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Restoring A Restored Book Back To A Blue Label?

Started by N e r V,

46 posts in this topic

The-Collector

The-Collector

Posted
Posted
Un-restoring is restoration,

 

There. I said it

 

I cannot understand for the life of me why someone would Have color touch scraped away so a comic looks like a cat played with it.

 

I will not buy a mutilated unrestored book if I can ascertain that restoration was removed. :sumo:

 

I can see very minor being removed as noted but its still a restored and "un-restored" - restored book.

 

X1000000

 

There are several unrestored Sups 1 with big white scars on the spine and other sections where ct has been removed. That you would only pay 40k for a mid grade restored but the same book which is less presentable (often with the cover detached) you would pay 90k for is totally insane.

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AJD

AJD

Posted
Posted
Un-restoring is restoration,

 

There. I said it

 

I cannot understand for the life of me why someone would Have color touch scraped away so a comic looks like a cat played with it.

 

I will not buy a mutilated unrestored book if I can ascertain that restoration was removed. :sumo:

 

I can see very minor being removed as noted but its still a restored and "un-restored" - restored book.

 

Absolutely agree. The fact that a book that is damaged further can sell for more is a bit of an indictment on our hobby IMHO.

 

 

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The_SandMan

The_SandMan

Posted
Posted
Even some reglossing can be removed if it's water soluble. So basically everything except a cleaning can technically be removed.

 

One of the major books in my collection had amatuer resto removed which included tape, CT, and reglossing. It was then professionally restored with all work by Matt and Kenny. The final result was wonderful!

 

Just learned something new. Thank u

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Larryw7

Larryw7

Posted
Posted
Un-restoring is restoration,

 

There. I said it

 

I cannot understand for the life of me why someone would Have color touch scraped away so a comic looks like a cat played with it.

 

I will not buy a mutilated unrestored book if I can ascertain that restoration was removed. :sumo:

 

I can see very minor being removed as noted but its still a restored and "un-restored" - restored book.

 

Agreed 100%.

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gadzukes

gadzukes

Posted
Posted
Un-restoring is restoration,

 

There. I said it

 

I cannot understand for the life of me why someone would Have color touch scraped away so a comic looks like a cat played with it.

 

I will not buy a mutilated unrestored book if I can ascertain that restoration was removed. :sumo:

 

I can see very minor being removed as noted but its still a restored and "un-restored" - restored book.

 

Agreed 100%.

 

Here's an example when CT removal works well: The small line coming out of the 12c price is basically the only CT removal. It really didn't hurt the look of the book.

get-attachment-3_zps1t0n3s4l.jpg

Here's an example of a CT resto removal that became a little more out of control once the CT was found. I thought it was only going to be the big line, and I didn't think the line was going to be as wide as it turned out. But then Matt discovered CT in the word box on the right side of the cover. And then down in the Things foot, and along the bottom right of the cover, and then in the monster's arm on the spine. Ugh! I think the book is still ok (I've kept it for my collection), but the visual look of the book is a little disappointing. Btw... if you can look away from the ct removal, the rest of the book is 7.0 or nicer.

get-attachment-3aspx_zps70fae3ea.jpeg

And then here is an example of when CT removal has gone too far "cat scratch fever" on this one. I think it was a 6.0 purple when I bought it, and I was hoping to get a 4.0 minimum on it, but you see what happened. I really wish I had left it alone.

get-attachment-24aspx_zpsd4fdc6c2.jpeg

 

The key is to 100% know how much CT needs to be removed. If it's just a dot or a small line then go for it. if it's many spots then you better think hard, because where there's a few spots, there's probably many more spots.

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N e r V

N e r V

Posted
  • Author
Posted

Ugh.

 

Does the person doing the removal not give a nice big warning ahead of time what the results are likely to look like? Seems it would be pretty easy in many cases to give you a heads up.

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gadzukes

gadzukes

Posted
Posted
Ugh.

