Market is Insane 5 5

[VintageComics]

1 hour ago, Jeffro™ said:

I'd rather read the original comics. It's part of the experience.

This is what it has always been about to me.

Holding the comic (especially high grade comics). Handling them delicately. Smelling the paper. Seeing the dated advertisements. Even the risk of damage is appealing, knowing that you're handling something fragile.

And at the same time, reading them.

Even better is reading a vintage book knowing that someone 10, 20 or 50 or 60 years ago read that same comic and enjoyed it.

The entire point of it for me is to read the comic, not just see the pictures.

It's like holding and enjoying an album, reading the notes and admiring the art vs. just downloading the songs digitally. They are worlds apart.

Edited June 13, 2019 by VintageComics

[theCapraAegagrus]

6 minutes ago, VintageComics said:

There are board members on this forum with not only 10,000's of comics in their homes but 100,000's of comics in their homes.

That's what old school collectors did. They collected. It's not a burden, it's the whole point.

But this discussion is making evident the differences in mindset between the old school and the new school (no disrespect intended).

There's an underlying theme in the new generation that is probably perpetuated by the onset of digital media, which has changed how we process information. And we are becoming less patient because of it.

The same patience that allowed people to enjoy the intro on an 8 minute song, or spend a lifetime collecting, or speak on the phone for 2 hours with someone has been replaced with 3 minute 'hits' that are hollow and artificial, or the Adrenalin rush of owning something cool for a short time or many messages with everyone but no real conversations that leave a mark on you.

And I know I sound like an old guy yelling 'get off my lawn' but that's not really it.

I'm young enough to 'get it' today and still old enough to remember the entire transition from the 70's to today.

Imagine wanting to fill a run of comics for your collection, snail mailing a check - a frigging hand signed check, then waiting 4-6 weeks for a reply and then getting sent back either your check or a substitute book because the one you wanted wasn't in stock?

As silly and frustrating as it sounds, I think it may have been more satisfying than the instant gratification of today.

If only because it wasn't about accomplishing the run, it was about the journey and the pursuit of putting it together.

Back then it was mostly about the pursuit because the accomplishment took so much time.

Today is all about the accomplishment and everyone gets there quicker so it's not appreciate as much.

It's more of a storage-management issue for me. Also an OCD thing. The neat presentation of hardcovers and TPBs, making the stories so much easier to find and read, goes a long way for me.

I'd rather have single issues than digital. I understand the convenience of digital, but it does nothing for me. I can't pay attention to a dumb- screen after working on my computer for 8 hours every day.

[F For Fake]

1 hour ago, Westy Steve said:

What's interesting about this thread is that collecting lower grade as an answer to the affordability problem doesn't seem very popular.  People who want to collect "Comic A" but can't afford it in high grade have resigned themselves to collecting "Comic B" in high grade.  Personally, I'd rather collect low grade just to have the book.  I think it would be fun to put together a silver age key set in 1.0.  Of course, right now, I'm not sure I can even afford that!

 

I love low grade silver keys. That's where I live. But even THOSE prices are getting insane. How much is a coverless AF 15 these days? Five grand? 6? Maybe $7k for a .5 that's missing a chunk of the cover? It's nuts. 

But still, yes, I'd rather have a beater copy of a beloved key than not have the book at all. I bought a raw 0.5 FF 5 a few months back for $300. Cover split/detached, a real rag. (Currently I'd likely have to pay $1k or more for the same book.) But it's all there, and it's mine. #beatbutcomplete is my motto.

[F For Fake]

10 hours ago, VintageComics said:

I actually almost NEVER read trades.

I prefer to hold and read actual comics. To me part of the satisfaction comes from knowing I'm reading a comic.

I get it, but I also love hardcovers and collections because I'm a "book guy". And I'll tell you why:

For Christmas when I was about 12, a year or two after I'd started to really get into comics, my grandmother got me a copy of "The Complete Frank Miller Batman" hardcover, which I believe was a Waldenbooks edition, or something like that. And I LOVED that thing. I loved the black leather binding, how it smelled so strongly of leather for YEARS. I loved the crisp paper, the ribbon book marker, the silver ink lining the pages. I stayed up all night Christmas Eve reading "The Dark Knight Returns" for the first time ever. It boiled my brain.

