Slab defects and imperfections - what do you expect as a buyer, or think is fair as a seller? 3 3

[mycomicshop]

I think of slab damage, defects and imperfections in three groups:

- significant damage that compromises the integrity of the case or is serious enough to require the book be reholdered before it can be sold

- flaws that do not necessarily require recasing, but are serious enough that the defect should be included in the item description

- flaws and imperfections that are minor enough they should be viewed as par for the course, and do not need to be called out in item descriptions

We deal with some very picky buyers, who want to treat the most minor scuffing and scratches as a big deal. Same with newton rings back a while ago. And on the other hand, we have consignors who feel we're doing them a disservice if we're overly descriptive about reporting minor case flaws.

Do you have thoughts about where you think that line should be drawn? What kind of stuff should be reported to the buyer, and what kind of stuff is to be expected and doesn't need to be noted?

[Ryan.]

Accurately notating any slab defects is fine, such as chips, scratches, etc., regardless of how severe, or not severe, such defects are. I think the issue might be that MCS' reputation for harsh grading has extended to the grading of the slabs as well, where slabs with barely perceptible defects are listed as "scuffing to front and back of case". I just assume this will be listed on every slab I send in and now just ignore the notation altogether, as buyer and seller.

To me, if the standard is so low that a huge percentage of slabs are listed as having scuffs as a matter of policy then the notation has stopped serving its purpose. 

[Courageous Cat]

I can deal with a minor unobtrusive scuff or scratch, but beyond that, it would bother me as like most here, I doubt I'd be cracking out a book unless I had intentions of resubmitting, hence any scuff or obvious scratch should be noted. Nobody likes a surprise unless it jumps outta cakes

Edited March 11, 2022 by Courageous Cat

[Gaard]

I really dislike any defect. I really like it when sellers say something like, "very minor newton ring (or scuff)" ... that way I'm not surprised. Then I can decide if 'minor' = 'acceptable'. Because you can't decide what is acceptable for anyone but yourself.

 

Off topic comment -

I haven't done a lot of business at MCS, but I have developed an opinion of them just from reading these boards. (I know this is wrong) The opinion that I've come to is that you guys overgrade raws and are over critical of slab condition. Again, I know it's wrong to think like this without any personal experience, but that's what I've read here on multiple occasions. 

[Ryan.]

On 3/10/2022 at 8:21 PM, Gaard said:

The opinion that I've come to is that you guys overgrade raws

Definitely not the case. 

[Krydel4]

Time to start a professional case grading company that can assign a grade to the case, then encapsulate in another case with the grade of the case on the case. Then the buyers will know the condition of the case of the comic they are buying and it is protected from any further degradation.

Use a 10 point scale. 

Or... Just have a disclaimer that says you guarantee the grade of the COMIC BOOK they are buying, not the condition of the piece of plastic it currently resides in. If they don't like it the can crack it and resubmit to CGC on their own dime.

 

[comicartfan]

Here is an example of what I am speaking about in my prior comments. 
 

This is a book that I bought graded

 

 

The big mark across the Clown’s face is on the slab, not the scanner. It’s visible but I would definitely disclose it in any description. 
 

This is a close up of something I believe doesn’t warrant a note. It is something I have seen on 99% of slabs regardless of when they were encased and handled. 
 

 

 

Edited March 11, 2022 by comicartfan

[comicartfan]

.

 

Edited March 11, 2022 by comicartfan

[AJD]

On 3/11/2022 at 12:21 PM, Gaard said:

 The opinion that I've come to is that you guys overgrade raws ...

That is absolutely not true.

[JollyComics]

I am sorry that you have to deal with ultra-picky buyers.

Just do your best to disclose it in any description unless the damages are apparently shown.  Some of us would buy the damaged slabs for some reasons like deslabbing them for the signature series or collecting raw copies included labels. Minor scufflings or scratches disclosed is not bothering me but more information about the condition of the slab is still a valuable resource to me as the buyer.

About Newton rings, you can't help with that.  It's customers' problems.

 

Edited March 11, 2022 by JollyComics

[adamstrange]

On 3/10/2022 at 6:23 PM, mycomicshop said:

I think of slab damage, defects and imperfections in three groups:

- significant damage that compromises the integrity of the case or is serious enough to require the book be reholdered before it can be sold

- flaws that do not necessarily require recasing, but are serious enough that the defect should be included in the item description

- flaws and imperfections that are minor enough they should be viewed as par for the course, and do not need to be called out in item descriptions

We deal with some very picky buyers, who want to treat the most minor scuffing and scratches as a big deal. Same with newton rings back a while ago. And on the other hand, we have consignors who feel we're doing them a disservice if we're overly descriptive about reporting minor case flaws.

