM, theCapraAegagrus said: Seems like a pointless threshold to me. It didn't lose money. It made 90% of what they "expected". You're supposed to bash on BVS. Not see the positive in the situation. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
kimik Posted March 23, 2022 Share Posted March 23, 2022 (edited) On 3/23/2022 at 3:41 AM, Bosco685 said: Reality is calling. First week moviegoers gave the film an A- CinemaScore. Which is strong WOM. I get you didn't like the film. I respect that. But now crafting an out-of-your-mind story WOM is negative on a mass level is not factual. It is well over $600M from a film many repeatedly noted Robert Pattinson was skinny Twilight Sparkle Batman. In no way was this film lined up to clear a $1B box office. I am not making anything up. The WOM on this film is not great here, as was evident at the comic/toy show this weekend. We will agree to disagree on expectations. WB executives were definitely expecting $1B for this film. They had everything lined up with positive pre-screening, mostly positive initial reviews right before opening, an audience coming out of Covid that was excited to get out to see a big budget hero film again, and the top DC property. The mistake WB have been making since Snyder left is a continuity issue within the DCU. Allowing Directors to do whatever they want is not working unless their name is James Wan (who understands what audiences want) - even Patty Jenkins bombed with her WW84. The reason the MCU works is that they have an overall vision tying all of the different films into a cohesive universe that builds towards a larger story film after film. If Directors don't like that, they can go elsewhere. Snyder was trying to do the same thing, but did not finish it. Discovery needs to can the WB exec team when they take over and bring in a leadership group that understands this. Edited March 23, 2022 by kimik Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Axelrod Posted March 23, 2022 Share Posted March 23, 2022 On 3/23/2022 at 10:45 AM, kimik said: The reason the MCU works is that they have an overall vision tying all of the different films into a cohesive universe that builds towards a larger story film after film. If Directors don't like that, they can go elsewhere. Snyder was trying to do the same thing, but did not finish it. Discovery needs to can the WB exec team when they take over and bring in a leadership group that understands this. Well, you know, the last three Marvel movies not involving Spider-Man were Black Widow, Shang-Chi and Eternals. I'm not calling any of those movies failures, but The Batman is kicking all their butts. Gatsby77, Larryw7 and William-James88 2 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
csaag Posted March 23, 2022 Share Posted March 23, 2022 Had to be in early at work yesterday and stay late so I took a break later afternoon and caught a showing. I absolutely loved it. The Riddler's costume was a little strange but he was a great character. I'm glad this didn't have a streaming release as then I would've watched it at home and not gotten the same sound quality as the theater had. It certainly wasn't a 'Bruce Wayne' film but that didn't impact my viewing experience. Larryw7 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
kimik Posted March 23, 2022 Share Posted March 23, 2022 (edited) On 3/23/2022 at 8:52 AM, Axelrod said: Well, you know, the last three Marvel movies not involving Spider-Man were Black Widow, Shang-Chi and Eternals. I'm not calling any of those movies failures, but The Batman is kicking all their butts. As the Batman should. His Marvel equivalent is Spider-man from a property perspective, and the latest Spider-Man box office will be 2x+ what the Batman is going to do. That is where the comparison will be made at the corporate level. Edited March 23, 2022 by kimik Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Axelrod Posted March 23, 2022 Share Posted March 23, 2022 I don't think the corporates are actually going to be disappointed that their re-boot with brand new Batman didn't hit the same level as the Spider-Man franchise-cross-over-event. Sony/Marvel earned that one on the backs of 2 decades of Spider-Man movies. theCapraAegagrus and Larryw7 2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bosco685 Posted March 23, 2022 Author Share Posted March 23, 2022 On 3/23/2022 at 10:45 AM, kimik said: I am not making anything up. The WOM on this film is not great here, as was evident at the comic/toy show this weekend. We will agree to disagree on expectations. WB executives were definitely expecting $1B for this film. They had everything lined up with positive pre-screening, mostly positive initial reviews right before opening, an audience coming out of Covid that was excited to get out to see a big budget hero film again, and the top DC property. The mistake WB have been making since Snyder left is a continuity issue within the DCU. Allowing Directors to do whatever they want is not working unless their name is James Wan (who understands what audiences want) - even Patty Jenkins bombed with her WW84. The reason the MCU works is that they have an overall vision tying all of the different films into a cohesive universe that builds towards a larger story film after film. If Directors don't like that, they can go elsewhere. Snyder was trying to do the same thing, but did not finish it. Discovery needs to can the WB exec team when they take over and bring in a leadership group that understands this. Wonder Woman (2017) was so impactful the distribution in audience gender results was a drastic shift compared to all other comic book movies. And there was a strong partnership between Patty Jenkins and Zack Snyder as part of this. Or did I miss something, and James Wan was behind this? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bosco685 Posted March 23, 2022 Author Share Posted March 23, 2022 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
theCapraAegagrus Posted March 23, 2022 Share Posted March 23, 2022 On 3/23/2022 at 11:37 AM, Bosco685 said: Mask of the Phantasm only garnered 0.9 times its production budget? Must be a bad movie. William-James88 and Bosco685 2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Straw-Man Posted March 23, 2022 Share Posted March 23, 2022 looking at that chart above made me read the words "batman and robin." my stomach did one of those little flips like when you barely avoid a car wreck. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
