Knightsofold Posted October 9, 2019 Share Posted October 9, 2019 3 hours ago, sfcityduck said: I'm confused. Why compare the Windy City to the Larson? Me too, I thought we were talking about the same one still lol. Nvm then. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bluechip Posted October 9, 2019 Share Posted October 9, 2019 On 10/8/2019 at 5:10 AM, Chicago Boy said: Please share your specifics on the AC 1’s & Tec 27’s that have shown up “ recently “ ? By recently I mean the past few years and I recall few specifics but metropolis got one that was found in the drywall of an old house; another showed up on facebook a year or so ago that was missing the spine, and others on this board are bound to have knowledge I don't. But even a couple books showing up in the past few years means that 80 years on it's still not unheard of (or "inconceivable!") that a copy heretofore unknown becomes known. Chicago Boy 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bluechip Posted October 9, 2019 Share Posted October 9, 2019 On 10/7/2019 at 11:26 PM, Crowzilla said: I don't think anyone would argue that there aren't more AF 15s in the wild to be found. At this point AF 15 is about 15 years older than the oldest book in the Church collection when it was brought to market, and while we absolutely know there are some original owner collections older than that here on the boards, the likelihood that any of them contain a 9.4 or greater AF15 is incredibly small. Look at the Don and Maggie collection. Both adult collectors at the dawn of the Marvel Age, and Maggie was a librarian, they knew what they were doing and made an effort to keep their books as nice as possible. But it's still serendipity which ones would up 7.5 and which ones wound up 9.4. For example Hulk 3-5 were all 9.4, but the #6 was only a 7.5. Like I said, in the last 16 years, only 4 copies have been added that were 9.4 or better, bringing the average down to 1 out of every 300 graded and the percentage is dropping. As we know more than 1,200 copies have been graded in the last 16 years. I don't know where Bluechip eats dinner and sees movies, but by 1982 when the Overstreet Update came out it was already a $1,000 book in NM. No one was wandering into a comic shop in the mid-80s, plopping down $50 and walking out with a NM copy that they've forgotten about for 35 years. Any "new" NM or better copies in the future are far more likely to be known copies with known collectors than newly discovered ones. Lots more copies out there for sure, but not lots in NM or better. I wasn't presuming that books less than NM were non-existent. I bought a poor condition copy of AF15 in the 80s for 5 bucks. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MasterChief Posted October 10, 2019 Share Posted October 10, 2019 (edited) New scan up on Heritage. Good to see the "Wind City" pedigree attributed reclaiming its history and heritage. Marvel Comics #1 (Timely, 1939) CGC NM 9.4 Off-white pages Edited October 10, 2019 by MasterChief Link added Moondog, porcupine48 and comicdonna 3 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
buttock Posted October 10, 2019 Share Posted October 10, 2019 20 hours ago, lou_fine said: I would tend to agree that Heritage most definitely knew the history of the book. At the same time though, i do not believe they would have made the same typo twice in their original advertisement and spin job on the book. To me, that is totally unbelievable a mistake of this magnitude would not have been caught before the ad went out. I think what happened here is that Heritage did know about the history of the book, but was banking on the hope that nobody else would know about the history of the book. So, it would appear that Masterchief's outing of this particular copy is going to cost the consignor of this book a significant amount of dollars here. Or at least that's the way that I see the picture of what took place here. Heritage has never tried to hide a book's history. They maintain their sales archive without manipulation like other auction houses and encourage its use. Why would you ever think that they would be trying to hide a book's history? sfcityduck and szucchini 2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
sfcityduck Posted October 10, 2019 Share Posted October 10, 2019 36 minutes ago, buttock said: They maintain their sales archive without manipulation like other auction houses and encourage its use. That archive is one of the best resources in the business. Hakes does a good job too. Comicconnect and Comiclink suck on that front. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
