SUPERMAN #1 SALE?

[FFB]

No, Tim. I was asking you to tell me why it matters to you that there used to be restoration there when the restoration is removed completely, leaving no remaining work that might or might not even cause the book to appear to be a higher grade than it is. Your answer ("I just don't like any restoration, even restoration that isn't there anymore") is your answer and you're entitled to it. It doesn't make sense to me, but you're right -- it doesn't have to. It's not up to me to tell you how to collect. But it's not up to you to force your weird notions of what needs to be disclosed on me either.

 

I think in my mind we are getting closer to the nub of the matter. Not all collectors agree as to what makes a book desirable or valuable in this instance. You have no problem with an un-restored book. Cool. Tim and I do. So for us, knowing a (significant?) portion of the potential buyers for the book feel it is worth LESS than a naturally degraded copy makes it a tougher sell. Not to everybody, but to that % of buyers who agree with us. Id be curious just what % that is, maybe 50%?? But, any "large" % of potential buyers who will balk at the book affects the price getting out of the book. I feel (and assume TTH does too) that this factors the price I am willing to pay.

 

Of course now we get to the "why we collect" argument: for love, or money. But for a HG GA key like we are discussing here, why buy a "tainted" copy that will hurt you when its time to sell? I'd ask you, like my last question, but Im afraid youll just boldly state "No problem". But of 10 people agree with us that it's "tainted", thats ten customers who will be a hard sell at full price.

 

I am not going to keep repeating myself. Just reread my prior posts on the topic if you want to continue the discussion.

[shrunkenhead]

okay, you just bought the MH Supes #1 as a Blue label 8.0 for $275K, a new record since its a higher grade than the 7.5 that sold. And you had NO IDEA of that particular copy's history vis-a-vis restoration and removal.

 

So you get home and post a scan of your new grail like you did with that pretty BB25 for all of us to cheer and drool. And you then learn of its past as poster after poster says didnt you know?? Werent you told?

 

How do you feel?

 

If youre still cool with finding out AFTER you bought it, fine. More power to ya!

 

Id be pissssed. Anyone else?

 

 

Fortunately this is a scenario I'll never have to concern myself about. Lucky me.

[action1kid]

you know what it comes down to?

 

dealers think restoration removal should not count

collectors think that restoration removal should count

if you own a restored key resto removal shouldnt count

if you own a totally unrestored book resto removal should count...

 

you cannot ignore human bias,,we will need an independent arbitrator.,its hard to ignore our own self interests when involved,,just like anything else in life.

[action1kid]

which would you rather own?

 

ACTION COMICS #1 ACTION COMICS #1

 

CGC 9.4 cgc 9.6

OFF WHITE PAGES OR white pages

[slight restoration removed]

 

BLUE LABLE BLUE LABLE

 

and tell me why you picked one or the other...

[action1kid]

that last post came in all screwed up..ignore it!!!RE///WHICH WOULD YOU RATHER OWN

[action1kid]

what would you rather own?? a blue lable action 1 totally unrestored with off white pages graded at a 9.4 or A blue lable action 1[slight restoration removed]with white pages graded at cgc9.6 and please tell me why you picked each one....

 

can you pro resto removers and neg resto removers hit this with a good debate.

 

lets assume that the 9.6 was origanally known by cgc to of had restoration and had been removed...the 9.4 was totally untouch and virgin..

 

which is more valuble???

 

OF COURSE THESE BOOKS DONT EXSIST,BUT LETS PRETEND THEY DID..

[rob_react]

Everything else being equal (eye appeal, registration, etc.) I'd take the 9.6 without a moment's hesitation.

[action1kid]

THANKS ROB

[FFB]

you know what it comes down to?

 

dealers think restoration removal should not count

collectors think that restoration removal should count

if you own a restored key resto removal shouldnt count

if you own a totally unrestored book resto removal should count...

 

you cannot ignore human bias,,we will need an independent arbitrator.,its hard to ignore our own self interests when involved,,just like anything else in life.

 

I'm a collector, not a dealer. I have never had restoration removed from a book, nor have I ever sold a book where restoration was reversed. Having said that, I would not care in the least whether a missing corner on a comic was caused by the removal of slight color touch or by the hand of an eight year old who was just trying out a new pair of scissors. The corner is gone. The book is not restored. The grade is what it is. End of discussion.

 

I think the vast majority of collectors would agree with me on this issue too.

 

I think that the "disclose prior restoration even if it's gone" viewpoint comes from irrational fear toward restoration. I don't think you would ever get any kind of consensus from any significant portion of the marketplace saying that a book that has had all restoration reversed must carry that warning for the rest of its days.

[FFB]

Everything else being equal (eye appeal, registration, etc.) I'd take the 9.6 without a moment's hesitation.

 

Me too, and anyone who wouldn't is making a bad decision IMO. Even if they were both otherwise equal 9.4s, one with white pages and one with off-white/white pages, I'd take the white paged copy every day of the week for the same or even a little more money, even if it was the copy that used to have a small piece of archival tape sealing a tiny edge tear.