theCapraAegagrus Posted March 23, 2022 Share Posted March 23, 2022 Still kinda blows my mind that Batman Begins 'broke even' at the box office. It's such a damn good origin movie. William-James88 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
chrisco37 Posted March 23, 2022 Share Posted March 23, 2022 On 3/23/2022 at 10:45 AM, kimik said: I am not making anything up. The WOM on this film is not great here, as was evident at the comic/toy show this weekend. We will agree to disagree on expectations. WB executives were definitely expecting $1B for this film. They had everything lined up with positive pre-screening, mostly positive initial reviews right before opening, an audience coming out of Covid that was excited to get out to see a big budget hero film again, and the top DC property. The mistake WB have been making since Snyder left is a continuity issue within the DCU. Allowing Directors to do whatever they want is not working unless their name is James Wan (who understands what audiences want) - even Patty Jenkins bombed with her WW84. The reason the MCU works is that they have an overall vision tying all of the different films into a cohesive universe that builds towards a larger story film after film. If Directors don't like that, they can go elsewhere. Snyder was trying to do the same thing, but did not finish it. Discovery needs to can the WB exec team when they take over and bring in a leadership group that understands this. Why does Batman have to be tied to a larger universe? He wasn't in any of the Nolan movies. He's not a super-powered being like the rest of the DCU and/or Marvel. Why can't he exist in his own world? I thought the movie was really good (a bit too long), but I really liked it. I even said I liked the "take" on Bruce Wayne although I know it didn't work for everyone. I didn't pay $15 to go watch Bruce Wayne rub elbows with the Gotham Elite. I paid $15 to see Batman. And I got more Batman in this movie than any other Batman movie to date. William-James88 and csaag 2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
path4play Posted March 23, 2022 Share Posted March 23, 2022 Saw it, liked it, and thought it holds up to the The Dark Knight. I actually like how its 'stripped down' even more raw - batcycle, batmobile etc., No sunshine, all rain. Feels like its about as grim as you can push it. William-James88 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bosco685 Posted March 23, 2022 Author Share Posted March 23, 2022 New Riddler drop coming Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
William-James88 Posted March 24, 2022 Share Posted March 24, 2022 On 3/22/2022 at 11:57 PM, kimik said: BvS was being touted as a $1B blockbuster, and fell short. Justice League was even worse. Right now the DCU is in shambles, just like their comic publishing arm (outside of the Batman titles, there really is nothing left). They need someone to set a vision and see it through. The Snyder cut for JL is way better than what they churned out - they should have released that and let him finish the story line with Darkseid. After having seen it, they really should have released it as Parts 1 and 2. Would have made quite a bit of money. And there would have been real hype for that second part. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
William-James88 Posted March 24, 2022 Share Posted March 24, 2022 On 3/22/2022 at 11:45 PM, kimik said: FWIW, I posted here that Pattinson was a bad choice from the start and the movie's box office is confirming it. The main takeaway from people is that he surprised them. I have seen so few posts stating he was bad. Instead I see a bunch of memes about how great he turned out, even a fill in the blank apology letter for R Bats, which made me chuckle. Larryw7 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
William-James88 Posted March 24, 2022 Share Posted March 24, 2022 On 3/23/2022 at 10:17 AM, kimik said: your two biggest properties going head to head, what could go wrong? everything On 3/23/2022 at 10:45 AM, kimik said: I am not making anything up. The WOM on this film is not great here, as was evident at the comic/toy show this weekend. I got to admit, that is one funny line from you. If you are grounded and looking at this in an even headed way, you should avoid anecdotal evidence like this. Some fanboys at a comic/toy show said it wasn't good= flop. Come on, it sounds like you are describing what the simpson's comic book guy said to you. And aside from all that, as I said before, a good movie doesn't mean it will make a ton of money. Let's compare BVS to Batman begins. One made 3 times the money of the other, is it 3 times better? On 3/23/2022 at 10:58 AM, kimik said: As the Batman should. His Marvel equivalent is Spider-man from a property perspective, and the latest Spider-Man box office will be 2x+ what the Batman is going to do. That is where the comparison will be made at the corporate level. It would only be a fair comparison if this film also had Keaton's Batman and Bale's Batman show up at the end to help Battinson beat 5 iconic Batman villains. On 3/23/2022 at 2:55 PM, chrisco37 said: I paid $15 to see Batman. And I got more Batman in this movie than any other Batman movie to date. That's how I felt. And that's why I went and watched it 2 more times. Just so much Batman to enjoy. Larryw7 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Semicentennial Posted March 24, 2022 Share Posted March 24, 2022 On 3/23/2022 at 6:45 AM, AnthonyTheAbyss said: - I hope the next movie brings in Hush or Azrael (which likely wont' happen but I'd like to see a "new" character) ***Overall...80/100 Azrael would be cool. Bosco685 and Larryw7 2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Gatsby77 Posted March 24, 2022 Share Posted March 24, 2022 (edited) So...Scott Mendelson wrote ~800 words about why "The Batman Never Had to Top $1 billion." His basic points? 1) Even at a worst-case scenario, it's going to finish domestically above Spider-Man: No Way Home - without the benefit of the MCU fanboy apparatus and RDJ's Iron Man as a selling point. 2) It's going to end up close to $400M domestic (more than any DC flick but Wonder Woman) and close to $800M worldwide ("essentially tied with BvS with a pre-Covid Chinese gross). Add in...there are tons of folks still hesitant to go to theaters due to Covid and it's coming to HBO Max in just a few weeks, so there are plenty willing to wait. https://www.forbes.com/sites/scottmendelson/2022/03/22/box-office-no-the-batman-never-had-to-top-1-billion/?sh=f7c416d37efc Edited March 24, 2022 by Gatsby77 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