The book sat in a place of honor on the bookshelf above my head, well into my teenage years and beyond. I believe for my birthday a few weeks later, I received the Uncanny X-Men Masterworks, reprinting Giant Size 1 and 94 through whatever. It also had the leather bound covers, the gold stamp, the dustjacket, etc. and it had that sweet leather smell. Cracking open those books was sensory overload, and the colors popped so vibrantly on the nice paper.

So, since I was a kid, at the point where comics were becoming "my thing", collected editions of comics have meant about as much to me as "regular" comics.It's hard wired in my comic collecting DNA. So while I DO love picking up a run of copper X-Men out of a 50 cent sale and reading through them (reminding me of the days when my Mom worked at the mall and I'd tag along, and she'd give me $1.50 which would allow me to buy a new X-Men comic for 75 cents and a cookie at the Great Cookie Company) and I enjoy collecting pricier books as well, I also simply adore collected editions in all of their forms, from Masterworks to Omnibus to Absolutes and on. They're all part of my world of comics.

[lizards2]

1 hour ago, VintageComics said:

3 hours ago, TwoPiece said:

10 hours ago, VintageComics said:

Old school collectors looked at it as a marathon. For some, it took a lifetime but it was always the thrill of the chase that kept them going and not the end of the race.

I get it. But handling/storing single issues as opposed to a book/books of 6+ issues can be daunting after a certain threshold.

There are board members on this forum with not only 10,000's of comics in their homes but 100,000's of comics in their homes.

That's what old school collectors did. They collected. It's not a burden, it's the whole point.

But this discussion is making evident the differences in mindset between the old school and the new school (no disrespect intended).

There's an underlying theme in the new generation that is probably perpetuated by the onset of digital media, which has changed how we process information. And we are becoming less patient because of it.

The same patience that allowed people to enjoy the intro on an 8 minute song, or spend a lifetime collecting, or speak on the phone for 2 hours with someone has been replaced with 3 minute 'hits' that are hollow and artificial, or the Adrenalin rush of owning something cool for a short time or many messages with everyone but no real conversations that leave a mark on you.

And I know I sound like an old guy yelling 'get off my lawn' but that's not really it.

I'm young enough to 'get it' today and still old enough to remember the entire transition from the 70's to today.

Imagine wanting to fill a run of comics for your collection, snail mailing a check - a frigging hand signed check, then waiting 4-6 weeks for a reply and then getting sent back either your check or a substitute book because the one you wanted wasn't in stock?

As silly and frustrating as it sounds, I think it may have been more satisfying than the instant gratification of today.

If only because it wasn't about accomplishing the run, it was about the journey and the pursuit of putting it together.

Back then it was mostly about the pursuit because the accomplishment took so much time.

Today is all about the accomplishment and everyone gets there quicker so it's not appreciate as much.

I really appreciate reading your posts on this subject Roy - you really nailed it..., at least for me.

I am almost 50 years in to collecting some titles, and I have completed very few.  Completion may have a been goal, but it probably wasn't the important part.

It is neat to look back at the books I do have and reminisce about where and when I purchased them, and the circumstances of the purchase.

It's also interesting how the internet, at first, made so many more things attainable, but now, due to the infusion of speculation and wealth in this hobby, so many, many more books are unattainable due to price.

Edited June 13, 2019 by lizards2

[theCapraAegagrus]

2 minutes ago, lizards2 said:

I really appreciate reading your posts on this subject Roy - you really nailed it..., at least for me.

I am almost 50 years in to collecting some titles, and I have completed very few.  Completion may have a been goal, but it probably wasn't the important part.

It is neat to look back at the books I do have and reminisce about where and when I purchased them, and the circumstances of the purchase.

It's also an interesting how the internet, at first, made so many more things attainable, but now, due to the infusion of speculation and wealth in this hobby, so many, many more books are unattainable due to price.

I get it from your guys' views. As a collector beginning in 2014, though, it's a lot different journey. You guys have been collecting for decades. As someone very relatively new to the hobby, buying collected editions gives me easier access to all of the stories you guys were hunting for before they were bound into a single book. I'm more interested in having access to the stories than the single issues themselves. I want to read them after all. Quantity of quality stories > quantity of single issues for me.

