General discussion thread - keep the other threads clean 29 29

[Bio-Rupp]

now we've got to press books to reach the grades advertised in a sales thread?

This is indeed disturbing. May be too early to call it a trend, but I've noticed an increasing number of raw listings where a seller seems to be asking more than the value of a book in its current grade because of pressing potential (for example, a seller might list a book as a 7.0 and point out that it could probably press higher, and then post a BIN price as if it's a 7.5'ish). If you think about human nature, this would almost have been a predictable consequence of the introduction of pressing into the marketplace - it's a shame - I really hope that the majority of us comic collectors resist this nonsense so that it doesn't become the norm...

 

Not the first time this has happened. Been going on here for years

[miraclemet]

Is your beef more directly with CGC's use of the qualified grade

I have absolutely no beef with CGC's use of Qualified Grades.

 

I think his beef is that sellers are pricing the books much closer to the grade that CGC lets you pretend it is rather than the grade it actually is.

Close, but not quite.

 

As far as I'm concerned, a seller has the right to ask whatever he/she wants for a book, regardless of whether that book is CGC-certified (blue, green, purple, yellow) or raw. However, if a seller has a book that's received a green label because it's missing one or more pages, it's flat-out deceptive to quote GPA for a blue label book of the same grade, a purple label book of the same grade, or even another green label book of the same grade which is qualified because of another defect (such as a blown staple, a detached centerfold, or an unwitnessed creator signature).

 

Buyers around here need to understand that books with missing pages are in POOR condition. It doesn't matter whether the book is raw or carries a CGC grade of Qualified 9.0. Do not be taken in by any seller who suggests otherwise. That is all.

 

 

appreciate the perspective and clarification zz.

 

I agree if someone is quoting GPA universal prices for a green label book that'd not just deceptive its outright dishonest. And you are right that all green labels are not created equal, so even using GLOD GPA info is not wholly accurate, its closer (since its at least the right catagory of books) but since theres a wide range of books that fall under the Qualified catagory it is tough. And it would still get an INCOMPLETE tag, regardless of the label its getting...

[Speedy-D]

Is your beef more directly with CGC's use of the qualified grade

I have absolutely no beef with CGC's use of Qualified Grades.

 

I think his beef is that sellers are pricing the books much closer to the grade that CGC lets you pretend it is rather than the grade it actually is.

Close, but not quite.

 

As far as I'm concerned, a seller has the right to ask whatever he/she wants for a book, regardless of whether that book is CGC-certified (blue, green, purple, yellow) or raw. However, if a seller has a book that's received a green label because it's missing one or more pages, it's flat-out deceptive to quote GPA for a blue label book of the same grade, a purple label book of the same grade, or even another green label book of the same grade which is qualified because of another defect (such as a blown staple, a detached centerfold, or an unwitnessed creator signature).

 

Buyers around here need to understand that books with missing pages are in POOR condition. It doesn't matter whether the book is raw or carries a CGC grade of Qualified 9.0. Do not be taken in by any seller who suggests otherwise. That is all.

 

 

appreciate the perspective and clarification zz.

 

I agree if someone is quoting GPA universal prices for a green label book that'd not just deceptive its outright dishonest. And you are right that all green labels are not created equal, so even using GLOD GPA info is not wholly accurate, its closer (since its at least the right catagory of books) but since theres a wide range of books that fall under the Qualified catagory it is tough. And it would still get an INCOMPLETE tag, regardless of the label its getting...

link?

[miraclemet]

now we've got to press books to reach the grades advertised in a sales thread?

link?

 

http://boards.collectors-society.com/ubbthreads.php?ubb=showflat&Number=6802762#Post6802762

Yeesh. He's also got the PP 3%, and prices 25% above his own quoted GPA.

 

This seller really annoyed me when I saw his sales tactics. Quoting GPA on raw books is bad enough but his grading was terrible. He was giving a 9.4, highest graded, to a book with the BC coupon filled in. I can't believe somebody actually bought a book from this guy.

 

Action 258 9.4 last gpa 9.2 for $1005 this would be highest graded my price $1344

 

Wonder if he has a 12 month return/refund policy once the book gets graded lower than his advertised pressed grade.

[JazzMan]

now we've got to press books to reach the grades advertised in a sales thread?

