Newsstands and Direct Editions (finally) get a video explainer... Version 1.2 8 8

[valiantman]

On 7/18/2023 at 1:49 PM, FlyingDonut said:

That's what I mean. Many sellers indicate a book is a "newsstand" as if it was something special. No, slappy, the only copy of Fantastic Four 165 - just as an example - is a newsstand.

Yeah, I see the problem, but to me it's no different than sellers claiming a book is "Mint" when it's obvious midgrade or a seller who calls a book "Hard to Find" when there are two dozen available right at that moment. In fact, the book is a newsstand, so they're only implying that there's any other way to buy Fantastic Four #165. They're just flat out lying about "Mint" and "Hard to Find".

[Get Marwood & I]

On 7/18/2023 at 7:54 PM, valiantman said:

Yeah, I see the problem,

You're adding to it, by calling them newsstands in your educational video. They'll follow your lead, and call pre-direct books newsstand editions. 

[FlyingDonut]

On 7/18/2023 at 2:57 PM, Get Marwood & I said:

You're adding to it, by calling them newsstands in your educational video. They'll follow your lead, and call pre-direct books newsstand editions. 

This. By calling them newsstands you give the unscrupulous seller a way to market books AND the uneducated buyer confusion. Be very emphatic. Prior to (roughly) 1977 there were only comic books.

[lostboys]

On 7/18/2023 at 2:49 PM, FlyingDonut said:

That's what I mean. Many sellers indicate a book is a "newsstand" as if it was something special. No, slappy, the only copy of Fantastic Four 165 - just as an example - is a newsstand.

 

 

I think i listed it as a newsstand edition.

 

[Get Marwood & I]

On 7/18/2023 at 8:11 PM, lostboys said:

 

 

I think i listed it as a newsstand edition.

 

Innocently. Others will too. Especially if they've watched Greg's video. 

Spoiler

 

[MAR1979]

On 7/18/2023 at 10:43 AM, valiantman said:

 

Version 1.1 has it

imho is more accurate to state 1976 (1977?) or Mid 1970s The current wording will be interpeted by many as post 1969

Edited July 18, 2023 by MAR1979

[MAR1979]

On 7/18/2023 at 2:54 PM, valiantman said:

Yeah, I see the problem, but to me it's no different than sellers claiming a book is "Mint" when it's obvious midgrade or a seller who calls a book "Hard to Find" when there are two dozen available right at that moment. In fact, the book is a newsstand, so they're only implying that there's any other way to buy Fantastic Four #165. They're just flat out lying about "Mint" and "Hard to Find".

You video does not help fuel lying about mint but is highly plausible will regarding newsstand misleading/lying.  ...paved with very best of intentions applies

Edited July 18, 2023 by MAR1979

[valiantman]

Is there any reason to believe that sellers will not use "Newsstand" for every comic which has no other version even if I did change the wording in the video from "All comics were newsstand comics" to "All comics were sold via newsstand distribution"?

The word newsstand would still be right there on the screen, and the people who want to "cling" to the word will be reading the same word. 

I avoided "Newsstand edition" on purpose because there were no other editions. I also pointed out that it's unnecessary to say "Newsstand" if it's the only version that exists.

We seem to be focusing on something that cannot be stopped, because it is TRUE that all comics pre-direct were sold via the same mechanism as the same newsstand editions at the time when the direct market emerged.

We have been seeing people making a big deal about "Newsstand" comics as if they are some crazy rare experiment that failed, like Spawn newsstand issues, when the fact is that newsstand came first in the industry by decades.  It was an experiment for Image, but 60+ years old for comics.

Newsstand was all that existed. Direct Market was the crazy experiment that popped up. It was the 2010s before newsstand stopped and newsstand comics had started in the 1930s.

Edited July 18, 2023 by valiantman

[valiantman]

CGC's official statement:

"Newsstand editions are comic books that were distributed to the public through traditional channels like newsstands, grocery stores and drug stores. This was the only way comics were distributed during the first 45 years of the industry."

If anyone is saying that 1930s-1960s comics were quote "Newsstand editions", it's CGC, not me.

https://www.cgccomics.com/news/article/10675/comics-newsstand-multipack/

Edited July 18, 2023 by valiantman

[Get Marwood & I]

On 7/18/2023 at 9:32 PM, valiantman said:

CGC's official statement:

"Newsstand editions are comic books that were distributed to the public through traditional channels like newsstands, grocery stores and drug stores. This was the only way comics were distributed during the first 45 years of the industry."

If anyone is saying that 1930s-1960s comics were quote "Newsstand editions", it's CGC, not me.

https://www.cgccomics.com/news/article/10675/comics-newsstand-multipack/

The same crowd who label 'foreign' reprints as first appearances?

You've acknowledged there's a problem Greg. You can either educate people away from it with the right wording, or towards it with the wrong wording. They may take note, they may not. All that would matter to me, in your shoes, would be that I was on the right side of the argument, and that I was using the facts. The facts are that the term newsstand only gained the significance it holds today when the direct editions arrived. You're opening the door to the legitimate use of a term that wasn't in play to a group of books that stood alone. People may use it to deceive, as today Newsstand (often inacurately) means scarcity, means money. 