I would never be able to read so many great comics if I went after all these vintage issues.

[Ken Aldred]

1 hour ago, TwoPiece said:

I get it from your guys' views. As a collector beginning in 2014, though, it's a lot different journey. You guys have been collecting for decades. As someone very relatively new to the hobby, buying collected editions gives me easier access to all of the stories you guys were hunting for before they were bound into a single book. I'm more interested in having access to the stories than the single issues themselves. I want to read them after all. Quantity of quality stories > quantity of single issues for me.

I would never be able to read so many great comics if I went after all these vintage issues.

I've been collecting since the late 70s.

I'm actually very tired of keeping on being involved with the time-consuming, frustrating and very limited old-school approach of mail order, shops and convention trips, and making grindingly-slow progress.  I suppose I've simply run out of patience, and, now I'm in my fifties, realising the impracticability of getting anywhere near to completion by persisting with this, exacerbated of course by the current speculator market.  Also, there are my health issues to consider, which make me want to do something else with comics that's far more relaxed and fuss-free.  And,  I get a much greater sense of progress and closure after reading a book collection or a digital file.  It's enough for me, and better than bashing my head against a brick wall, again and again.

So, I don't believe that contemporary instant gratification is necessarily the main driving force for such a transition ;  I'm just happily not chasing this particular rainbow any more.

Edited June 13, 2019 by Ken Aldred

[Krismusic]

As a casual reader in the 90's and becoming a collector in the late 2000's I agree with both sides that I love the hunt the chase of trying to complete a collection or a run but with prices and availability it keeps that chase out of reach, but I think having the digital or TPB books that twopiece is talking about is a great way to at least enjoy the stories and artwork in some form. I didn't know much about TPB's but I am definitely going to look into that as I would prefer a physical book than the digital. 

Maybe someone can direct me to some TPB books that they would recommend if I wanted to read some GA or SA stories. 

[theCapraAegagrus]

3 minutes ago, Krishosein said:

As a casual reader in the 90's and becoming a collector in the late 2000's I agree with both sides that I love the hunt the chase of trying to complete a collection or a run but with prices and availability it keeps that chase out of reach, but I think having the digital or TPB books that twopiece is talking about is a great way to at least enjoy the stories and artwork in some form. I didn't know much about TPB's but I am definitely going to look into that as I would prefer a physical book than the digital. 

Maybe someone can direct me to some TPB books that they would recommend if I wanted to read some GA or SA stories. 

DC: The Golden/Silver/Bronze Age

Marvel Masterworks

Buy from InStockTrades (typically 40% off cover prices).

[Karl Liebl]

2 minutes ago, Krishosein said:

As a casual reader in the 90's and becoming a collector in the late 2000's I agree with both sides that I love the hunt the chase of trying to complete a collection or a run but with prices and availability it keeps that chase out of reach, but I think having the digital or TPB books that twopiece is talking about is a great way to at least enjoy the stories and artwork in some form. I didn't know much about TPB's but I am definitely going to look into that as I would prefer a physical book than the digital. 

Maybe someone can direct me to some TPB books that they would recommend if I wanted to read some GA or SA stories. 

I love my Russ Cochran EC books and even prefer the large print black and white ones to the newer colorized ones.  Having all the books in one spot is great plus there is no way I can or want to spend on a full EC run, maybe if I win the lotto...

[Krismusic]

1 minute ago, Karl Liebl said:

I love my Russ Cochran EC books and even prefer the large print black and white ones to the newer colorized ones.  Having all the books in one spot is great plus there is no way I can or want to spend on a full EC run, maybe if I win the lotto...

sweet I loved the show tales from the crypt keeper don't know if that's the same thing or used the same stories but I might give it a go thanks 

[theCapraAegagrus]

10 minutes ago, Krishosein said:

As a casual reader in the 90's and becoming a collector in the late 2000's I agree with both sides that I love the hunt the chase of trying to complete a collection or a run but with prices and availability it keeps that chase out of reach, but I think having the digital or TPB books that twopiece is talking about is a great way to at least enjoy the stories and artwork in some form. I didn't know much about TPB's but I am definitely going to look into that as I would prefer a physical book than the digital. 