This is indeed disturbing. May be too early to call it a trend, but I've noticed an increasing number of raw listings where a seller seems to be asking more than the value of a book in its current grade because of pressing potential (for example, a seller might list a book as a 7.0 and point out that it could probably press higher, and then post a BIN price as if it's a 7.5'ish). If you think about human nature, this would almost have been a predictable consequence of the introduction of pressing into the marketplace - it's a shame - I really hope that the majority of us comic collectors resist this nonsense so that it doesn't become the norm...

 

Not the first time this has happened. Been going on here for years

 

If I recall correctly, there was a dealer on here that was selling books quoting GPA of the book after a good press job. So nothing new to see, just continue about your business. There are not the books you are looking for. Move on.

[Pitboss]

How hard is it to post pics of what you have for sale? Lazy Bastiges

[gyro-1]

[PovertyRow]

I sure am getting tired of sellers pushing Qualified (green label) books with missing pages as anything other than what they really are. This particular defect is not open to debate. Books with missing pages (story or non-story) are POOR. It doesn't matter whether it received a grade of Qualified 9.0 or Qualified 2.0.

 

Attention all potential buyers: if a book is missing one or more pages, it's in POOR condition (that's CGC 0.5 for you young'uns out there).

 

 

I've never heard of a Qualified 2.0. It goes against the principal of Qualified: a major defect on an otherwise high grade book.

 

You're saying a book that would grade out as a 9.8 White Page is in the same condition of a Universal 0.5, which could include a missing page in ADDITION to a myriad of accumulated defects such as major tears, brown/brittle pages, extensive writing on the covers and inside, detached cover etc etc etc. So a book with all of these aforementioned defects would be the same as a 9.8W with a missing page?

 

 

[JazzMan]

I sure am getting tired of sellers pushing Qualified (green label) books with missing pages as anything other than what they really are. This particular defect is not open to debate. Books with missing pages (story or non-story) are POOR. It doesn't matter whether it received a grade of Qualified 9.0 or Qualified 2.0.

 

Attention all potential buyers: if a book is missing one or more pages, it's in POOR condition (that's CGC 0.5 for you young'uns out there).

 

 

I've never heard of a Qualified 2.0. It goes against the principal of Qualified: a major defect on an otherwise high grade book.

 

You're saying a book that would grade out as a 9.8 White Page is in the same condition of a Universal 0.5, which could include a missing page in ADDITION to a myriad of accumulated defects such as major tears, brown/brittle pages, extensive writing on the covers and inside, detached cover etc etc etc. So a book with all of these aforementioned defects would be the same as a 9.8W with a missing page?

 

 

There's 0.5 Qualified - Married covers or Incomplete books can garner that.

[JazzMan]

I sure am getting tired of sellers pushing Qualified (green label) books with missing pages as anything other than what they really are. This particular defect is not open to debate. Books with missing pages (story or non-story) are POOR. It doesn't matter whether it received a grade of Qualified 9.0 or Qualified 2.0.

 

Attention all potential buyers: if a book is missing one or more pages, it's in POOR condition (that's CGC 0.5 for you young'uns out there).

 

 

I've never heard of a Qualified 2.0. It goes against the principal of Qualified: a major defect on an otherwise high grade book.

 

You're saying a book that would grade out as a 9.8 White Page is in the same condition of a Universal 0.5, which could include a missing page in ADDITION to a myriad of accumulated defects such as major tears, brown/brittle pages, extensive writing on the covers and inside, detached cover etc etc etc. So a book with all of these aforementioned defects would be the same as a 9.8W with a missing page?

 

 

There's 0.5 Qualified - Married covers or Incomplete books can garner that.

 

For example:

 

Certification #: 0151899001

Title: Amazing Fantasy

Issue: 15

Issue Date: 8/62

Issue Year: 1962

Publisher: Marvel Comics

Grade: 0.5

Pedigree: INCOMPLETE

Page Quality: OFF-WHITE

Label Text: STAPLES REPLACED. (Last page missing does not affect story. Moderate amount of tape on cover & interior.) INCOMPLETE.

Grade Date: 04/16/2008

Category: Qualified

Art Comments: Stan Lee story

Steve Ditko art

Jack Kirby cover

Key Comments: Origin & 1st appearance of Spider-Man

(Peter Parker).

1st appearance of Uncle Ben & Aunt May.

[zzutak]

I've never heard of a Qualified 2.0. It goes against the principal of Qualified: a major defect on an otherwise high grade book.