[valiantman]

On 7/18/2023 at 3:49 PM, Get Marwood & I said:

The same crowd who label 'foreign' reprints as first appearances?

You've acknowledged there's a problem Greg. You can either educate people away from it with the right wording, or towards it with the wrong wording. They may take note, they may not. All that would matter to me, in your shoes, would be that I was on the right side of the argument, and that I was using the facts. The facts are that the term newsstand only gained the significance it holds today when the direct editions arrived. You're opening the door to the legitimate use of a term that wasn't in play to a group of books that stood alone. People may use it to deceive, as today Newsstand (often inacurately) means scarcity, means money. 

What do you suggest, since newsstand was first, didn't have to be called newsstand when there was no other method, but is definitely called newsstand once direct editions arrived?  Implying that there was no newsstand distribution before direct editions is a lie. Saying that newsstands were newsstands before the word newsstand was necessary is not a lie.

[Get Marwood & I]

On 7/18/2023 at 9:54 PM, valiantman said:

What do you suggest

State definitively that, whilst delivered via the newsstand distribution system, pre direct comics were not called 'newsstand editions'. State that they were just comics, stand alone, and that to call them newsstand editions retrospectively is incorrect. State that the only legitimate use of the term is where an alternative direct edition exists (as per CGCs labelling approach). Cement that understanding in. It's factual, and avoids opening any doors to misuse. 

[mr_highgrade]

Just call any comic books post June 1979 "Newsies". 

[valiantman]

On 7/18/2023 at 4:31 PM, mr_highgrade said:

Just call any comic books post June 1979 "Newsies". 

Especially if they're direct editions, right? 

[valiantman]

Several changes being made for Version 1.2.

Here's a sneak peek (not a video, just a single screen):

Edited July 18, 2023 by valiantman

[valiantman]

VERSION 1.2

 

[seanlinc]

I think it is well put together and easy to follow. As a kid I had no clue about the bar code differences and even when I was buying comics in the 90s didn't really know what it was about. When I got back into the hobby in 2021 I saw the difference in values and had to educate myself on the whole thing. Alot of googling and reading ensued your video would have saved Me alot of time.

[valiantman]

On 7/18/2023 at 5:57 PM, seanlinc said:

I think it is well put together and easy to follow. As a kid I had no clue about the bar code differences and even when I was buying comics in the 90s didn't really know what it was about. When I got back into the hobby in 2021 I saw the difference in values and had to educate myself on the whole thing. Alot of googling and reading ensued your video would have saved Me alot of time.

Thanks. It feels like the right time to get this kind of video done, since CGC announced newsstand labeling last year, but they haven't put them on the CGC Census yet. It was 5 years ago when some generic information was posted on Newsstand101.com (and DirectEdition101.com) but I doubt if it has gotten the kind of viewing that a short video on YouTube could manage. Plus, I've only recently learned how to make videos.

Edited July 18, 2023 by valiantman

[Lazyboy]

On 7/18/2023 at 3:32 PM, valiantman said:

CGC's official statement:

"Newsstand editions are comic books that were distributed to the public through traditional channels like newsstands, grocery stores and drug stores. This was the only way comics were distributed during the first 45 years of the industry."

If anyone is saying that 1930s-1960s comics were quote "Newsstand editions", it's CGC, not me.

https://www.cgccomics.com/news/article/10675/comics-newsstand-multipack/

As is too often the case, CGC is incorrect here. Comics were distributed through the newsstand system, through the mail (subscriptions), and however any promotional comics were distributed.

Unfortunately, that's hardly the only inaccuracy in that article, but I'm pretty sure we went over that before, when it was released.

[ADAMANTIUM]

On 7/18/2023 at 6:00 PM, valiantman said:

On 7/18/2023 at 5:57 PM, seanlinc said:

I think it is well put together and easy to follow. As a kid I had no clue about the bar code differences and even when I was buying comics in the 90s didn't really know what it was about. When I got back into the hobby in 2021 I saw the difference in values and had to educate myself on the whole thing. Alot of googling and reading ensued your video would have saved Me alot of time.

Thanks. It feels like the right time to get this kind of video done, since CGC announced newsstand labeling last year, but they haven't put them on the CGC Census yet. It was 5 years ago when some generic information was posted on Newsstand101.com (and DirectEdition101.com) but I doubt if it has gotten the kind of viewing that a short video on YouTube could manage. Plus, I've only recently learned how to make videos.

Because no one asked, but to offer another point of view:

I bought what was available and seemingly comfortably priced at the time, back when it was neck and neck. A few newsstands would end up higher, everyone assumed but asked why, and I think that led to some sticking in higher price.

I still somehow think that the higher newsstand price is few and far between, especially when looking at a bigger picture.

It is still the thrill of the hunt for me, which sometimes means taking what is AVAILABLE (and whatever that entails price and etc)... being content with what you end up with. 

I buy newsstand "price editions", as cgc labeled those long ago, but I'm collecting them just because it is unique and stand alone within newsstands.

idk though, there were still nuances with those, that I remember most sought the early 2000s, but those are seemingly so scarce for me that I'm comfortable enough in the hunt post 2010.

They may be correctly labeled or not, but it is "different enough" that eventually Lord willing they will have their own niche.

Long rant to vent. 

Edited July 19, 2023 by ADAMANTIUM