ADAMANTIUM Posted June 1, 2020 Share Posted June 1, 2020 27 minutes ago, blazingbob said: 29 minutes ago, ADAMANTIUM said: and this is not true either because if you were going to bid $1000 on Heritage.... your bid would be for $800...... because the 20% buyers premium would mean you'd be charged $1000..... No different the total is $1000, just laid out different between the 2 different platforms.... If you bid $800 on heritage, the bid is still $1000, same as if you bid $1000 on ebay If you bid $800, with BP it is $960 not $1000 you made me check my crazy self I said close to $1000, saving grace and all, carry on ha Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
theCapraAegagrus Posted June 1, 2020 Share Posted June 1, 2020 33 minutes ago, ADAMANTIUM said: This is no different on Heritage..... except it's laid out where and how the bid money is distributed.... Ebay you don't even get that disclosure There's an added fee on top of your bid. On eBay, there isn't. Mr. Burt Hutt 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
theCapraAegagrus Posted June 1, 2020 Share Posted June 1, 2020 31 minutes ago, ADAMANTIUM said: and this is not true either because if you were going to bid $1000 on Heritage.... your bid would be for $800...... because the 20% buyers premium would mean you'd be charged $1000..... No different the total is $1000, just laid out different between the 2 different platforms.... If you bid $800 on heritage, the bid is still $1000, same as if you bid $1000 on ebay The fee is on top of your bid on Heritage... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ADAMANTIUM Posted June 1, 2020 Share Posted June 1, 2020 30 minutes ago, ADAMANTIUM said: it's weird that people can say that they'll bid $800 and be charged 20% more, and still say their bid was only $800 no your bid was $800 + 20% buyers premium.... which is close to $1000 so you would say you bought it for $1000 this post is time stamped before you're rebuttle @blazingbob haha Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Hollywood1892 Posted June 1, 2020 Share Posted June 1, 2020 My problem is this.... The fees increase the FMV of the book! Which imo is wrong Sellers see the book sold for such and such ignoring that it was fees...not the same as if your buddy has a book and sells if without fees 1950's war comics 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ADAMANTIUM Posted June 1, 2020 Share Posted June 1, 2020 1 minute ago, theCapraAegagrus said: The fee is on top of your bid on Heritage... I would argue it's included in you're bid, as it's clearly stated.... Thank you for being nice! I was just trying to help not appear delusional Hollywood1892 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
theCapraAegagrus Posted June 1, 2020 Share Posted June 1, 2020 Just now, ADAMANTIUM said: I would argue it's included in you're bid, as it's clearly stated.... Thank you for being nice! I was just trying to help not appear delusional Maybe sometimes, but, not exactly. I wouldn't exactly call myself "nice", but I (always) appreciate your positive outlook. ADAMANTIUM 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Hollywood1892 Posted June 1, 2020 Share Posted June 1, 2020 (edited) 8 minutes ago, ADAMANTIUM said: I would argue it's included in you're bid, as it's clearly stated.... Thank you for being nice! I was just trying to help not appear delusional The problem is this GPA and gocollect.com use data from these sites to determine the value of a book, the fees are not put into the book ie a book costs $4000 you pay that to the book. Those fees are used for overhead which has zilch to do with the book Edited June 1, 2020 by Hollywood1892 1950's war comics 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
littledoom Posted June 1, 2020 Share Posted June 1, 2020 The fees on ebay are actually less than 13%. It's 10%, the PayPal commission is 2.9%; if an item is bought globally it's 4%. Starting next month the new ebay fees will be 12.35% (PayPal is out of contract so that's it) Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ADAMANTIUM Posted June 1, 2020 Share Posted June 1, 2020 Just now, littledoom said: The fees on ebay are actually less than 13%. It's 10%, the PayPal commission is 2.9%; if an item is bought globally it's 4%. Starting next month the new ebay fees will be 12.35% (PayPal is out of contract so that's it) Ya I would think that could be understood, but was trying to post quickly and move on, my bad. Next time I'll give more thought and accurately post thoughts. It is too early for rushing in an effort for me Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
William-James88 Posted June 1, 2020 Share Posted June 1, 2020 1 hour ago, theCapraAegagrus said: It's not, though. Your final bid on eBay is final. There are no added fees outside of taxes. If you bid $1k on Heritage - you're paying taxes and more. If you bid $1k on eBay - you're only paying taxes (where applicable). There are ways of mitigating seller fees on eBay, too. There was a lot of back and forth but I'm not sure if this was explained properly. Yes, on heritage, what you bid is then added an extra fee, which is not the case with e-bay. However, since that extra fee is automatically tacked onto your bid, the final price a book sells on heritage will include that fee. So it does end up being the same as with e-bay. The reason for this difference is that E-bay makes all their money from the seller, so the buyer does not need to seehow much of their bid is spent on fees. However, with hertiage, they will take a fee from both the buyer and seller so they are disclosing to the buyer how much they are paying to heritage when purchasing the book. But in both cases, you see your final bid (which includes everything but the tax) rather clearly and that's the FMV used in GPA and other stats, so it comes out to the same thing lou_fine 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
