Book Graded Purple....but... 1 1

[Concorde]

I am helping a friend with his dad's collection.  These were all bought off the rack and have been in his closet for 50 years essentially.  Seems kinda odd that one gets purple and the others don't.  Is there an appeal process??  Maybe it's all correct, but has anyone tried to argue with CGC in this situation?  It makes no sense, given the pedigree, that this book is restored.  

Not trying to be an as$.  It just doesn't seem likely that this book is restored. 

Thanks

[zzutak]

On 2/10/2022 at 6:12 PM, Concorde said:

It makes no sense, given the pedigree provenance, that this book is restored. 

Fixed that for ya! 
What do the Grader Notes and Label Text say, and what part of that would you challenge?

[Topnotchman]

What restoration does the label say, a close up picture of the front cover. 

[greggy]

On 2/10/2022 at 6:58 PM, Topnotchman said:

What restoration does the label say, a close up picture of the front cover. 

Small amount of color touch on cover

[Concorde]

On 2/10/2022 at 6:30 PM, zzutak said:

Fixed that for ya! 
What do the Grader Notes and Label Text say, and what part of that would you challenge?

Thanks!  I was half way into a Manhattan when I wrote that!  Yeah...grader notes say "small amount of color touch on top front cover"

 

Edited February 11, 2022 by Concorde

[Concorde]

[theCapraAegagrus]

No, there is no appeal process.

[The Lions Den]

Since the notes state the location of the color touch, it should be easier to spot even through the holder. Examine that top edge closely (even use a loupe if you have one) and you'll probably find at least two or three tiny spots where it was touched up...

[zzutak]

Interesting.  Art-wise, there's not a whole lot going on along the top edge of this particular issue.  It's unlikely that a layman would try to match the green cowl or pink background, so I'd focus on the vertical black stripe along the spine, the DC bullseye at the top-left corner, and the CCA stamp at the top-right corner.  It's often difficult to detect minor work on a slabbed copy; you can't check for bleed-though to the inside cover, and you often won't see subtle changes in reflectivity when rotating the book under an oblique (or raking) light.

I doubt that there's anything to be gained by arguing your point over the phone.  However, if your friend feels strongly about this book being unrestored, he could crack the book out and include it in his next submission.  However, be certain to image the book (front and back) before cracking it out, and be certain to save the label.  This documentation may be useful at some point down the road. 

[Math Teacher]

In additoin, I think that this purple label book would be a fine candidate for restoration removal.

Last sale for a blue label Batman #171 CGC 7.5 was $1,500 in August, 2021. I think the most money you could receive for this book in its current condition is $750, and it would be more likely less than $750. If you were to submit this book to CSS for restoration removal, you would pay $15 - $20 (screening), $110 (restoration removal and grading), handling ($5), and $35 (shipping). For approximately $170, you would turn your purple label into a blue label with a possible decrease of 0.5 (7.5 to 7.0).

Now that I think about it, this might not apply to you, as these books may hold sentimental value for you.

[sledgehammer]

On 2/10/2022 at 8:12 PM, Concorde said:

I am helping a friend with his dad's collection.  These were all bought off the rack and have been in his closet for 50 years essentially.  Seems kinda odd that one gets purple and the others don't.  Is there an appeal process??  Maybe it's all correct, but has anyone tried to argue with CGC in this situation?  It makes no sense, given the pedigree, that this book is restored.  

Not trying to be an as$.  It just doesn't seem likely that this book is restored. 

Thanks

Yes. CGC changed to Blue.

 

[Sauce Dog]

Not the first time these 'original owner books' have come back with something odd. I have a golden age book that came back Qualified (Married Cover) after it was graded (by the person who bought the collection off the guy who bought em all off the racks originally, I bought it after that from him).

Only appeal process is cracking it, double checking, and submitting for re-grading (after offering a sacrifice to the encapsulation gods, of course)

[Dick Pontoon]

Same thing happened to namisgr with one of his off the rack books. If finding old threads wasn't so impossible now I'd include a link.

[rjpb]

There is nothing that prevents original owners from touching up their books, even if the only reason was that they were a bit OCD about color breaks or loss. 