tth2 Posted October 10, 2019 Share Posted October 10, 2019 21 hours ago, lou_fine said: I think what happened here is that Heritage did know about the history of the book, but was banking on the hope that nobody else would know about the history of the book. So, it would appear that Masterchief's outing of this particular copy is going to cost the consignor of this book a significant amount of dollars here. Or at least that's the way that I see the picture of what took place here. Nothing's been revealed about the book except here in this thread. Much as we'd like to think that these Boards are influential, I think there are lots of big collectors who pay no attention to these Boards. Do we think Hariri, for example, has any idea about these Boards? Conversely, I don't think anyone who's posted in this thread is a collector who's been driving the million dollar end of the market. So I doubt that what's been disclosed by Masterchef in this thread will have any impact on the price. In any event, even if the book has gone from an 8.5 to a 9.4, do the big spenders care? Do we think that the 9.4 Cap #1 went for less than it would've gone for if its history hadn't been revealed on these Boards? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mmehdy Posted October 10, 2019 Share Posted October 10, 2019 (edited) 42 minutes ago, tth2 said: Nothing's been revealed about the book except here in this thread. Much as we'd like to think that these Boards are influential, I think there are lots of big collectors who pay no attention to these Boards. Do we think Hariri, for example, has any idea about these Boards? Conversely, I don't think anyone who's posted in this thread is a collector who's been driving the million dollar end of the market. So I doubt that what's been disclosed by Masterchef in this thread will have any impact on the price. In any event, even if the book has gone from an 8.5 to a 9.4, do the big spenders care? Do we think that the 9.4 Cap #1 went for less than it would've gone for if its history hadn't been revealed on these Boards? I think it makes a difference to me as a collector to see a grade change that significant, but you would be shocked at the number of people who have never posted on the boards but still use them. I would not underestimate this boards power to provide the collecting community at large with significant information. Edited October 10, 2019 by Mmehdy PopKulture 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
RareHighGrade Posted October 10, 2019 Share Posted October 10, 2019 1 hour ago, tth2 said: Nothing's been revealed about the book except here in this thread. Much as we'd like to think that these Boards are influential, I think there are lots of big collectors who pay no attention to these Boards. Do we think Hariri, for example, has any idea about these Boards? Conversely, I don't think anyone who's posted in this thread is a collector who's been driving the million dollar end of the market. So I doubt that what's been disclosed by Masterchef in this thread will have any impact on the price. In any event, even if the book has gone from an 8.5 to a 9.4, do the big spenders care? Do we think that the 9.4 Cap #1 went for less than it would've gone for if its history hadn't been revealed on these Boards? Except for the author of this post? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Chicago Boy Posted October 10, 2019 Share Posted October 10, 2019 1 hour ago, Mmehdy said: I think it makes a difference to me as a collector to see a grade change that significant, but you would be shocked at the number of people who have never posted on the boards but still use them. I would not underestimate this boards power to provide the collecting community at large with significant information. I know of two 7 figures players that read but do not post. One of which told me the boards are full of and for insufficiently_thoughtful_persons. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
sartrexpress Posted October 10, 2019 Share Posted October 10, 2019 2 hours ago, tth2 said: Nothing's been revealed about the book except here in this thread. Much as we'd like to think that these Boards are influential, I think there are lots of big collectors who pay no attention to these Boards. Do we think Hariri, for example, has any idea about these Boards? Conversely, I don't think anyone who's posted in this thread is a collector who's been driving the million dollar end of the market. So I doubt that what's been disclosed by Masterchef in this thread will have any impact on the price. In any event, even if the book has gone from an 8.5 to a 9.4, do the big spenders care? Do we think that the 9.4 Cap #1 went for less than it would've gone for if its history hadn't been revealed on these Boards? 11 minutes ago, RareHighGrade said: Except for the author of this post? IMO ... Heritage just like anyone could have overlooked or missed the pedigree.. Also mistakes happen as with the over estimate... I remember the White Rose Auction and didn't put it together.. (thanks for making us all aware here).. I would not have a problem if the Marvel 1 went from a 8.5 to a 9.4 if the potential existed for the upgrade. But after seeing the book in person IMO its still a 8.5 pushing 9.0. You cannot see the spine wear or the back cover top staple tears in the scan. In fact to compare scans is ludicrous as every computer is calibrated different and every scan at any given moment colors can look different. I have not seen the Mile High Marvel 1, but IMO the pay copy is amazing.. the Denver behind that one. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
