Rob Liefeld is out of his mind 4 4

[Prince Namor]

On 4/12/2023 at 10:34 AM, smarkjobber said:

Ah, I was on a collecting hiatus when he was on ASM -- I could see how that Spidey design could put some off, but personally think his Strange Academy interiors are more impressive than anything I've seen from Liefeld, ever.

Yeah, as a sequential art storyteller, there's not even a comparison. 

[LudaToke]

On 4/11/2023 at 11:37 AM, theCapraAegagrus said:

I was gonna ask, "Doesn't Liefeld hate CGC?" Thought he refused to sign if he knew it was going to them.

He was definitely signing books at the start of the Pandemic.  My copy of NM 98:

[ExNihilo]

On 4/11/2023 at 8:20 PM, Prince Namor said:

Not THAT's funny. All three of those guys did their share of weird proportions and distorted figures (Bagley probably the least)...

When I said proportions, I meant more of the gangly nature of his Spider-Man

And from a personal perspective, I think because I grew in the 90s, I've always liked when Spidey has the predominantly white lenses for eyes.  Ramos has a greater tendency to emote with the eyes which is great for storytelling, but I've just never been a fan of it visually.

 

[eastbayrudy]

So everyone talking like Lee and McFarlane are more bang for your buck, speak for yourself. I would prefer a Liefeld sig/remark/sketch over those other guys any day. In my opinion Lee is super overrated, and like Liefeld says, has no keys lol. McFarlane is good but not my cup of tea. As far as prices go, I do feel they are starting to get outrages...they are starting to hit the likes of super star athletes. I think Joe Montana charges around $200. I personally am not big on putting sharpie to my important comics, but this being a mass produced 90's comic makes it no big deal. This is more of a keep sake of one my favorite characters and favorite artist/creators of my childhood. I'm bummed I did not make it in time for a remark so chiesel will have to do. Cant wait to get my NM #87 signed, pressed, graded and slabbed. 

[roach04]

I'm not a massive Liefeld fan nor am I a huge detractor.  I'd have actually sent in a book or two until I saw the prices though.  I'm not willing to send a minty New Mutants 87 or 98 because my sig series experience is that they won't keep a 9.8.

And no other Liefeld book is worth more than $10...so I can't justify paying that sig fee for a New Mutants 93 or 94 which would be my choice for peak Rob.  Ah well.  Good luck to those who submitted!

[Still Only 35c]

I'm quite happy to keep my NM 87 and 98 graded copies Liefield sig clean. He ain't Stan or Todd 

[Ladic]

maybe I am a bit crazy, but I actually liked Robs art from the early/mid 90's, I am not sure what happened but his later art somehow looks terribly bad? I mean I like his NM and Xforce run, but everything now looks terrible bad. I even liked his deadpool back in the day, but even now he seems to have changed his style for worse. Just looks at deadpool on the cover of NM 98 and deadpool now. Am I crazy? was it all just as bad?

[comix4fun]

On 4/7/2023 at 2:51 AM, Cman429 said:

Oh gee, Liefeld bashing, how original. It amazes me how people have no problem with Jim Lee’s outrageous prices when all he’s contributed to comics are awful “redesigns,” running DC into the ground and a bunch of forgettable $1 bin 90s trash. What has Rob contributed? I dunno, Xforce, Cable, and one of the most popular comic characters ever created, Deadpool… I wouldn’t worry about Rob setting the bar on prices too high when there’s a lot of guys far less important or accomplished than him who’ve already done that 

As a preface....I don't begrudge anyone asking any price for their work or signature. If they want it, and the market will pay it, then I say go for it. 

HOWEVER...

You're not serious placing Rob's contribution to comics above Jim Lee's, are you? That's an Andy Kaufman-style performance art piece of satire, right? 

If you really love Deadpool as he's portrayed in modern comics and in the movies I suggest placing a crisp $20 bill inside a thank you note and mailing it to Reilly Brown (and another $20 each to Joe Kelly and Christopher Priest for perfected  DP's comic tone)  for his work on the character to elevate it above the Deathstroke/Wolverine ripoff he was originally created to be, as it's Reilly's work you see in the films for the most part. 

