Question about The Punisher's logo change...why? 4 4

[CAHokie]

This is why I haven't bought a new comic book in the last three years. These types of decisions will continue to push fans away.  There is always a counter argument like, "It's just a symbol."  That's fine, it's just a symbol, but it's not for me. He looks ridiculous and I'm not reading that. 

[Mmanick]

On 3/9/2022 at 8:46 PM, THE_BEYONDER said:

Is he a ninja 🥷 now?

People don’t want heroes who kick butt and shoot bad guys according to Hollywood, marvel,  Disney types. I will never read this or even entertain this iteration of the character. 

[Beastfeast]

On 3/10/2022 at 9:13 AM, Mmanick said:

People don’t want heroes who kick butt and shoot bad guys according to Hollywood, marvel,  Disney types. I will never read this or even entertain this iteration of the character. 

By pretty much all accounts, Punisher IS a bad guy.  

[Mmanick]

On 3/10/2022 at 6:17 AM, Beastfeast said:

By pretty much all accounts, Punisher IS a bad guy.  

No, he’s a hero who kills bad guys and hurts bad people who prey on those who can’t defend themselves like his wife and child who were gunned down in a park. 

[Namtak]

Looks like wolverine with tusksor darkclaw  mask from marvel vs dc @ADAMANTIUM what ya think?

Edited March 10, 2022 by Namtak

[Lord Gemini]

I hate the new logo like many others, but I understand the desire to move away from the original logo. I'm also of the opinion that if you're staying away from the book solely because of this change, then you're just being silly.

[Beastfeast]

On 3/10/2022 at 9:21 AM, Mmanick said:

No, he’s a hero who kills bad guys and hurts bad people who prey on those who can’t defend themselves like his wife and child who were gunned down in a park. 

There's a much deeper philosophical conversation around this but there are plentyyyy of examples of him murdering or attempting to murder people for absolutely mundane crimes or slights.  His entire ethos is that he's obsessed with vengeance and has zero ability to contextualize or see grey.  That's not a good guy - that's a weird vigilante fantasy for sociopaths.  Just because he's fallen on the side of "good" doesn't make him not a murderer.  

 

BUT, he had a GREAT logo.  

[Bird]

On 3/10/2022 at 9:09 AM, CAHokie said:

 He looks ridiculous and I'm not reading that. 

And the guy with the giant skull on his chest DOESN'T look ridiculous?

[CAHokie]

On 3/10/2022 at 6:33 AM, Bird said:

And the guy with the giant skull on his chest DOESN'T look ridiculous?

To each their own.  Most superheroes look silly if you analyze them, but this decision was obviously made for reasons other than we wanted a cool updated logo.   You like it, buy it. I'm not. 

[theCapraAegagrus]

On 3/10/2022 at 9:21 AM, Mmanick said:

No, he’s a hero who kills bad guys and hurts bad people who prey on those who can’t defend themselves like his wife and child who were gunned down in a park. 

Anti-hero. Definitely not a villain, just one of those heroes who operate in a gray area.

[D84]

On 3/9/2022 at 10:46 PM, THE_BEYONDER said:

Is he a ninja 🥷 now?

[Mmanick]

On 3/10/2022 at 6:31 AM, Beastfeast said:

There's a much deeper philosophical conversation around this but there are plentyyyy of examples of him murdering or attempting to murder people for absolutely mundane crimes or slights.  His entire ethos is that he's obsessed with vengeance and has zero ability to contextualize or see grey.  That's not a good guy - that's a weird vigilante fantasy for sociopaths.  Just because he's fallen on the side of "good" doesn't make him not a murderer.  

 

BUT, he had a GREAT logo.  

Im not going to even go there anymore because it’s going to get political. Punisher is a bad and betas don’t like it. 

[Beastfeast]

On 3/10/2022 at 10:48 AM, Mmanick said:

Im not going to even go there anymore because it’s going to get political. Punisher is a bad and betas don’t like it. 

And here is a great example of the people that associate with the old logo and why they're changing it. 

It's super tight you identify with the character that shot kids for littering in a non Ennis Punisher story.  Big alpha coming through, guys.   

 

Punisher as a fictional character is rad and writers can do a lot with him.  Been reading his titles since I was a kid.  Thinking he's anything but a lunatic (even if he's a sympathetic lunatic) is 

Edited March 10, 2022 by Beastfeast

[CAHokie]

Logos, flags, and symbols are used by people all the time that make them look bad.  The solution is to either constantly change them or ban them all together.  Everyone who uses a symbol based on it's original meaning, does not mean they support the ideology of every nut that also decided to use them. 

Edit: I know someone will point out a particular symbol that has horrible imagery, so there will always be exceptions. 

Edited March 10, 2022 by CAHokie

[Beastfeast]

On 3/10/2022 at 11:19 AM, CAHokie said:

Logos, flags, and symbols are used by people all the time that make them look bad.  The solution is to either constantly change them or ban them all together.  Everyone who uses a symbol based on it's original meaning, does not mean they support the ideology of every nut that also decided to use them. 

I agree, for the most part.  I don't think the symbol was so far gone as to throw it out entirely but I'm not a bean counter at Disney/Marvel.  

 

There's been a lot of iconography and imagery that has been rendered unusable over the years due to bad actors coopting them and it sucks.  But stuff like Pepe the Frog aren't hills I'm willing to die on and neither is a Punisher skull.  This would probably not be as big of a deal if the original wasn't so iconic and the replacement SOOOO bad.  

Edited March 10, 2022 by Beastfeast

[valiantman]

On 3/9/2022 at 9:27 PM, Jesse-Lee said:

Someone else posted this in a different thread a while ago, so I give them the credit for pointing it out (I just can't remember who posted it) - but the new Punisher logo looks a bit like this:

Kind of ironic...

I think the new logo looks like it would be some type of Predator skull or something.

Edited March 10, 2022 by valiantman

[october]

Moving away from the original symbol was inevitable given it's use by certain groups. Honestly though, I'm shocked that Disney/Marvel isn't just shelving the character permanantly. The parent company's obvious reluctance to glorify any kind of hero who operates in a grey area is already pretty clear. Boba Fett anyone? The bounty hunter "crime lord" who wouldn't extract protection money, deal drugs, dispose of rivals, kill people who actively tried to kill him, or engage in any behavior at all that could be considered....you know....criminal? 

Expect more of these sort of softened, watered down character potrayals. A LOT MORE. 

Edited March 10, 2022 by october

[Lord Gemini]

On 3/10/2022 at 9:48 AM, Mmanick said:

Im not going to even go there anymore because it’s going to get political. Punisher is a bad and betas don’t like it. 

Betas. Right. 

[Lord Gemini]

On 3/10/2022 at 11:24 AM, october said:

Moving away from the original symbol was inevitable given it's use by certain groups. Honestly though, I'm shocked that Disney/Marvel isn't just shelving the character permanantly. The parent company's obvious reluctance to glorify any kind of hero who operates in a grey area is already pretty clear. Boba Fett anyone? The bounty hunter "crime lord" who wouldn't extract protection money, deal drugs, dispose of rivals, kill people who actively tried to kill him, or engage in any behavior at all that could be considered....you know....criminal? 

Expect more of this sort of softened, watered down character potrayals. A LOT MORE. 

Boba Fett isn't watered down just because you don't like the direction Disney went with him.

[october]

On 3/10/2022 at 11:28 AM, Lord Gemini said:

Boba Fett isn't watered down just because you don't like the direction Disney went with him.

What they did to his character was the definition of watering him down....in addition to making zero sense. The show was an indefensible disaster, aside from the two Mandalorian episodes.