Detached Covers Points Loss Question

[N e r V]

So what is the points hit for a detached cover?

 

If it's a 6.0 overall but has a detached cover is it a 5.0? 4.0?

 

What if it's a higher grade (7.0-up) is the hit the same or less?

 

Bigger or smaller hit over a GA book vs SA?

 

I've seen some very nice lower grades (4.0,etc.) that look great but have a detached cover so would most collectors pass on a nicer lower graded book with a detached cover vs a book with its cover intact but not so pretty???

 

Any info. would be helpful.

 

Thanx.

[Bomber-Bob]

Let me look this up in my CGC guide to grading. You should get a copy.

Seriously though, I don't think there is such a thing as a high grade 7.0 with a detached cover. The fact that the cover is detached automatically puts it as low grade.

[jjeanius]

I believe they meant "7.0 aside from the fact that the cover is detached".

 

And...now that we are in an age of encapsulation, I would much prefer the detached cover with great eye appeal, than the same grade with attached cover and lower eye appeal.

[Robot Man]

I recently did an in person trade with a boardie for a cool book. "In the bag" it looked very nice almost a fine. When I took it out and opened the cover we noticed some light foxing and tanning. Had to knock it down a little for that. It had just very minor wear otherwise. But to our surprise, the staples were very neatly popped and the cover was detached. Very hard to tell in the bag.

 

As a point of refrence we used Overstreet grading. It clearly stated that a vg copy could not have a detached cover. Now does that drop a very nice presenting book down to only a good? We both agreed that at the worst it would be good+ but settled on good-vg because it looked so nice. I was satisfied with it and we did our deal.

 

Since CGC does not post their grading criteria and neither of us have enough CGC books or experience with their grades, we went with Overstreet at 3.0.

 

I have no idea how CGC would handle a book like this. My guess is since they are aparently a lot stricter than Overstreet, it probably would not garner any more than the 3.0 we agreed upon. Baring exceptions that might have popped up do you think we were right?

[D84]

The Overstreet Grading Guide says 2.5 is the highest grade you can have with a detached cover, but I've seen CGC books go up to a 4.0 with that defect.

[N e r V]

The reason I asked is that I've seen several CGC 4.0/3.5's with detached covers that looked much better so I was not sure if that CGC had some grading formula that people were aware that would knock it down X amount of points.

 

As for higher grades existing I've seen a couple of GA books that would have probably been in the range stated if not for covers detached. A friend has a copy of Captain America #32 that would probably ace the 8.0 grade if it didn't have a very cleanly detached cover. The seller had stacked some GA books and they guess that the cover had somehow got very cleanly pulled off from moving the stack around over time.

 

Thanks for most of the comments so maybe the answer is nothing above CGC 4.0 unless a higher number is ever seen.

[Johnny545]

For an otherwise 6.0-7.0 book assume it will be a 2.0, but no better.

 

A book with a detached cover and amazing eye appeal might come back higher, but I wouldn't bank on it.

 

(My comments are only for GA books).

[SuperBird]

I own several 3.0 and 3.5 books with detached covers. I have seen 4.0s with detached covers (with 8.0 eye appeal), but not higher than that.

[fifties]

I didn't see CGC mentioned in the OP, so my opinion would be based on raw books, which is all I buy anyway.

 

Most of mine are mid and lower grade copies, and I have a plethora of copies with a detached cover.

 

A "beat but complete" condition of course wouldn't garner above G at best regardless, so no issue there. So often books in this shape have whiter and more supple inside covers and pages than the following reference;

 

In many instances the cover is flat and glossy, and if not for being detached could pass itself off as a VG or F very easily, but given that one defect, I never consider them as beyond G; not G+, nor G-VG.

 

Consider that most often the reason for the detachment in the first place is that the book is experiencing paper degradation, as evidenced by foxing/edge browning inside the covers, and of course the staple area in the spine is the weakest link and generally the first to show the result of the decline.

[SuperBird]

I had assumed at this point that CGC was the de facto grading standard everyone uses, even when considering raw books?

[Robot Man]

I don't know how anyone would know if it were slabbed. You have to take their word for it. And, as been mentioned, they can grade such a book with decent eye appeal from 2.0-4.0. I would have to think that the few 4.0's out there probably have VERY high eye appeal.

 

I try to be a "fair" grader, not too loose or too tight. The book I refered to had very nice eye appeal thus, I was willing to give it a little bump from the usual good books I see.

 

Since I mostly have raw books I use the Overstreet grading guide and very rarely have had a problem.

[SuperBird]

I don't know how anyone would know if it were slabbed.

 

You mean know if the cover were detached? It would be printed on the CGC label.

[Sqeggs]

I own several 3.0 and 3.5 books with detached covers. I have seen 4.0s with detached covers (with 8.0 eye appeal), but not higher than that.

 

I used to think 3.0 was the ceiling on books with detached covers, but I've seen 4.0s. I may be hallucinating, but I thought I recently saw a 6.0. But maybe that was a book was a single staple popped rather than an entirely detached cover.

[Sqeggs]

I don't know how anyone would know if it were slabbed. You have to take their word for it. And, as been mentioned, they can grade such a book with decent eye appeal from 2.0-4.0. I would have to think that the few 4.0's out there probably have VERY high eye appeal.

 

I try to be a "fair" grader, not too loose or too tight. The book I refered to had very nice eye appeal thus, I was willing to give it a little bump from the usual good books I see.

 

Since I mostly have raw books I use the Overstreet grading guide and very rarely have had a problem.

 

A detached cover is always noted on the label notes.

[N e r V]

There currently is this copy of All Star #33 in CGC 4.0 detached cover for sale in the gold/silver section.

 

http://boards.collectors-society.com/ubbthreads.php?ubb=showflat&Number=9398020&fpart=2

 

 

A great looking CGC 4.0 but I doubt it would hit close to an 8.0 even if the cover was attached.

 

I'd buy it in a minute though for great eye appeal.

[lou_fine]

Sounds as though we have a general idea of what a detached cover book would grade out at.

 

How about a book with a spine split just on the cover only, about 3/4 of the cover, but not touching the staples so that the cover is still fully attached? What would this grade out at it the book looks to be almost mid-grade with clean white pages in a mylar and you cannot see the cover split until you take it out?

 

Would probably grade out in the 5.0 to 5.5 grade range without the cover split.

[SuperBird]

I've never seen a bad spine split get more than a 2.5?

 

[lou_fine]

I've never seen a bad spine split get more than a 2.5?

 

That's good then as my thinking was in the 2.0 to 2.5 grade range.

[FineCollector]

I've always wondered about detached covers in slabs... if it's not attached, wouldn't the book have a tendency to slide away from the cover, and not present as well as it should?

 

I wouldn't go above 2.5 for a detached cover. It may be a nice looking G, but it's still a G.

 

I find long spine splits to be much more obtrusive. Careful handling of the book will still cause the split worsen. 3/4 of the spine being split would put it in the 1.5-1.0 range for me, because once the split covers fall off, Overstreet calls it 0.5.

[N e r V]

That's probably something that Howard Rogofsky and some scotch tape would be able to fix easily.