Do you have thoughts about where you think that line should be drawn? What kind of stuff should be reported to the buyer, and what kind of stuff is to be expected and doesn't need to be noted?

Simple:  Start a grading service to grade the slabs, then encase them in slabs with a label.  Problem solved. 

[Lightning55]

On 3/10/2022 at 9:21 PM, Krydel4 said:

Time to start a professional case grading company that can assign a grade to the case, then encapsulate in another case with the grade of the case on the case. Then the buyers will know the condition of the case of the comic they are buying and it is protected from any further degradation.

Use a 10 point scale. 

Or... Just have a disclaimer that says you guarantee the grade of the COMIC BOOK they are buying, not the condition of the piece of plastic it currently resides in. If they don't like it the can crack it and resubmit to CGC on their own dime.

 

What if the new outside case has flaws when you get it?  Do we send it to "The Overly Massive Case Company" to regrade the outer case, or remove the outer case and reholder the inner case into a new outer case?  We're going to have to start designating case levels - 1, 2, 3 etc.

If we regrade the outer case and put that whole thing in a new case, it will have to be even larger than the middle case.  Where does it stop?

[Lightning55]

They grade raw Magic cards like this - Near Mint, Lightly Played, Played, Heavily Played, Poor

So for graded comic cases it would be Near Mint, Light wear, Moderate wear (with grade definitions in a link).  If below that, instead of a grade, you could mention the specific defects (cracked case, chipped case, Newton Rings, scuffs, scratches, etc.)

Or while the front and back photos are being taken, the defects could be photographed.  Might take an extra 30 seconds or a minute, but everyone can see what you see.  Then you can say "please refer to photos for case defects".

Edited March 11, 2022 by Lightning55

[Krydel4]

On 3/10/2022 at 7:50 PM, Lightning55 said:

What if the new outside case has flaws when you get it?  Do we send it to "The Overly Massive Case Company" to regrade the outer case, or remove the outer case and reholder the inner case into a new outer case?  We're going to have to start designating case levels - 1, 2, 3 etc.

If we regrade the outer case and put that whole thing in a new case, it will have to be even larger than the middle case.  Where does it stop?

Let's call it the ♾️ Case Grading Company. We'll encase your case until you're completely satisfied with your encasement.

[Axe Elf]

On 3/10/2022 at 9:50 PM, Lightning55 said:

Where does it stop?

Encasing valuable comics in a shell of transparent adamantium.

 

Edited March 11, 2022 by Axe Elf

[Lightning55]

On 3/10/2022 at 11:08 PM, Axe Elf said:

Encasing valuable comics in a shell of transparent adamantium.

I accidentally got tape stuck on that, and can't get it off.  It's making my comic look ugly.  Can I get it re-holdered, please?

[shadroch]

On 3/10/2022 at 6:21 PM, Gaard said:

I really dislike any defect. I really like it when sellers say something like, "very minor newton ring (or scuff)" ... that way I'm not surprised. Then I can decide if 'minor' = 'acceptable'. Because you can't decide what is acceptable for anyone but yourself.

 

Off topic comment -

I haven't done a lot of business at MCS, but I have developed an opinion of them just from reading these boards. (I know this is wrong) The opinion that I've come to is that you guys overgrade raws and are over critical of slab condition. Again, I know it's wrong to think like this without any personal experience, but that's what I've read here on multiple occasions. 

I've never seen anyone here suggest MCS overgrades raw books.  Please give me some examples.

[Axe Elf]

On 3/10/2022 at 10:11 PM, Lightning55 said:

I accidentally got tape stuck on that, and can't get it off.  It's making my comic look ugly.  Can I get it re-holdered, please?

Tape?  We can remove that, no problem...

Here you go sir, as good as new.

[MetaHuman]

Let's add books that move in the case from Shaken Comic Syndrome "SCS" from CGC to their customers where the book doesn't look right when the slab presents normally, i.e. not

90% upright

[Gaard]

On 3/10/2022 at 11:16 PM, shadroch said:

I've never seen anyone here suggest MCS overgrades raw books.  Please give me some examples.

Well, that's really asking a lot for my far from steel trap memory, but I could swear I read, just recently (the other MCS thread?), where someone sent 49 books and was surprised at the grades they received.