Stan, Jack, and Steve - The 1960's (1963) Butting Heads, Unexpected Success and Not Expected Failures! 3 3

[Dr. Haydn]

On 4/29/2023 at 6:10 PM, Prince Namor said:

 

ON NEWSSTANDS SEPTEMBER 1963

Journey Into Mystery #98 - Written By: Stan Lee  Drawn by: Don Heck  Lettering: Art Simek

Cover By Jack Kirby with Sol Brodsky inks

Here is Stan, with no writer to stand behind, and with no Kirby or Ditko... 

It's almost embarrassing to see Thor act like this in the first pages of the story, and... what the heck is Odin wearing? The origin of Cobra... a radioactive cobra??? Ugh. And Cobra sure has a lot of weapons for someone who just became a super powered bad guy... and then by chance, goes to the doctor that Jane Foster now works for... 

So, Jack writes Jane Foster out of the story in JIM #97. Stan flexes his editorial muscles in JIM #98 and writes her back in.

[Dr. Haydn]

On 4/29/2023 at 6:14 PM, Prince Namor said:

ON NEWSSTANDS SEPTEMBER 1963

Journey Into Mystery #98 - Written By: Stan Lee  Drawn by: Jack Kirby  Inked by: Don Heck  Lettering: Art Simek

Don Heck's inking here may have been a true tracing job, as it looks like Kirby did pretty pure pencils for this. And obviously wrote it. THIS is what I would expect in a Thor story, even one he's not in! 

Notice the "next issue" blurb on page 5. In Tales of Asgard, Jack Kirby already has the next tale planned.* In the Lee-Heck 13-page main story, no "next issue" box. So, clearly, one member of the Lee-Kirby duo was capable of thinking ahead, and the other was winging it.

 

*I know that most of the people on this site already acknowledge this, but to forestall any naysayers, Stan has admitted in print that the Tales of Asgard plots were Jack's.

[Dr. Haydn]

Once again, it looks like the caption (top left) is in a different hand (trying but failing to mimic Artie Simek, to my eyes). I suspect this was added for the Marvel Masterworks reprint. Does anyone have access to the original to check this?

Edited April 30, 2023 by Dr. Haydn
minor rewording

[Dr. Haydn]

On 4/12/2023 at 2:19 PM, Prince Namor said:

ON NEWSSTANDS JULY 1963

Tales of Suspense #46 - Story Plot: Stan Lee  Script: R. Berns (Robert Bernstein)  Art: Don Heck  Lettering: Art Simek

Cover by Jack Kirby with Dick Ayers inks. 

Uncredited lettering by Sam Rosen, pages 7-13. Simek returns in the final panel to letter the "next issue" blurb--maybe Steve Ditko told Stan what the plot was going to be for the next story at the last minute?

[Prince Namor]

ON NEWSSTANDS SEPTEMBER 1963

Sgt. Fury #4 - Written By: Stan Lee (Not likely)  Drawn by: Jack Kirby  Inked by: G. Bell  Lettering: S. Rosen (My name is SAM!)

Cover by Jack Kirby with inks by Sol Brodsky (Stan is really saving some money this month)

Again, the difference between the Lee 'written' Thor/Cobra story and this Kirby written Sgt. Fury is just very telling. Lee is still writing funny book stories with rehashed cliches, while Kirby is writing movie quality adult human dramas. It's the same thing they did in the 50's while Simon and Kirby did Boys Ranch and Romance Comics (storywise, light years beyond what Atlas did) while Stan was doing Homer the Happy Ghost, Millie the Model and cliched genre Westerns. 

Part ONE:

Edited April 30, 2023 by Prince Namor

[Prince Namor]

ON NEWSSTANDS SEPTEMBER 1963

Sgt. Fury #4 -

Part TWO:

[Prince Namor]

ON NEWSSTANDS SEPTEMBER 1963

Sgt. Fury #4 - ADS + A Rifle Feature!

[Zonker]

This issue's "howler"...

 

Burt Lancaster didn't start his Hollywood career until after WWII.  

Likely a reference to the movie "Trapeze," which featured Lancaster... in 1956!  

[The humble Watcher lurking]

On 4/30/2023 at 10:09 AM, Prince Namor said:

ON NEWSSTANDS SEPTEMBER 1963

Sgt. Fury #4 -

Part TWO:

Great Jack Kirby artwork! A cinematic feel to it. 

[Dr. Haydn]

On 4/30/2023 at 11:06 AM, Zonker said:

This issue's "howler"...

 

Burt Lancaster didn't start his Hollywood career until after WWII.  

Likely a reference to the movie "Trapeze," which featured Lancaster... in 1956!  

Marvel's expert editor at work!

It would have been funnier had he mentioned the Flying Graysons. At least they were around by 1940.

[Dr. Haydn]

On 4/30/2023 at 7:01 PM, The humble Watcher lurking said:

Great Jack Kirby artwork! A cinematic feel to it. 

And a rare fatality in a Silver Age comic (which, as far as I know, has not yet been retconned). It seems to me that Stan did a decent job matching Jack's serious tone and imagery on the final page.

[Prince Namor]

ON NEWSSTANDS SEPTEMBER 1963

Tales to Astonish #50 - Written By: Stan Lee (Not likely)  Illustrated by: Jack Kirby  Rendered by: Steve Ditko (though it's believed Don Heck redrew the Wasp's face)  Lettering: S. Rosen (My name is SAM!)

