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Punisher art and Marvel's actions
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Started by KirbyCollector,

86 posts in this topic

KirbyCollector

KirbyCollector

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In the last months Marvel has offed Daredevil, Ms. Marvel (Khan) and the Punisher. Daredevil is due to be "revived" and I don't know what Ms. Marvel's fate is, but the Punisher is being declared really dead -- in large part because Marvel apparently doesn't like the fact he was adopted as a symbol by people they don't like. They changed his uniform logo months ago as a step to disassociate the character from controversy, but the last issue of his current series goes one step further by completely disavowing his reason for being. Will this impact art values for the character? We've seen the impact on Ethan Van Scriver's art due to his leanings... will this be the same, considering how Marvel views the Punisher?

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MIL0S

MIL0S

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I haven't been keeping up with the character for quite a while but some quick googling seems to indicate the latest storyline involved supernatural powers and Dr. Strange? seems whether he lived or died the direction they've taken the character is so removed from what he was that it doesn't matter. IMO the best Punisher stories were always the ones removed from the rest of the Marvel superhero universe (and yes, I know he started as a Spider-Man villain), like the Zeck mini-series and Romita Jr. War Zone issues. I doubt the latest story/death will affect the value of art, I know it won't affect my interest in 80's/90's pieces at all. 

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Nate Hartz

Nate Hartz

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I think the story in Daredevil was leading to this and I have been really enjoying Chip's run on the book. Ms. Marvel was treated bad and with a movie coming out, it just seemed to be in poor taste. The Punisher was an interesting story but I think with the absorbing of his logo and name by police officers, the military and various groups, Disney decided to distance itself from that. I don't think the new design for the logo is going to change that either. I don't see the market for Frank Castle Punisher art diminishing in value. That's the big difference between a character vs. an individual. If an artist or writer is hated, that usually takes time to remove the memory of the horrible or bad things they have said or done. If a character does something awful, it just takes a different take to turn him around. 

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KirbyCollector

KirbyCollector

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On 6/9/2023 at 1:59 PM, Nate Hartz said:

If a character does something awful, it just takes a different take to turn him around

In this case the character didn't "do" anything... yet the parent company has decided to burn down his whole background because of some minor outside usage they didn't approve of? That's damn foolish, considering he is one of the most iconic Marvel creations of the past 50 years.

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Peter G

Peter G

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On 6/9/2023 at 3:22 PM, KirbyCollector said:

That's damn foolish, considering he is one of the most iconic Marvel creations of the past 50 years.

Bud lite, Target … Disney/Marvel next 🙏🏼. These snakes will eat their own tail eventually. 

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redrighthand

redrighthand

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The Punisher is too big to be taken down either by fascist cops/sheriff's gangs (yes, some are just comics fans, but should be smart enough to know that the Punisher has no place on their uniform or car) or by backing off his story.

At the same time, I get the concept that continuing to tell these Punisher story's is fueling a Frank Castle attitude in people who should know better and realize that ultimately he's not the good guy, but he's taken to much of a cultural foothold and those values aren't going anywhere, I don't think.

 

Frank's a frakkin' urban legend now!

 

 

Edited by redrighthand
Typo
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SquareChaos

SquareChaos

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On 6/9/2023 at 3:22 PM, KirbyCollector said:

In this case the character didn't "do" anything... yet the parent company has decided to burn down his whole background because of some minor outside usage they didn't approve of? That's damn foolish, considering he is one of the most iconic Marvel creations of the past 50 years.

It is quite difficult to destroy anything in comics, especially if there's any value in it. Continuity can always be revived at a later date. Some writer up against a deadline will lean into what came before as a quick way to add depth - that's a story almost as old as comics at this point.

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Hockeyflow33

Hockeyflow33

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On 6/9/2023 at 7:32 PM, redrighthand said:

At the same time, I get the concept that continuing to tell these Punisher story's is fueling a Frank Castle attitude in people who should know better and realize that ultimately he's not the good guy, but he's taken to much of a cultural foothold and those values aren't going anywhere, I don't think.

 

With a good writer he can definitely be a good guy. How many marvel characters kill people, it's way more than you think. 

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grapeape

grapeape

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On 6/9/2023 at 4:32 PM, redrighthand said:

The Punisher is too big to be taken down either by fascist cops/sheriff's gangs (yes, some are just comics fans, but should be smart enough to know that the Punisher has no place on their uniform or car) or by backing off his story.

At the same time, I get the concept that continuing to tell these Punisher story's is fueling a Frank Castle attitude in people who should know better and realize that ultimately he's not the good guy, but he's taken to much of a cultural foothold and those values aren't going anywhere, I don't think.

 

Frank's a frakkin' urban legend now!

 

 

Frank Castle is a man who does what needs doing. He's not going anywhere for long. He has work to do. 💀 

 

Edited by grapeape
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MAR1979

MAR1979

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On 6/9/2023 at 11:27 AM, KirbyCollector said:

In the last months Marvel has offed Daredevil, Ms. Marvel (Khan) and the Punisher. Daredevil is due to be "revived" and I don't know what Ms. Marvel's fate is, but the Punisher is being declared really dead -- in large part because Marvel apparently doesn't like the fact he was adopted as a symbol by people they don't like. They changed his uniform logo months ago as a step to disassociate the character from controversy, but the last issue of his current series goes one step further by completely disavowing his reason for being. Will this impact art values for the character? We've seen the impact on Ethan Van Scriver's art due to his leanings... will this be the same, considering how Marvel views the Punisher?

:facepalm:

We lost Bucky and Prof X in the late 60, Gwen Stacey and the Green Goblin in 1973, Thanos in 1977, Jean Grey in 1980, Flash and Supergirl in 1985, Iron Fist In 1986, Robin in 1989, Superman in 1993, then Captain America,Thor, and The Human Torch a decade later, Wolverine about 10 years ago, all never ever to be seen again, now the Punisher...  Oh Lord, when will the madness end? Soon there will be no comic book characters left :(

Edited by MAR1979
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