sartrexpress Posted October 10, 2019 Share Posted October 10, 2019 4 minutes ago, sartrexpress said: IMO ... Heritage just like anyone could have overlooked or missed the pedigree.. Also mistakes happen as with the over estimate... I remember the White Rose Auction and didn't put it together.. (thanks for making us all aware here).. I would not have a problem if the Marvel 1 went from a 8.5 to a 9.4 if the potential existed for the upgrade. But after seeing the book in person IMO its still a 8.5 pushing 9.0. You cannot see the spine wear or the back cover top staple tears in the scan. In fact to compare scans is ludicrous as every computer is calibrated different and every scan at any given moment colors can look different. I have not seen the Mile High Marvel 1, but IMO the pay copy is amazing.. the Denver behind that one. Also... does anyone know why the pay copy is not an October copy? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Primetime Posted October 10, 2019 Share Posted October 10, 2019 1 hour ago, sartrexpress said: Also... does anyone know why the pay copy is not an October copy? Since the October and November editions were printed and released within two weeks of each other, I speculate Goodman didn’t have any Oct copies around since they had sold out in a week. So he used a Nov copy as the Pay copy. pemart1966 and Badger 2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Chicago Boy Posted October 10, 2019 Share Posted October 10, 2019 15 minutes ago, Primetime said: Since the October and November editions were printed and released within two weeks of each other, I speculate Goodman didn’t have any Oct copies around since they had sold out in a week. So he used a Nov copy as the Pay copy. What’s a Pay Copy again ? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Primetime Posted October 10, 2019 Share Posted October 10, 2019 16 minutes ago, Chicago Boy said: What’s a Pay Copy again ? The copy that was used to record how much money was being paid to each artist that contributed to Marvel 1. porcupine48, OdinsSecrets and Chicago Boy 2 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
pemart1966 Posted October 10, 2019 Share Posted October 10, 2019 19 minutes ago, Chicago Boy said: What’s a Pay Copy again ? Generally - editor (or similar) writes on the front cover the artist and how much they got paid - might also write what feature the artist did. Chicago Boy 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
sfcityduck Posted October 10, 2019 Share Posted October 10, 2019 2 hours ago, sartrexpress said: Also... does anyone know why the pay copy is not an October copy? Was Goodman known for paying his employees in a timely fashion? I doubt it. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
pemart1966 Posted October 10, 2019 Share Posted October 10, 2019 (edited) 14 hours ago, buttock said: Heritage has never tried to hide a book's history. They maintain their sales archive without manipulation like other auction houses and encourage its use. Why would you ever think that they would be trying to hide a book's history? Well...they make no mention in their description about the book's grading history which is pretty significant wouldn't you agree? Edited October 11, 2019 by pemart1966 lou_fine 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
batman_fan Posted October 10, 2019 Share Posted October 10, 2019 6 hours ago, Chicago Boy said: I know of two 7 figures players that read but do not post. One of which told me the boards are full of and for insufficiently_thoughtful_persons. guilty as charged szucchini 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
batman_fan Posted October 10, 2019 Share Posted October 10, 2019 8 hours ago, tth2 said: Nothing's been revealed about the book except here in this thread. Much as we'd like to think that these Boards are influential, I think there are lots of big collectors who pay no attention to these Boards. Do we think Hariri, for example, has any idea about these Boards? Conversely, I don't think anyone who's posted in this thread is a collector who's been driving the million dollar end of the market. So I doubt that what's been disclosed by Masterchef in this thread will have any impact on the price. In any event, even if the book has gone from an 8.5 to a 9.4, do the big spenders care? Do we think that the 9.4 Cap #1 went for less than it would've gone for if its history hadn't been revealed on these Boards? I must respectfully disagree, based on my sources, the Green New Deal was based on the thread "Are Newton Rings 'normal and acceptable'? " Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