[Mr. Zipper]

On 2/10/2022 at 10:21 PM, Concorde said:

Thanks!  I was half way into a Manhattan when I wrote that!  Yeah...grader notes say "small amount of color touch on top front cover"

 

I wonder if it's a typo in the notes and it's really on the bottom. That black area would be a prime candidate for a touch up. Especially in a corner crease. 

[THE_BEYONDER]

On 2/11/2022 at 7:06 AM, theCapraAegagrus said:

No, there is no appeal process.

I believe this to be incorrect.  I’m pretty sure you can resub for a review.

[namisgr]

On 2/10/2022 at 9:12 PM, Concorde said:

I am helping a friend with his dad's collection.  These were all bought off the rack and have been in his closet for 50 years essentially.  Seems kinda odd that one gets purple and the others don't.  Is there an appeal process??  Maybe it's all correct, but has anyone tried to argue with CGC in this situation?  It makes no sense, given the pedigree, that this book is restored.  

This happened to me, many years ago.  Unfortunately, it was for a Bronze Age key that I had bought off the rack and owned for 35 years, ASM 121.  CGC claimed the right edge had been trimmed and slabbed it purple.  Unfortunately, there is no appeal process or other recourse, as found out after I called them and mailed them back the wrongly slabbed book so that their grading team could take another look at it.  Which they never did, eventually forcing me to have to call them again to get them to send the book back to me.

CGC is generally pretty reliable, but they aren't infallible.  And on occasion it means they mistakenly give books that are guaranteed to be unrestored a purple label, and vice versa when giving a purple book a blue label.

Edited February 12, 2022 by namisgr

[James J Johnson]

On 2/10/2022 at 7:24 PM, Concorde said:

Could you please post an image of the entire book? Like this, but all of it. Same straight-on perspective? Would be helpful to see the whole.

[MatterEaterLad]

On 2/11/2022 at 8:46 AM, Sauce Dog said:

Not the first time these 'original owner books' have come back with something odd. I have a golden age book that came back Qualified (Married Cover) after it was graded (by the person who bought the collection off the guy who bought em all off the racks originally, I bought it after that from him).

Only appeal process is cracking it, double checking, and submitting for re-grading (after offering a sacrifice to the encapsulation gods, of course)

I had a book that came back with "small amount of color touch." I cracked it open, looked with a loupe and a black light and couldn't find it. Sent it back in and voila, blue label.

Graders make mistakes. I'd give it another go. 

[James J Johnson]

On 2/10/2022 at 7:24 PM, Concorde said:

Without the benefit of a full front cover, straight-on scan it makes identifying a possible issue in this case slightly more daunting. I wanted to see the overall symmetry of the book. What I suspect is that the issue may be the top edge itself and not color added. O don't see any tells for added inks, but the edge itself has indicators of a possible issue. Trim.

The top edge is cut at an angle, and curiously, the edge of the top left corner of the cover (not the cover and the pages, but just the cover) is almost perfect. The top of that black line is perfectly square! That perfect top of the black line completely flush with the top of the cover, and yet a stark contrast to the top right corner in its state. 

Of course, it's possible that more wear was incurred by the top right corner, rounding it, or blunting it in production by any number of things including a "top edge corner chip". But those are two indicators, along with the angle of cut that stand out to me as a tell for trim. Which would be very narrow and angled up from the left corner (a deeper cut there) to the "elevated" top right corner (a shallower cut there. 

Now I'm working here with a partial scan (top half only) that I can't resolve to my liking to be 100% sure, but what may have occurred or something that no one else has yet suggested. That CGC did call the book correctly, it is not unrestored, but somehow a clerical error ocurred and the wrong note was printed on the label.

At any rate, the book should be sent back to CGC for a second look. While helpful for identifying potential restoration, an image is nowhere near as conclusive as the book examined by the eyes of a competent CGC analyst in person. It's definitely worthwhile sending, whether for review, if possible, or as an entirely new submission, which is the route I would suggest. 

Note: If someone tags me and I don't answer, I'm not being rude. Sometimes thereare periods of two or more weeks when I can't reach the sign-in page. That sign-in link bringing me to an ad page instead. My older browser is probably the reason. 

 

Edited February 12, 2022 by James J Johnson