CGC misses married wrap & other work on $10,000+ book, designates professional Conservation work done with all archival, reversible materials as "C" level resto. This is a HUGE problem... 5 5

[onlyweaknesskryptonite]

On 8/1/2021 at 10:02 AM, THE_BEYONDER said:

To save any confusion....

There is also a thread for words that pop in your head. 

[THE_BEYONDER]

On 8/1/2021 at 11:41 AM, onlyweaknesskryptonite said:

There is also a thread for words that pop in your head. 

[onlyweaknesskryptonite]

On 8/1/2021 at 10:49 AM, THE_BEYONDER said:

You quoted me and suggested 

"Pernicious"

I was just saying that would also cross post on the other thread. 

 

[THE_BEYONDER]

On 8/1/2021 at 11:55 AM, onlyweaknesskryptonite said:

You quoted me and suggested 

"Pernicious"

I was just saying that would also cross post on the other thread. 

 

 

[onlyweaknesskryptonite]

On 8/1/2021 at 10:55 AM, THE_BEYONDER said:

 

I saw it in there and got the reference. 

Just made me laugh that you quoted me.

[THE_BEYONDER]

On 8/1/2021 at 11:59 AM, onlyweaknesskryptonite said:

I saw it in there and got the reference. 

Just made me laugh that you quoted me.

My post was for those that had to look up that word like me 

 

[THE_BEYONDER]

On 8/1/2021 at 12:11 PM, SWED said:

It's likely your contributions to the thread will lend to more confusion than education. It may be more beneficial to the discussion if you sit this one out.

 

 

Edited August 1, 2021 by THE_BEYONDER

[onlyweaknesskryptonite]

On 8/1/2021 at 11:04 AM, THE_BEYONDER said:

My post was for those that had to look up that word like me 

 

I understand.  Even though I post through a bunch of Gifs and Memes ; I would say I am a logophile , Although I wouldn't classify myself as a lexicomane.

[THE_BEYONDER]

On 8/1/2021 at 12:31 PM, onlyweaknesskryptonite said:

I understand.  Even though I post through a bunch of Gifs and Memes ; I would say I am a logophile , Although I wouldn't classify myself as a lexicomane.

 

[theCapraAegagrus]

On 7/29/2021 at 3:03 PM, Phill the Governor said:

Incorrect. A conserved label denotes that the book has been conserved. That's why there are two different terms used: "Restoration" and "Conservation". Saying they are the same thing does not change the reality that they are classified differently (despite some variable overlap), lending to two different terms that we use in our language to describe two different things.

Based on your responses here, and from the account Bonger (that is in all likelihood you as well, but doesn't matter either way), your clear disapproval of a separation between resto & conso labels exaggerates your bias. You do not appear to be seeking rational discussion; it appears your mind is made up and you just want to be confrontational about the subject. This causes your posts to come off as pernicious- in case you weren't aware.

Maybe your quality of thought is not as good as it once was.

Incorrect. A Conserved label is literally A-1 restoration.

Bonger is Stu, but thanks for that completely ignorant comment. Some introspect would serve you well RE: the bold hypocrisy.

Edited August 2, 2021 by theCapraAegagrus

[rjpb]

"Conserved" is the "tape is not a defect" for the 21st century. 

[Phill the Governor]

On 8/2/2021 at 6:44 AM, theCapraAegagrus said:

Incorrect. A Conserved label is literally A-1 restoration.

While there is overlap between Conserved & A-1 Restored labels, there are some distinct differences that separate the two.

For example, A-1 Restoration can include color touch, pieces added and specific types of cleanings - none of which are acceptable in a Conserved grade.

You are continuing to add confusion to the thread by asserting ambiguous statements which are incorrect.

 

[The Lions Den]

What it sounds like to me is that CGC has slightly altered their stance on what will be allowed for certain label designations. Going forward, I'd suggest that anyone sending in restored books in an attempt to receive a Conserved label may want to figure out exactly what will be allowed (and what won't).

Good luck...   

 

[Phill the Governor]

 

On 8/4/2021 at 8:31 PM, The Lions Den said:

What it sounds like to me is that CGC has slightly altered their stance on what will be allowed for certain label designations. Going forward, I'd suggest that anyone sending in restored books in an attempt to receive a Conserved label may want to figure out exactly what will be allowed (and what won't).