theCapraAegagrus Posted June 1, 2020 Share Posted June 1, 2020 Just now, William-James88 said: There was a lot of back and forth but I'm not sure if this was explained properly. Yes, on heritage, what you bid is then added an extra fee, which is not the case with e-bay. However, since that extra fee is automatically tacked onto your bid, the final price a book sells on heritage will include that fee. So it does end up being the same as with e-bay. The reason for this difference is that E-bay makes all their money from the seller, so the buyer does not need to seehow much of their bid is spent on fees. However, with hertiage, they will take a fee from both the buyer and seller so they are disclosing to the buyer how much they are paying to heritage when purchasing the book. But in both cases, you see your final bid (which includes everything but the tax) rather clearly and that's the FMV used in GPA and other stats, so it comes out to the same thing The seller doesn't always up-charge for FVF, though. Sometimes there is no FVF charge on eBay. So, it's not the same. On Heritage, there is always a Buyer Premium. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
theCapraAegagrus Posted June 1, 2020 Share Posted June 1, 2020 We're also talking about auctions, so, which site are you gonna put a higher bid on? Heritage, or eBay? Your $1k bid on Heritage is subject to an additional fee. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Hollywood1892 Posted June 1, 2020 Share Posted June 1, 2020 1 hour ago, Mr. Burt Hutt said: How does this work, since the fees are not included in the final bid/BIN price? I'm pretty sure they are tho 1950's war comics 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
F For Fake Posted June 1, 2020 Share Posted June 1, 2020 17 hours ago, Comicshrine said: I’m just catching the end of this thread, and I can use some advice. Where currently is the best auction house to sell comic art, not key pieces but commissions or splash pages value around $2000 a piece? I was edging towards heritage but unsure now. I'd go with Comiclink. Flat 10% fee, and they tend to feature more middle of the road pieces than Heritage. I've always enjoyed dealing with them. It CAN take a while to get your money, so if you're in a hurry, eBay may be the best route. But if you don't mind waiting (waiting for them to receive the art in house, decide which auction they're going to list it in, let the auction run its course, then another month or so to pay you once the auction has ended) I'd recommend CLink for the less high falutin' art, as the fees are less than ebay, they have a dedicated bidder base, and they have to deal with the potential hassle of dealing with the buyers, leaving you out of it. My two cents. Hollywood1892 and ADAMANTIUM 2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
F For Fake Posted June 1, 2020 Share Posted June 1, 2020 As for the fees/Buyer's Premium/etc discussion, my belief is this: Whatever the total amount of money the buyer sends to the auction house/dealer is, that is the current market value for that particular piece. Doesn't matter what percentage was the final hammer price and what was buyer's premium, etc. The total amount of money it takes to get that book/art/whatever from the seller and into your home, that's what it's worth, period. littledoom and Hollywood1892 2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
William-James88 Posted June 1, 2020 Share Posted June 1, 2020 1 hour ago, theCapraAegagrus said: We're also talking about auctions, so, which site are you gonna put a higher bid on? Heritage, or eBay? Your $1k bid on Heritage is subject to an additional fee. It's all a matter of point of view. When I bid on heritage, I consider my total price to be my bid, since that's what I'll pay. So I'd say its the same. My 1k bid on heritage is not subject to more fees, I don't get what you mean by that. Here's let's give an actual example, my bid on this book was 89$, that's what it sold for and that's what and I paid. https://comics.ha.com/itm/silver-age-1956-1969-/superhero/showcase-35-the-atom-dc-1961-condition-fn-/a/122015-13362.s Same as I would e-bay. ADAMANTIUM 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
1Cool Posted June 1, 2020 Share Posted June 1, 2020 (edited) Why do they use the often time confusing 20% buyer fee if it's understood the buyer incorporates the 20% into their bid amount. Wouldn't it just be simpler to just take a 20% fee from the total bid amount or are they gaining a small amount due to a small minority of people not taking the 20% into account during a bidding war? The 20% buyers fee may just be a carry over from a time long gone but it just seems confusing with little gained. Edited June 1, 2020 by 1Cool Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Sweet Lou 14 Posted June 1, 2020 Share Posted June 1, 2020 (edited) 58 minutes ago, 1Cool said: Why do they use the often time confusing 20% buyer fee if it's understood the buyer incorporates the 20% into their bid amount. Wouldn't just be simpler to just take a 20% fee from the total bid amount or are they gaining a small amount due to a small minority of people not taking the 20% into account during a bidding war? The 20% buyers fee may just be a carry over from a time long gone but it just seems confusing with little gained. I have wondered the same thing and the only conclusion I can make is exactly what you've alluded to -- they are calculating (and who knows, maybe they have some kind of controlled study to back this up) that there are enough bidders who don't factor in the premium that they make more money this way. We should also be aware that they have a business model that encompasses much more than just comics, which means that while ComicConnect and ComicLink view Heritage (and each other) as their main competition, Heritage looks at much, much bigger auction houses (think Sotheby's) as their primary competition. So maybe in that world, the BP is considered standard operating procedure, influencing how Heritage has tailored its business. Edited June 1, 2020 by Sweet Lou 14 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DavidTheDavid Posted June 1, 2020 Share Posted June 1, 2020 (edited) On 5/30/2020 at 10:31 PM, VintageComics said: The buyer's premium is irrelevant as a buyer. You just factor it into the price you're willing to pay just like everyone else does. It's the same level playing field for everyone...you just pay the price you're wiling to pay (BP included). In fact, you don't even have to do the math. The site does it for you. Exactly, I never understand that complaint. buy a premium is just part of the price, and heritage lets you know what it is before you even bid Edited June 1, 2020 by DavidTheDavid Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...