The point I was trying to make has nothing to do with my rather arbitrary choice of 2.0. I could have just as easily written 3.0, 4.0, 5.0, etc. That being said, the Heritage Archives include literally scores of CGC-certified books with grades of Qualified 4.0, 3.5, 3.0, 2.5, 2.0, and even 1.5.

 

You're saying a book that would grade out as a 9.8 White Page is in the same condition of a Universal 0.5, which could include a missing page in ADDITION to a myriad of accumulated defects such as major tears, brown/brittle pages, extensive writing on the covers and inside, detached cover etc etc etc. So a book with all of these aforementioned defects would be the same as a 9.8W with a missing page?

I'm saying that an otherwise flawless book with one or more missing pages is incomplete and therefore in POOR condition. I sincerely hope you don't disagree.

[Old Fashion PB and J]

Some of these new sellers are real A-Holez what is with the deal of trying to rip off forum members who arent aware of FMV?

[Speedy-D]

Some of these new sellers are real A-Holez what is with the deal of trying to rip off forum members who arent aware of FMV?

link?

[PovertyRow]

I sure am getting tired of sellers pushing Qualified (green label) books with missing pages as anything other than what they really are. This particular defect is not open to debate. Books with missing pages (story or non-story) are POOR. It doesn't matter whether it received a grade of Qualified 9.0 or Qualified 2.0.

 

Attention all potential buyers: if a book is missing one or more pages, it's in POOR condition (that's CGC 0.5 for you young'uns out there).

 

 

I've never heard of a Qualified 2.0. It goes against the principal of Qualified: a major defect on an otherwise high grade book.

 

You're saying a book that would grade out as a 9.8 White Page is in the same condition of a Universal 0.5, which could include a missing page in ADDITION to a myriad of accumulated defects such as major tears, brown/brittle pages, extensive writing on the covers and inside, detached cover etc etc etc. So a book with all of these aforementioned defects would be the same as a 9.8W with a missing page?

 

 

There's 0.5 Qualified - Married covers or Incomplete books can garner that.

 

For example:

 

Certification #: 0151899001

Title: Amazing Fantasy

Issue: 15

Issue Date: 8/62

Issue Year: 1962

Publisher: Marvel Comics

Grade: 0.5

Pedigree: INCOMPLETE

Page Quality: OFF-WHITE

Label Text: STAPLES REPLACED. (Last page missing does not affect story. Moderate amount of tape on cover & interior.) INCOMPLETE.

Grade Date: 04/16/2008

Category: Qualified

Art Comments: Stan Lee story

Steve Ditko art

Jack Kirby cover

Key Comments: Origin & 1st appearance of Spider-Man

(Peter Parker).

1st appearance of Uncle Ben & Aunt May.

 

That makes no sense to me. Aunt May and Uncle Ben first appeared in STRANGE TALES 97!

 

I have to wonder if CGC mislabeled that as a Qualified. It makes absolutely no sense to have a 0.5 Green Label.

[Speedy-D]

How hard is it to post pics of what you have for sale? Lazy Bastiges

JOEY GUNZ ( ) perchance?

[mschmidt]

I sure am getting tired of sellers pushing Qualified (green label) books with missing pages as anything other than what they really are. This particular defect is not open to debate. Books with missing pages (story or non-story) are POOR. It doesn't matter whether it received a grade of Qualified 9.0 or Qualified 2.0.

 

Attention all potential buyers: if a book is missing one or more pages, it's in POOR condition (that's CGC 0.5 for you young'uns out there).

 

 

I've never heard of a Qualified 2.0. It goes against the principal of Qualified: a major defect on an otherwise high grade book.

 

You're saying a book that would grade out as a 9.8 White Page is in the same condition of a Universal 0.5, which could include a missing page in ADDITION to a myriad of accumulated defects such as major tears, brown/brittle pages, extensive writing on the covers and inside, detached cover etc etc etc. So a book with all of these aforementioned defects would be the same as a 9.8W with a missing page?

 

 

There's 0.5 Qualified - Married covers or Incomplete books can garner that.

 

For example:

 

Certification #: 0151899001

Title: Amazing Fantasy

Issue: 15

Issue Date: 8/62

Issue Year: 1962

Publisher: Marvel Comics

Grade: 0.5

Pedigree: INCOMPLETE

Page Quality: OFF-WHITE

Label Text: STAPLES REPLACED. (Last page missing does not affect story. Moderate amount of tape on cover & interior.) INCOMPLETE.