Maybe someone can direct me to some TPB books that they would recommend if I wanted to read some GA or SA stories. 

 

3 minutes ago, TwoPiece said:

DC: The Golden/Silver/Bronze Age

Marvel Masterworks

Buy from InStockTrades (typically 40% off cover prices).

PS Artbooks also has "Pre-Code Classics" for genres like Horror and Sci-Fi, if those things float your boat.

[Krismusic]

4 minutes ago, TwoPiece said:

DC: The Golden/Silver/Bronze Age

Marvel Masterworks

Buy from InStockTrades (typically 40% off cover prices).

Awesome thanks I was going to look at Amazon I'll have to check out Instocktrades and see if they ship to Canada, but looks like I will be going hunting for some Marvel Masterworks books. Thanks for the info!

[Karl Liebl]

Plus If I do get the itch to smell the rotting newsprint I still have a couple of original EC hehe..

[theCapraAegagrus]

1 minute ago, Krishosein said:

Awesome thanks I was going to look at Amazon I'll have to check out Instocktrades and see if they ship to Canada, but looks like I will be going hunting for some Marvel Masterworks books. Thanks for the info!

You are absolutely welcome.

IST can take awhile to ship, though, so you may have to have patience. It's worth the wait for 40% off cover price, though, IMO. I typically order 10-20 different books and they've taken up to 7 days to ship out. Unfortunately, international shipments don't get the perk of free shipping over $50.

If you really get into buying HCs and TPBs a lot, like me, you'll save a ton of money through IST.

[F For Fake]

11 minutes ago, TwoPiece said:

You are absolutely welcome.

IST can take awhile to ship, though, so you may have to have patience. It's worth the wait for 40% off cover price, though, IMO. I typically order 10-20 different books and they've taken up to 7 days to ship out. Unfortunately, international shipments don't get the perk of free shipping over $50.

If you really get into buying HCs and TPBs a lot, like me, you'll save a ton of money through IST.

Also, while it's true IST can be slow to ship, they're also far and away the BEST shipper in the game, IMO. It may take a while to get to you, but it's going to be in beautiful shape when it shows up. it's not like Amazon where they just throw a book into a box without any protection. IST does it right. That alone makes them the winner, to me. The discount is gravy.

[theCapraAegagrus]

Just now, F For Fake said:

Also, while it's true IST can be slow to ship, they're also far and away the BEST shipper in the game, IMO. It may take a while to get to you, but it's going to be in beautiful shape when it shows up. it's not like Amazon where they just throw a book into a box without any protection. IST does it right. That alone makes them the winner, to me. The discount is gravy.

Great point!

IST packs their shipments A+ every time. I am never worried about anything getting dinged or damaged (even though they're just collected editions most of the time). Truly the best.

[Krismusic]

19 minutes ago, Karl Liebl said:

Plus If I do get the itch to smell the rotting newsprint I still have a couple of original EC hehe..

yeah I have been trying to finish a ASM 1-100 run 3 books (14, 23, 44) away so if I have the itch to smell old paper I can but usually on the keys no a days with the prices the way they are and the potential to maybe sell later on if the market is high and the demand for grades I tend to leave them be in their mylars and fullbacks in my plastic BCW box and when I can afford to I would send them to CGC to slab so they are protected etc.. 

[Karl Liebl]

2 minutes ago, Krishosein said:

yeah I have been trying to finish a ASM 1-100 run 3 books (14, 23, 44) away so if I have the itch to smell old paper I can but usually on the keys no a days with the prices the way they are and the potential to maybe sell later on if the market is high and the demand for grades I tend to leave them be in their mylars and fullbacks in my plastic BCW box and when I can afford to I would send them to CGC to slab so they are protected etc.. 

Slabbing 100 silver age books is going to cost you a fortune.  I recommend you thoroughly examine the books before sending in, starting with the high dollar books.  For instance my threshold is a 500 dollar book (currently).  I am working on an FF 1-100 run.  Also you are probably going to want to press a bunch and that will add to cost.

[theCapraAegagrus]

2 minutes ago, Karl Liebl said:

...Also you are probably going to want to press a bunch and that will add to cost.

Don't press anything.