 

Does the person doing the removal not give a nice big warning ahead of time what the results are likely to look like? Seems it would be pretty easy in many cases to give you a heads up.

 

Matt tries to do the minimal amount to still get a Blue label (it's better to do too little than too much). When I bought the Af 15 3.0 (it was a 6.0 purple) it had already had had some CT removed. The label said "very small amount of CT" so Matt thought he could just remove a teeny bit more and get the blue. It came back as a 4.0 purple (cgc still saw some CT). Matt conferred with them to find the exact location of the remaining CT and I told him to go ahead and take it off. I thought I'd retain a 4.0 or atleast a 3.5, but it went down to 3.0 Blue. I should have left it alone. I can't blame Matt, he let me know what was going on. I saw that it was starting to look bad but I was focused on getting a blue label so I let it go too far. I think if Matt would have seen it before it had had any ct removed he may have advised me differently, but since the removal work had already been started I decided to go all the way.

 

The FF 1 was kind of the same. It had already had some CT removal done to it.

 

If I ever do CT removal again I am going to really find out how many spots. If it's multiple spots then I will skip it.

 

I also had a Sgt Fury 1 9.0 purple with CT. That was the only other one that I had the CT removed. It came back as a 7.5 Blue and I was very satisfied.

 

Bottom line..... you win some and you lose some.

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Comicdey

Comicdey

Posted
Posted

The Pence copy is a gem and I probably wouldn't have noticed. To each their own on the other two Oouch.

 

 

 

I have a GA book that had ct on a corner that I found out had been clipped off before reslabbing.

Just another way to remove restoration. Partial trim? Not sure I would have bought it had I known but realistically its just missing a piece.

 

Still bugs me knowing it was a restored copy though :lol:

 

 

 

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TimelyFinds

TimelyFinds

Posted
Posted

I took off some glue from a 3.5 restored USA 1 to get it blue label which detached the cover and brought the grade down to 1.8. Knew it would detach and was fine work by ccs. some reason I regret doing it, sometime just let the book be

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path4play

path4play

Posted
Posted

So, let me get this straight. We have folks buying minor restored books and restoring them to a 9.6 for a big time flip, and we have folks buying same type of book and unrestoring them for a big time flip. Seems no one wants the minor restored, yet that's what seems to be in demand by the franken-restorers and the un-restorer reversers?

 

 

:makepoint:

 

 

 

 

 

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Straw-Man

Straw-Man

Posted
Posted
The Pence copy is a gem and I probably wouldn't have noticed. To each their own on the other two Oouch.

 

 

 

I have a GA book that had ct on a corner that I found out had been clipped off before reslabbing.

Just another way to remove restoration. Partial trim? Not sure I would have bought it had I known but realistically its just missing a piece.

 

Still bugs me knowing it was a restored copy though :lol:

 

 

 

exactly. would anyone consider one coverless copy more desirable than another coverless copy because of the knowledge that one of the books, years ago, had a cover, long gone, that had work?

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G.A.tor

G.A.tor

Posted
Posted
Un-restoring is restoration,

 

There. I said it

 

I cannot understand for the life of me why someone would Have color touch scraped away so a comic looks like a cat played with it.

 

I will not buy a mutilated unrestored book if I can ascertain that restoration was removed. :sumo:

 

I can see very minor being removed as noted but its still a restored and "un-restored" - restored book.

 

Absolutely agree. The fact that a book that is damaged further can sell for more is a bit of an indictment on our hobby IMHO.

 

so if you only scrape the ct off of a book, and return it to its previously un color touched state, then in essence, it is back to its unrestored state before it was restored... so confused lol

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Straw-Man

Straw-Man

Posted
Posted
Un-restoring is restoration,

 

There. I said it

 

I cannot understand for the life of me why someone would Have color touch scraped away so a comic looks like a cat played with it.

 

I will not buy a mutilated unrestored book if I can ascertain that restoration was removed. :sumo:

 

I can see very minor being removed as noted but its still a restored and "un-restored" - restored book.