Grade Date: 04/16/2008

Category: Qualified

Art Comments: Stan Lee story

Steve Ditko art

Jack Kirby cover

Key Comments: Origin & 1st appearance of Spider-Man

(Peter Parker).

1st appearance of Uncle Ben & Aunt May.

 

This book has been brought up before - it's a mislabelled Universal.

[PovertyRow]

I've never heard of a Qualified 2.0. It goes against the principal of Qualified: a major defect on an otherwise high grade book.

The point I was trying to make has nothing to do with my rather arbitrary choice of 2.0. I could have just as easily written 3.0, 4.0, 5.0, etc. That being said, the Heritage Archives include literally scores of CGC-certified books with grades of Qualified 4.0, 3.5, 3.0, 2.5, 2.0, and even 1.5.

 

You're saying a book that would grade out as a 9.8 White Page is in the same condition of a Universal 0.5, which could include a missing page in ADDITION to a myriad of accumulated defects such as major tears, brown/brittle pages, extensive writing on the covers and inside, detached cover etc etc etc. So a book with all of these aforementioned defects would be the same as a 9.8W with a missing page?

I'm saying that an otherwise flawless book with a missing centerfold is incomplete and therefore in POOR condition. I sincerely hope you don't disagree.

 

I do tend to disagree when it comes to the term "condition". Structurally a 9.4W with a missing page, for example, is going to be in a hell of a lot better condition than a true 0.5 with a missing page.

 

Lower grades often indicate more structural impact. And a 0.5 book is going to be in extremely sorry shape. I never understood how a HG book with just one defect

 

Actually I may have been the one for getting the ball rolling on what ultimately became Qualified so you can possibly blame me, at least in part.

 

When the OS Grading Guide came out in 1992 I was on the phone with Gary Carter the next day. We spent a long time and a few conversations talking grading criteria and I pointed out that I did not understand how a high grade book with a name on the cover would be graded the same as a VG, as that was then the highest grade allowed with writing. I pointed out the same thing I am now: a structurally/aesthetically beautiful book with one single defect is glommed in with other low grade books that - and here is the main point - can have that same defect but also a lot more accumulated defects.

 

Gary was intrigued by the idea and brought it up with others involved in the guide. So I may have had a hand in that. .

 

 

[Old Fashion PB and J]

Some of these new sellers are real A-Holez what is with the deal of trying to rip off forum members who arent aware of FMV?

link?

I don't think you need one. Just look at the threads where the lowest amount of books are selling.

[Speedy-D]

Some of these new sellers are real A-Holez what is with the deal of trying to rip off forum members who arent aware of FMV?

link?

I don't think you need one realize how lazy you are. Just look at the threads where the lowest amount of books are selling do a small amount of work.

I can't!

[JazzMan]

I sure am getting tired of sellers pushing Qualified (green label) books with missing pages as anything other than what they really are. This particular defect is not open to debate. Books with missing pages (story or non-story) are POOR. It doesn't matter whether it received a grade of Qualified 9.0 or Qualified 2.0.

 

Attention all potential buyers: if a book is missing one or more pages, it's in POOR condition (that's CGC 0.5 for you young'uns out there).

 

 

I've never heard of a Qualified 2.0. It goes against the principal of Qualified: a major defect on an otherwise high grade book.

 

You're saying a book that would grade out as a 9.8 White Page is in the same condition of a Universal 0.5, which could include a missing page in ADDITION to a myriad of accumulated defects such as major tears, brown/brittle pages, extensive writing on the covers and inside, detached cover etc etc etc. So a book with all of these aforementioned defects would be the same as a 9.8W with a missing page?

 

 

There's 0.5 Qualified - Married covers or Incomplete books can garner that.

 

For example:

 

Certification #: 0151899001

Title: Amazing Fantasy

Issue: 15

Issue Date: 8/62

Issue Year: 1962

Publisher: Marvel Comics

Grade: 0.5

Pedigree: INCOMPLETE

Page Quality: OFF-WHITE

Label Text: STAPLES REPLACED. (Last page missing does not affect story. Moderate amount of tape on cover & interior.) INCOMPLETE.

Grade Date: 04/16/2008

Category: Qualified

Art Comments: Stan Lee story

Steve Ditko art

Jack Kirby cover

Key Comments: Origin & 1st appearance of Spider-Man

(Peter Parker).

1st appearance of Uncle Ben & Aunt May.

 

This book has been brought up before - it's a mislabelled Universal.

 

Sure about that? There are other examples.