Good luck...   

 

Anyone submitting Restored books should expect a Restored label. Anyone submitting a Conserved book should expect a Conserved label. 

Every book with tear seals or reinforcement done with archival tissues and wheat paste, that I submitted prior to 2021 received the label:

• Conserved 

Now, the same exact procedure will produce one of the following at random:

• Conserved
• A-1 Restored
• B-1 Restored
• C-1 Restored (and in some cases C-2 because they incorrectly described reinforcement as piece-fills)

I say at random because if submitted for re-evaluation these same books will and have received the correct Conserved label. I should not have to submit a book twice to get it in the correct holder, it should be done properly the first time.

As it stands I was told last week by someone high up at CGC the best thing to do moving forward is include a list of work done on book(s) to help them with evaluation. While I never had to do this in the past, and never had problems with label types, I will do this moving forward. However, as of right now I have plenty of stories from colleagues doing just this and books were still mis-labelled/ described by CGC. So it's better than nothing, but until internal education & change happens with the graders I'm not holding my breath.

[kav]

On 7/26/2021 at 4:15 PM, Phill the Governor said:

Unless CGC would like to chime in, I can say with almost 100% certainty that the note you included was promptly thrown away when the book was received,

write the information on the cover so it wont get thrown out! 

[onlyweaknesskryptonite]

On 8/5/2021 at 3:14 PM, kav said:

write the information on the cover so it wont get thrown out! 

You will have to fill out the Creator Agreement Form so the instructions garner that yellow label.. 

[The Lions Den]

On 8/5/2021 at 2:19 PM, Phill the Governor said:

 

Anyone submitting Restored books should expect a Restored label. Anyone submitting a Conserved book should expect a Conserved label. 

Every book with tear seals or reinforcement done with archival tissues and wheat paste, that I submitted prior to 2021 received the label:

• Conserved 

Now, the same exact procedure will produce one of the following at random:

• Conserved
• A-1 Restored
• B-1 Restored
• C-1 Restored (and in some cases C-2 because they incorrectly described reinforcement as piece-fills)

I say at random because if submitted for re-evaluation these same books will and have received the correct Conserved label. I should not have to submit a book twice to get it in the correct holder, it should be done properly the first time.

As it stands I was told last week by someone high up at CGC the best thing to do moving forward is include a list of work done on book(s) to help them with evaluation. While I never had to do this in the past, and never had problems with label types, I will do this moving forward. However, as of right now I have plenty of stories from colleagues doing just this and books were still mis-labelled/ described by CGC. So it's better than nothing, but until internal education & change happens with the graders I'm not holding my breath.

I hope it all works out for you...  

[Mercury Man]

On 7/26/2021 at 6:01 PM, Phill the Governor said:

If you did this "work" yourself, shouldn't you attach a note along with the submission listing what you know has been done to the book?

Crossed my mind too. 

[Sauce Dog]

On 8/5/2021 at 6:32 PM, Mercury Man said:

Crossed my mind too. 

I've had a few books both outright Restored and others just Conserved by several pros over the years, and one thing that came up a few times was the issue that the notes would not be passed along to the graders (and it wasn't clear exactly who they were being seen by).

Including notes is nice (but shouldn't be required, as if CGC is parsing every issue and can detect restoration/conservation it won't matter) but does not guarantee anything (hell, won't even guarantee they note the correct work done. I had an original owner book I had a tear seal added to the cover and one of the inner pages as well as dry cleaning, submitted with a checklist of work done on it, and it came back Restored: Staples Replaced & Cover/Centrefold reinforced  )

Edited August 5, 2021 by Sauce Dog

[comicdiablo]

Can we all at least agree that (regardless if the submitter knows about restoration or not), the onus is on CGC to detect whether restoration has occurred? And it may sound unlikely or crazy, but someone could mistakenly or even intentionally inform CGC of a history of restoration on a comic when there actually has been no restoration. Plus, I would think that some collectors may well know there's been restoration but would be happy to receive certain comics graded with no notation of restoration by CGC (and would keep hush hush about it and never to be graded again while in their possession).

Edited August 5, 2021 by comicdiablo