Cover by Jack Kirby with inks by Sol Brodsky (Stan is really saving some money this month)

For those who liked Ditko's inking of Kirby, this had to be a bit of a disappointment. It seems this issue was thrown together in haste (where's Heck?), and it makes sense, as this is a month where Kirby does 109 total pages... Lee continues to write the Wasp as an empty headed nitwit. Human Top smoking a cigarette (pg 11, panel 2)

Is Marvel cutting corners to make ends meet? Are they still just holding on, unsure of how good things are about to get?

Edited May 1, 2023 by Prince Namor

[Prince Namor]

ON NEWSSTANDS SEPTEMBER 1963

Tales to Astonish #50 - Story Plot: Stan Lee  -script and Plot: Larry Lieber  Inking: Matt Fox  Lettering: Art Simek

And where is the legendary writer Larry Lieber to help out as things get tight? Doing two 5 page stories in the back of this issue...

[Prince Namor]

ON NEWSSTANDS SEPTEMBER 1963

Tales to Astonish #50 - Story Plot: Stan Lee  -script and Plot: Larry Lieber  Inking: G. Bell  Lettering: Art Simek

[Dr. Haydn]

On 5/1/2023 at 3:11 AM, Prince Namor said:

ON NEWSSTANDS SEPTEMBER 1963

Tales to Astonish #50 - Written By: Stan Lee (Not likely)  Illustrated by: Jack Kirby  Rendered by: Steve Ditko (though it's believed Don Heck redrew the Wasp's face)  Lettering: S. Rosen (My name is SAM!)

Cover by Jack Kirby with inks by Sol Brodsky (Stan is really saving some money this month)

For those who liked Ditko's inking of Kirby, this had to be a bit of a disappointment. It seems this issue was thrown together in haste (where's Heck?), and it makes sense, as this is a month where Kirby does 109 total pages... Lee continues to write the Wasp as an empty headed nitwit. Human Top smoking a cigarette (pg 11, panel 2)

Is Marvel cutting corners to make ends meet? Are they still just holding on, unsure of how good things are about to get?

A sudden insight: I wonder if this tale was supposed to be a lead story for a Tales to Astonish annual that didn't happen? Page 13 seems like such an odd place to stop. (Plus, the rare combo of Stan, Jack and Steve suggests a special event.)

Hank and Jan's banter is funnier if you imagine them as Lucy and Ricky Ricardo (of I Love Lucy fame, for the young'uns out there). Stan's dialogue reeks of 1950s sitcoms in general--sometimes an uncomfortable fit for a superhero yarn. Still. page 5 is interesting, when Jan takes Hank down a notch for being swell-headed. Mr. Pym's fragile psyche was established very early in the run, it seems.

[Prince Namor]

On 5/1/2023 at 11:14 AM, Dr. Haydn said:

A sudden insight: I wonder if this tale was supposed to be a lead story for a Tales to Astonish annual that didn't happen? Page 13 seems like such an odd place to stop. (Plus, the rare combo of Stan, Jack and Steve suggests a special event.)

Hank and Jan's banter is funnier if you imagine them as Lucy and Ricky Ricardo (of I Love Lucy fame, for the young'uns out there). Stan's dialogue reeks of 1950s sitcoms in general--sometimes an uncomfortable fit for a superhero yarn. Still. page 5 is interesting, when Jan takes Hank down a notch for being swell-headed. Mr. Pym's fragile psyche was established very early in the run, it seems.

Lucy was headstrong and had a habit of biting off more than she could chew - to me, the Wasp just seems dim, with a one track mind. I get that it's about Stan's comfort zone - he's writing what he's been writing for the last 10 years - and maybe it's just a product of the times. Still, he's given so much credit as an innovator, but it's 1963 and DC has Wonder Woman, a strong female lead and Lois Lane, a take charge type who'll stand up to anyone... even Hawkgirl is extremely capable and almost an equal to Hawkman. We're a year away from Silver Age Black Canary, another pistol who can handle her own (her mom was the same way). Marvel just seemed to be really lacking in that area...

[Prince Namor]

ON NEWSSTANDS SEPTEMBER 1963

X-Men #2 - Written by: Stan Lee (not likely) Drawn by: Jack Kirby (uhh.. more like wrote and drew it)  Inked by: Paul Reinman  Lettered by: Sam Rosen

Part ONE:

Edited May 3, 2023 by Prince Namor

[Prince Namor]

ON NEWSSTANDS SEPTEMBER 1963

X-Men #2 - Written by: Stan Lee (not likely) Drawn by: Jack Kirby (uhh.. more like wrote and drew it)  Inked by: Paul Reinman  Lettered by: Sam Rosen

Part TWO:

[Prince Namor]

ON NEWSSTANDS SEPTEMBER 1963

X-Men #2 - Written by: Stan Lee (not likely) Drawn by: Jack Kirby (uhh.. more like wrote and drew it)  Inked by: Paul Reinman  Lettered by: Sam Rosen

Part THREE:

[Dr. Haydn]

Here's a rarity for early 60s Marvel: Jack illustrates a woman taking charge, and Stan's dialogue supports and enhances her boldness, rather than contradicting it.