[rob_react]

 

I think that the "disclose prior restoration even if it's gone" viewpoint comes from irrational fear toward restoration. I don't think you would ever get any kind of consensus from any significant portion of the marketplace saying that a book that has had all restoration reversed must carry that warning for the rest of its days.

 

But it has cooties...

[Foolkiller]

I totally agree with FFB on this point, and I've been making a similar argument all along when it comes to restoration. If the resto isn't there anymore, why does it matter? It doesn't affect value... Does it make it a slightly different book than an "original" yes, I suppose so.

 

you know what it comes down to?

 

dealers think restoration removal should not count

collectors think that restoration removal should count

if you own a restored key resto removal shouldnt count

if you own a totally unrestored book resto removal should count...

 

you cannot ignore human bias,,we will need an independent arbitrator.,its hard to ignore our own self interests when involved,,just like anything else in life.

 

I'm a collector, not a dealer. I have never had restoration removed from a book, nor have I ever sold a book where restoration was reversed. Having said that, I would not care in the least whether a missing corner on a comic was caused by the removal of slight color touch or by the hand of an eight year old who was just trying out a new pair of scissors. The corner is gone. The book is not restored. The grade is what it is. End of discussion.

 

I think the vast majority of collectors would agree with me on this issue too.

 

I think that the "disclose prior restoration even if it's gone" viewpoint comes from irrational fear toward restoration. I don't think you would ever get any kind of consensus from any significant portion of the marketplace saying that a book that has had all restoration reversed must carry that warning for the rest of its days.

[FFB]

 

I think that the "disclose prior restoration even if it's gone" viewpoint comes from irrational fear toward restoration. I don't think you would ever get any kind of consensus from any significant portion of the marketplace saying that a book that has had all restoration reversed must carry that warning for the rest of its days.

 

But it has cooties...

 

I like cooties!

[action1kid]

thank you for your opinions,can i get a few more on the action1 9.4 vs 9.6

[rob_react]

I totally agree with FFB on this point, and I've been making a similar argument all along when it comes to restoration. If the resto isn't there anymore, why does it matter?

 

Cooties.

 

And there is no Cootie Shot for a comic that has been restored. Once it's been restored, it's always got the filthy, demonic stench of restoration emanating from its very pages and no removal is ever going to change that.

 

Of course, I heard that handling restored comics is one way to transmit Ebola and the danger doesn't go away once the restoration has been removed. That's definitely something to consider.

[Foolkiller]

i'll take the 9.6

[Aman619]

you know what it comes down to?

 

dealers think restoration removal should not count

collectors think that restoration removal should count

if you own a restored key resto removal shouldnt count

if you own a totally unrestored book resto removal should count...

 

you cannot ignore human bias,,we will need an independent arbitrator.,its hard to ignore our own self interests when involved,,just like anything else in life.

 

I'm a collector, not a dealer. I have never had restoration removed from a book, nor have I ever sold a book where restoration was reversed. Having said that, I would not care in the least whether a missing corner on a comic was caused by the removal of slight color touch or by the hand of an eight year old who was just trying out a new pair of scissors. The corner is gone. The book is not restored. The grade is what it is. End of discussion.

 

I think the vast majority of collectors would agree with me on this issue too.

 

I think that the "disclose prior restoration even if it's gone" viewpoint comes from irrational fear toward restoration. I don't think you would ever get any kind of consensus from any significant portion of the marketplace saying that a book that has had all restoration reversed must carry that warning for the rest of its days.

 

stop repeating yourself!! You sound like a broken record.

[Foolkiller]

If we stopped all broken records from posting, very few people would be left.

[FFB]

you know what it comes down to?

 

dealers think restoration removal should not count

collectors think that restoration removal should count

if you own a restored key resto removal shouldnt count

if you own a totally unrestored book resto removal should count...

 

you cannot ignore human bias,,we will need an independent arbitrator.,its hard to ignore our own self interests when involved,,just like anything else in life.

 

I'm a collector, not a dealer. I have never had restoration removed from a book, nor have I ever sold a book where restoration was reversed. Having said that, I would not care in the least whether a missing corner on a comic was caused by the removal of slight color touch or by the hand of an eight year old who was just trying out a new pair of scissors. The corner is gone. The book is not restored. The grade is what it is. End of discussion.

 

I think the vast majority of collectors would agree with me on this issue too.

 

I think that the "disclose prior restoration even if it's gone" viewpoint comes from irrational fear toward restoration. I don't think you would ever get any kind of consensus from any significant portion of the marketplace saying that a book that has had all restoration reversed must carry that warning for the rest of its days.

 

stop repeating yourself!! You sound like a broken record.

 

I was answering his statement that all dealers think it shouldn't count and all collectors think it should. What I was not doing and won't keep doing is arguing with you over whether a book with restoration reversed is a "tainted" book or not.

[Aman619]

whatever.....