 

Absolutely agree. The fact that a book that is damaged further can sell for more is a bit of an indictment on our hobby IMHO.

 

so if you only scrape the ct off of a book, and return it to its previously un color touched state, then in essence, it is back to its unrestored state before it was restored... so confused lol

 

i'm with you buddy, but even harder to comprehend: on monday, an unrestored book has a little b.c. tear. on tuesday, rice paper seals it--restored. on wed., you have the r.p. taken off, and now it's exactly like it was on monday. but to some, it is now stigmatized. very odd, to my way of thinking. i can assure you i could never convince a jury of the wednesday book being something less desirable than the monday book, as in this hypo they're identical. and i've convinced some juries of some pretty long reaches.

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AJD

AJD

Posted
Posted
Un-restoring is restoration,

 

There. I said it

 

I cannot understand for the life of me why someone would Have color touch scraped away so a comic looks like a cat played with it.

 

I will not buy a mutilated unrestored book if I can ascertain that restoration was removed. :sumo:

 

I can see very minor being removed as noted but its still a restored and "un-restored" - restored book.

 

Absolutely agree. The fact that a book that is damaged further can sell for more is a bit of an indictment on our hobby IMHO.

 

so if you only scrape the ct off of a book, and return it to its previously un color touched state, then in essence, it is back to its unrestored state before it was restored... so confused lol

 

i'm with you buddy, but even harder to comprehend: on monday, an unrestored book has a little b.c. tear. on tuesday, rice paper seals it--restored. on wed., you have the r.p. taken off, and now it's exactly like it was on monday. but to some, it is now stigmatized. very odd, to my way of thinking. i can assure you i could never convince a jury of the wednesday book being something less desirable than the monday book, as in this hypo they're identical. and i've convinced some juries of some pretty long reaches.

 

That's why I made the distinction about reversible professional restoration in my original post. Your example is fine, and I agree that the Monday book and the Wednesday books are to all intents and purposes the same. The thing about scraping off colour touch is that there's always some bonding between the colour and the paper - if there wasn't the colour wouldn't have 'taken' in the first place. Ergo, scraping = damage.

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Comicdey

Comicdey

Posted
Posted
Un-restoring is restoration,

 

There. I said it

 

I cannot understand for the life of me why someone would Have color touch scraped away so a comic looks like a cat played with it.

 

I will not buy a mutilated unrestored book if I can ascertain that restoration was removed. :sumo:

 

I can see very minor being removed as noted but its still a restored and "un-restored" - restored book.

 

Absolutely agree. The fact that a book that is damaged further can sell for more is a bit of an indictment on our hobby IMHO.

 

so if you only scrape the ct off of a book, and return it to its previously un color touched state, then in essence, it is back to its unrestored state before it was restored... so confused lol

 

i'm with you buddy, but even harder to comprehend: on monday, an unrestored book has a little b.c. tear. on tuesday, rice paper seals it--restored. on wed., you have the r.p. taken off, and now it's exactly like it was on monday. but to some, it is now stigmatized. very odd, to my way of thinking. i can assure you i could never convince a jury of the wednesday book being something less desirable than the monday book, as in this hypo they're identical. and i've convinced some juries of some pretty long reaches.

 

no jury needed, i can see all points...you reach for an example that I can generally agree with in terms of rice paper install and removal, but the method of rice paper removal is up for debate.

 

The act of scratching the heck out of a book to remove color touch is what really bothers me as it's obvious that someone "worked" on the book to bring it back to it's "unrestored glory".

 

If I can't tell that it's from someones obvious attempt to unrestore, then no harm no foul, but to take a sub crease book, color touch it and call it restored, then pay someone to "work on the book by scratching it all off" just bugs me.

 

It's all levels of the same fight to garner more value through some form of manipulation or another. If I could take my AF 15 and scratch in STAN LEE's name onto it and sell it for 10X the value of an unscratched book, would it do it...."heck no" until it was time to sell it.

 

 

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