Crediting Liefeld with Deadpool becoming a super popular character is like crediting the guy who invented Play Dough as a wallpaper cleaner for creating what someone else turned into one of the most popular children's toys of all time. And it certainly shouldn't be the thing that elevates him above Jim Lee. 

Edited April 18, 2023 by comix4fun
Forgot to include Kelly and Priest

[shadroch]

On 4/18/2023 at 8:34 AM, comix4fun said:

As a preface....I don't begrudge anyone asking any price for their work or signature. If they want it, and the market will pay it, then I say go for it. 

HOWEVER...

You're not serious placing Rob's contribution to comics above Jim Lee's, are you? That's an Andy Kaufman-style performance art piece of satire, right? 

If you really love Deadpool as he's portrayed in modern comics and in the movies I suggest placing a crisp $20 bill inside a thank you note and mailing it to Reilly Brown (and another $20 each to Joe Kelly and Christopher Priest for perfected  DP's comic tone)  for his work on the character to elevate it above the Deathstroke/Wolverine ripoff he was originally created to be, as it's Reilly's work you see in the films for the most part. 

Crediting Liefeld with Deadpool becoming a super popular character is like crediting the guy who invented Play Dough as a wallpaper cleaner for creating what someone else turned into one of the most popular children's toys of all time. And it certainly shouldn't be the thing that elevates him above Jim Lee. 

That's how I feel with Kirby and his 4th World stuff. 

Liefeld and Lee certainly make for an interesting compare-and-contrast essay.  I'm not a big fan of either but both are huge influences on modern comics. 

Liefelds run on New Mutants outshines Lee's X-men, IMO. The two of them were handed the keys to the Kingdom with Heroes disappear, reborn, whatever and screwed it up horribly.  What little I've seen of Lee's DC work doesn't impress me.

I own copies of NM 87 and 98, as well as three pieces of OA by Liefeld. I don't believe I own anything by Lee, nor are any on my short want list.

While I like Lees's art and stories better, I think a legitimate case can be made for Liefeld placing higher than Lee.

[eastbayrudy]

On 4/18/2023 at 8:34 AM, comix4fun said:

As a preface....I don't begrudge anyone asking any price for their work or signature. If they want it, and the market will pay it, then I say go for it. 

HOWEVER...

You're not serious placing Rob's contribution to comics above Jim Lee's, are you? That's an Andy Kaufman-style performance art piece of satire, right? 

If you really love Deadpool as he's portrayed in modern comics and in the movies I suggest placing a crisp $20 bill inside a thank you note and mailing it to Reilly Brown (and another $20 each to Joe Kelly and Christopher Priest for perfected  DP's comic tone)  for his work on the character to elevate it above the Deathstroke/Wolverine ripoff he was originally created to be, as it's Reilly's work you see in the films for the most part. 

Crediting Liefeld with Deadpool becoming a super popular character is like crediting the guy who invented Play Dough as a wallpaper cleaner for creating what someone else turned into one of the most popular children's toys of all time. And it certainly shouldn't be the thing that elevates him above Jim Lee. 

Liefeld's art may not be perfect, but you cant lie...it took the 90's by storm. Say what you want but his style kicked ! And yes I do think his contribution is more then that of Lee. All Lee does is draw other peoples characters (art is over-rated at that), his creator owned titles for Image where blah and his run being the head guy at DC sucks imo. Liefeld created Deadpool and Xforce. Who did Lee create that is at that level?

[eastbayrudy]

On 4/15/2023 at 4:15 AM, Every Day A Story said:

I'm quite happy to keep my NM 87 and 98 graded copies Liefield sig clean. He ain't Stan or Todd 

Well Stan should'nt touch anything from NM87 and on since he had nothing to do with that...Todd on the other hand is extremely over rated. Love his Spiderman though. All his other characters look funky. Spawn was not bad. Just my 2-cents. 

