paperheart Posted January 30 Share Posted January 30 On 1/30/2024 at 12:28 PM, Chip Cataldo said: Small failure, large failure...all still means failure. If a film has a budget of $200 million and makes $150 million total yet had "legs" in theaters for 10+ weeks, who cares? It's a failure.. In some bizarro universe, studios spend $350M all in with the intention of losing a little and not a lot Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bosco685 Posted January 30 Author Share Posted January 30 On 1/30/2024 at 4:25 PM, paperheart said: In some bizarro universe, studios spend $350M all in with the intention of losing a little and not a lot Some bizarro universe, your moderation buddy asks you if this is a film you have watched for yourself before continuously rejoicing its demise. Odd, I know. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Hulksdaddy1 Posted January 31 Share Posted January 31 kimik and Bosco685 2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bosco685 Posted January 31 Author Share Posted January 31 On 1/30/2024 at 9:10 PM, Hulksdaddy1 said: Other than people celebrating the failure of a film they didn't even take the time to see - including laughing about it? Another day in La La Land. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Gatsby77 Posted January 31 Share Posted January 31 On 1/30/2024 at 3:19 PM, kimik said: Sorry, but it is an incorrect assumption linking A2 to the share price performance of WBD at all. WBD is tanking because AT&T dumped a bunch of debt into the spinoff (smart move by AT&T), and with interest rates rising they are going to struggle to cover the payments. If I recall correctly they had $40-$50B in debt when the companies were merged. It was a smart/dirty play by AT&T depending on your perspective (i.e. do you own WBD or not). Crossing $400M WW in the current superhero film environment is win for A2. Anyone who seriously expected it to hit A1 numbers must be smoking whatever Zaslav did before agreeing to AT&Ts terms. No. The debt load has been public knowledge for more than a year and was already priced in. The largest recent share price drop happened in November after the last earnings call, when the company disclosed drops in both advertising and a loss of streaming subscribers. The question is what material events have happened to move the share price over the last 5 weeks (i.e., since Aquaman 2's release - a period, incidentally, during which interest rates have dropped). There's an argument that the share price had an artificial bump close to Aquaman 2's release on rumors of a potential Paramount / WBD merger that now seems unlikely. I'd buy that. But other major events include: Barbie Oscar nominations Tom Cruise announcing his non-exclusive deal w/ the studio Aquaman (ahem!) underperforming Wells Fargo downgrading it yesterday, citing negative trends in TV & streaming Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Chip Cataldo Posted January 31 Share Posted January 31 (edited) On 1/31/2024 at 9:25 AM, Bosco685 said: Other than people celebrating the failure of a film they didn't even take the time to see - including laughing about it? I'm not trying to be a jerk when I ask this, but I'm curious... So what? So what if someone wants to trash something they haven't seen? I have ZERO intentions of seeing the Madame Web movie. I've seen the trailer and a few clips and I think it's dumb looking. Furthermore, the fact that they're making this instead of, IMHO of course, much more worthy & deserving comic characters is mind-boggling to me. It's like in football when a team needs a first down and they don't get the ball to their best player. They try to get it to some backup. When they don't get the first down, I tell my TV..."Serves them right." Edited January 31 by Chip Cataldo Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bosco685 Posted January 31 Author Share Posted January 31 On 1/31/2024 at 12:22 PM, Chip Cataldo said: I'm not trying to be a jerk when I ask this, but I'm curious... So what? So what if someone wants to trash something they haven't seen? I have ZERO intentions of seeing the Madame Web movie. I've seen the trailer and a few clips and I think it's dumb looking. Furthermore, the fact that they're making this instead of, IMHO of course, much more worthy & deserving comic characters is mind-boggling to me. It's like in football when a team needs a first down and they don't get the ball to their best player. They try to get it to some backup. When they don't get the first down, I tell my TV..."Serves them right." No worries asking questions. But from your limited return back, you are out of touch with the trends over the past year here alone. Though with your comment "a bomb is a bomb" let's be honest - you have a mindset already of what is reasonable. Multiple movies have come out where the reaction out of the gate was "DESTROY"! Including with Avatar 2 there was excitement how far off the mark it would land below Avatar (2009). To the point if anything positive was posted, two individuals felt it was their mission to counter such mentions. Or even when it came out Avatar 2 and 3 were shot back-to-back leading to the budget, a mission to prove what the news and interviews indicated had to be false. Now one of those same individuals on multiple occassions had made it their concern how frequently I post in this forum and in threads as well. Like that is their business to worry about. With all that culminating together, it's clear the intent is only their views matter and if they view something as failing and bad we just need to accept their opinions are what really matters. Even with your comment the other day about the movie analysts being wrong with his metrics, reality was he isn't. You just had the mindset a "bomb is a bomb" and no matter the box office trends, ignore all those details. Just call it a bomb. Not to be a jerk - but that's the reality of the atmosphere being created on here. Yet then moderation steps in and acts like none of that other behavior occurred disrupting discussions - what matters is the two individuals were not fully allowed to swamp a thread with detractions as "sharing your opinions". Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Chip Cataldo Posted January 31 Share Posted January 31 On 1/31/2024 at 2:21 PM, Bosco685 said: No worries asking questions. But from your limited return back, you are out of touch with the trends over the past year here alone. Though with your comment "a bomb is a bomb" let's be honest - you have a mindset already of what is reasonable. I'm not out of touch with anything, my friend. Just because I haven't posted doesn't mean I wasn't reading on almost a daily basis. I saw all the attacks, all the arguing, all the BS that this forum is always capable of. I don't understand that, but I know how this place is. Toxic. My mindset is that if it isn't making a profit and losing money, it's a "bomb." That movie guy needs to stop with the "it's got legs" garbage when all the legs in the world won't make the movie NOT a bomb. That's my point. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bosco685 Posted January 31 Author Share Posted January 31 (edited) On 1/31/2024 at 2:33 PM, Chip Cataldo said: I'm not out of touch with anything, my friend. Just because I haven't posted doesn't mean I wasn't reading on almost a daily basis. I saw all the attacks, all the arguing, all the BS that this forum is always capable of. I don't understand that, but I know how this place is. Toxic. My mindset is that if it isn't making a profit and losing money, it's a "bomb." That movie guy needs to stop with the "it's got legs" garbage when all the legs in the world won't make the movie NOT a bomb. That's my point. Why does he have stop - because you say so? You didn't even know the metrics and assumed he was wrong and I had to show you the reference. Kind of like you noting an actress isn't pretty enough for a role. You can state that. But others can state the opposite. Edited January 31 by Bosco685 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Chip Cataldo Posted January 31 Share Posted January 31 On 1/31/2024 at 2:36 PM, Bosco685 said: Why does he have stop - because you say so? You didn't even know the metrics and assumed he was wrong and I had to show you the refence. Kind of like you noting an actress isn't pretty enough for a role. You can state that. But others can state the opposite. Lol. Come on, now. I'm not suggesting that anyone NEEDS to do anything because I say so. It's just an expression. It's like saying that Joe Rogan needs to "go away" for whatever BS he's sprouting at the moment. I don't expect him to actually disappear. I don't need to know the metrics. If the movie has a certain budget, like $200 million...and then an advertising budget of $100 million...and then the total box office after 6 weeks is $150 million, it does not matter if it's got "legs" or not. It's done. Toast. A failure. A bomb. If he's an "expert" and I'm just "some guy" it doesn't matter. The numbers are the numbers. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bosco685 Posted January 31 Author Share Posted January 31 On 1/31/2024 at 2:40 PM, Chip Cataldo said: Lol. Come on, now. I'm not suggesting that anyone NEEDS to do anything because I say so. It's just an expression. It's like saying that Joe Rogan needs to "go away" for whatever BS he's sprouting at the moment. I don't expect him to actually disappear. I don't need to know the metrics. If the movie has a certain budget, like $200 million...and then an advertising budget of $100 million...and then the total box office after 6 weeks is $150 million, it does not matter if it's got "legs" or not. It's done. Toast. A failure. A bomb. If he's an "expert" and I'm just "some guy" it doesn't matter. The numbers are the numbers. Not actually when surprise jumps occur in box office results - which is what he was noting. NOT that the film is going to be a success. See - that's part of the 'toxic' you mentioned with this forum. That mindset and the assumption it all just needs to stop because you have declared bombs are not to be noted as having surprising results at certain points leads to some of those exchanges. Good talk. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Chip Cataldo Posted January 31 Share Posted January 31 On 1/31/2024 at 2:42 PM, Bosco685 said: Not actually when surprise jumps occur in box office results - which is what he was noting. NOT that the film is going to be a success. See - that's part of the 'toxic' you mentioned with this forum. That mindset and the assumption it all just needs to stop because you have declared bombs are not to be noted as having surprising results at certain points leads to some of those exchanges. Good talk. That's not toxic unless you have a VERY thin skin, man. Come on, now. I sympathize with you when you're getting needlessly attacked around here, but I'm just having a discussion about something I really care very little about. It's just coffee shop talk because I'm bored at work. I personally don't see the point in him continually saying "WOW! THIS HAS LEGS! CAN YOU BELIEVE IT???" when he's talking about a dud movie that's already lost lots of money, but that's his right and prerogative. I don't need to care that much about it, but I'm just having a conversation/debate with you. It's all good in the end. No worries. We can disagree about opinions and still be good to each other. Beige 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bosco685 Posted January 31 Author Share Posted January 31 On 1/31/2024 at 2:50 PM, Chip Cataldo said: That's not toxic unless you have a VERY thin skin, man. Come on, now. I sympathize with you when you're getting needlessly attacked around here, but I'm just having a discussion about something I really care very little about. It's just coffee shop talk because I'm bored at work. I personally don't see the point in him continually saying "WOW! THIS HAS LEGS! CAN YOU BELIEVE IT???" when he's talking about a dud movie that's already lost lots of money, but that's his right and prerogative. I don't need to care that much about it, but I'm just having a conversation/debate with you. It's all good in the end. No worries. We can disagree about opinions and still be good to each other. I didn't get excited. So if you assumed that, brush it off. That would be an inaccurate perception. I'm just noting if anyone is going to take the approach "only negative box office results should be posted with a failing movie" it could lead to the toxic situations that come up on here. But then when it does and someone calls it out (NOT YOU - not implying that), then they run to moderation to declare their rights have been infringed upon. At that times, that is what comes up with moderation actions. We all can disagree about opinions without it getting ugly. Agreed. Beige 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bosco685 Posted January 31 Author Share Posted January 31 Tale of two billion-dollar solo franchises continues Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Hulksdaddy1 Posted February 1 Share Posted February 1 On 1/31/2024 at 2:50 PM, Chip Cataldo said: That's not toxic unless you have a VERY thin skin, man. Come on, now. I sympathize with you when you're getting needlessly attacked around here, but I'm just having a discussion about something I really care very little about. It's just coffee shop talk because I'm bored at work. I personally don't see the point in him continually saying "WOW! THIS HAS LEGS! CAN YOU BELIEVE IT???" when he's talking about a dud movie that's already lost lots of money, but that's his right and prerogative. I don't need to care that much about it, but I'm just having a conversation/debate with you. It's all good in the end. No worries. We can disagree about opinions and still be good to each other. On 1/31/2024 at 2:59 PM, Bosco685 said: I didn't get excited. So if you assumed that, brush it off. That would be an inaccurate perception. I'm just noting if anyone is going to take the approach "only negative box office results should be posted with a failing movie" it could lead to the toxic situations that come up on here. But then when it does and someone calls it out (NOT YOU - not implying that), then they run to moderation to declare their rights have been infringed upon. At that times, that is what comes up with moderation actions. We all can disagree about opinions without it getting ugly. Agreed. So, to sum it up: it's a bomb, but doing pretty well for a bomb. Bosco685 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bosco685 Posted February 1 Author Share Posted February 1 On 1/31/2024 at 10:27 PM, Hulksdaddy1 said: So, to sum it up: it's a bomb, but doing pretty well for a bomb. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
paperheart Posted February 2 Share Posted February 2 celebrate the last day that Aquadud2 is less than $200M lower than Aquaman Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bosco685 Posted February 2 Author Share Posted February 2 Tuesday was another of those surprising spikes up with no change in domestic theater count. Yet it goes up 51.3%. That's the 'legs' analysts are speaking of when you have these periodic spikes up compared to drops before and after. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bosco685 Posted February 2 Author Share Posted February 2 What he means by this via the metrics: Last Thursday had 2,423 theaters and experienced a -26% change and yet the following Thursday was down 305 theaters yet only experienced a -31% drop when compared to that previous Thursday. Or as some would summarize it, "It's making less than Aquaman 1 - haa haa!" Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
media_junkie Posted February 3 Share Posted February 3 On 1/31/2024 at 5:06 PM, Bosco685 said: Tale of two billion-dollar solo franchises continues I didn't care for either the 1st Captain Marvel or the 1st Aquaman, but I could at least understand trying to make Momoa a "franchise" the dude has serious charisma and seems likeable enough. However to try and make Larson a franchise was a stretch to far, there is nothing likeable about her at all. Bosco685 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