[ADAMANTIUM]

On 4/18/2023 at 1:15 PM, eastbayrudy said:

Liefeld's art may not be perfect, but you cant lie...it took the 90's by storm. Say what you want but his style kicked ! And yes I do think his contribution is more then that of Lee. All Lee does is draw other peoples characters (art is over-rated at that), his creator owned titles for Image where blah and his run being the head guy at DC sucks imo. Liefeld created Deadpool and Xforce. Who did Lee create that is at that level?

he's credited as a creator of Gambit

[ADAMANTIUM]

On 4/18/2023 at 1:46 PM, ADAMANTIUM said:

On 4/18/2023 at 1:15 PM, eastbayrudy said:

Liefeld's art may not be perfect, but you cant lie...it took the 90's by storm. Say what you want but his style kicked ! And yes I do think his contribution is more then that of Lee. All Lee does is draw other peoples characters (art is over-rated at that), his creator owned titles for Image where blah and his run being the head guy at DC sucks imo. Liefeld created Deadpool and Xforce. Who did Lee create that is at that level?

he's credited as a creator of Gambit

[shadroch]

Is Gambit relevant for anything besides arguing over his first appearance?  Is he still an X-men? Has he died yet?   Can one be an X-men if they haven't died yet?

[comix4fun]

On 4/18/2023 at 1:15 PM, eastbayrudy said:

 Liefeld created Deadpool 

Liefeld's deadpool had multiple canceled titles and as a flat Wolverine/Deathstroke clone. It wasn't until it was in the hands other writers and artists did he develop the personality that made him popular and ultimately the Ryan Reynolds film character. 

Liefeld is the Winkelvoss twins to the Reilly Brown/Joe Kelly/Christopher Priest Zuckerberg when it comes to Deadpool.

[ThothAmon]

Any truth that he’s Sal Buscema’s second cousin?

[comix4fun]

On 4/18/2023 at 2:50 PM, ThothAmon said:

Any truth that he’s Sal Buscema’s second cousin?

Deadpool? 




Seriously though, I had not heard that one.

[OJ Pimpson]

I couldn’t care less about the characters these artists created. I admire Jim Lee for his mind blowing art and the way, through his talent, is able to bring these stories so vividly to life. A talent Liefeld is woefully devoid of.  And let’s be real, Liefeld Co-Created Deadpool as a direct character swipe of Deathstroke . A very different Deadpool than the one we know today, the one that is now a beloved character, he can take all the credit he wants but what he “created” exists only in appearance today. Aside from that his creative efforts at Image were the most blatant and sloppily done character swipes in the history of comics. Like this Gem, a character named troll that can best be described as Wolverine in sunglasses. Troll may or may not have Down’s Syndrome and several dozen tumors growing all over his body. Additionally Troll possesses hooves instead of feet and the worst camel toe ever documented in human history 

 

Edited April 19, 2023 by Hot Nickels

[eastbayrudy]

Pointing out some of his not so great creations like Troll does not diminish the fact he was a very important part of comics in the 90's and today. Deadpool is very different from Deathstroke and is a HUGE part of pop culture today. Whether he was inspired by Deathstroke of another character does not really matter. If you want to do that, we can probably list several characters that might have taken inspiration from another character. As far as Lee having mind blowing art??? Speak for yourself  because I %100 disagree on that claim. 

[comix4fun]

On 4/22/2023 at 1:28 PM, eastbayrudy said:

Pointing out some of his not so great creations like Troll does not diminish the fact he was a very important part of comics in the 90's and today. Deadpool is very different from Deathstroke and is a HUGE part of pop culture today. Whether he was inspired by Deathstroke of another character does not really matter. If you want to do that, we can probably list several characters that might have taken inspiration from another character. As far as Lee having mind blowing art??? Speak for yourself  because I %100 disagree on that claim. 

I welcome a discussion of all the ways Slade Wilson differs from Wade Wilson..