Relevance of Grade when collecting 1 1

[FlyingDonut]

On 8/8/2023 at 12:02 AM, tth2 said:

I've always been puzzled by the economics of slabbing CA and Modern books, because the profit margins for non-keys just don't seem to be big enough to be worth it.  I can only guess that they are mass submissions with the aim of getting 9.8s, and anything that comes back with a grade of less than 9.8 is just considered to be a cost of doing business.

Pre-screening is your friend.

[jcjames]

On 8/4/2023 at 11:44 AM, Jesse-Lee said:

This is how I've always felt about it, especially when talking about graded books - I've written this in the past, but I'll quote it here:

   Quote

Some lower grades on certain books have seen a higher percentage return than the same book in a 9.8,and it allows you to diversify your investment across multiple books. You could spend $1,000 on one 9.8 book and see a 20% return, or spend $1,000 across 3 9.2 books and see a cumulative 40% return for example. It can be book dependent of course, but there's solid evidence for it. And if you have one 9.8 that dips, your whole investment dips, but if you have 3 9.2 and one dips, the other two could potentially cover your losses.

  

 

If I had unlimited funds, I'd go for the highest grade possible in every book. But since I don't, I buy the books I like in grades I can afford and am happy with. For example, I have a 4.0 Detective 359, a 6.5 Batman 232, a 7.5 Batman 234, a 6.5 Batman 251, etc. For me, I'd rather have those 4 books in the grades I have them in, vs. one of those books in a much higher grade for the same total cost.

I agree with this, from a collecting standpoint and an "investing" standpoint. 

There've been many threads in the past where this has been fleshed out with statistics using various keys (both big and small keys). 

The idea is that if one has $X,XXX to spend on keys, from a collecting standpoint, many folks would prefer to have several different well-presenting keys rather than a single highest-graded key. Also, from an "investing" standpoint, it's been shown many times that SA/BA keys more often than not (but not in all cases) have the highest room for growth in value and ROI if they are mid-grade rather than the highest-graded specimens.  

Plus suppose one spends $3,000 on a single key book. When it's time to sell, that's all one has is that single specimen. Whereas if one were to buy say three mid/upper grade copies of the same book for $1,000 each, one can sell one or two of them at various times later for a gain and still have one left for longer-term holding. And as mentioned, mid/upper grade books often will grow in value at a greater rate than the highest-graded copy. Especially when the highest graded prices get too high for the average collector. 

Personally, I agree with JL, I prefer the highest-quality looking book I can afford, but since I don't have unlimited funds, I don't want to sink a huge amount into just a very few number of top-grade books. 

[tth2]

On 8/9/2023 at 10:04 PM, FlyingDonut said:

On 8/5/2023 at 10:26 AM, tth2 said:

When it comes to collecting BA, it's not just the grade.  Getting most BA books in 9.6 or 9.8 is not particularly hard.  But most of them have a big fat white stripe down the spine, or are misaligned, or are cut off at the top or at the bottom, or all of the above. 

What's really hard is getting BA books in high grade with excellent QP. 

And white pages.

I would rather have a well-centered 9.8 book with OW-W pages than some slanted 9.8 book with W pages.

[davidking623]

I enjoy a 9.6 White Page myself , not always can you see the difference from a 9.8 , although the numerical point difference is different , while you can see sometimes the difference but it's not always easy to see the difference looking thru plastic , kind of like when you pull the book out of a bag and can see it raw . I for myself would rather own a 9.6 centered White page then a 9.8 White page misaligned/slanted book .

[COI]

On 8/9/2023 at 11:36 PM, jcjames said:

Also, from an "investing" standpoint, it's been shown many times that SA/BA keys more often than not (but not in all cases) have the highest room for growth in value and ROI if they are mid-grade rather than the highest-graded specimens.  

 

This is a good point and one that is often ignored in these discussions. In the same way that discussions of market trends tend to revolve around the top end books, even when those sales constitute a tiny percentage of the market, discussions around investment tend to revolve around high grade books based on the fallacy that buying the highest grade you can afford on any particular book is always the way to go. The term "investment grade" has always bothered me because it doesn't make much sense. Buying mid-grade Hulk 181s 20 years ago has proven to be a great investment, just as high grade copies have proven to be a great investment, and the same thing applies to VF ASM 300s and many other ultra common books.

There are a lot of books out there and there's enough data available to support almost any kind of argument you want to make about how collectors should spend their money. 

[thehumantorch]

On 8/4/2023 at 8:31 AM, aabruzzese said:

How much importance do you guys put on the Grade of the book when collecting, I am debating if I want to try and get 
all my keys in 9.8 over the long haul as opposed to buying 9.0 -> 9.6 copies to complete the set. 

I am going to start looking at how to get higher grade books at smart values and offload the lesser one's when I do make a purchase.

At the moment I have 6 copies of Peter Parker Spectacular #1 all of them are 8.5 to 9.2 at best, so it is alluring to look for a 9.8 and 
call it a day.   What are your thoughts ?

 

Grade is very important but the reality is many of the books I look for and buy don’t exist or rarely show up in high grade.  I guess I’m saying everybody collects different stuff and collects differently.  For. CA and MA books I’d buy the best book I could afford 

[FlyingDonut]

On 8/10/2023 at 12:23 AM, tth2 said:

I would rather have a well-centered 9.8 book with OW-W pages than some slanted 9.8 book with W pages.

I'll hold out for a well-centered 9.8 with white pages. I can wait...unless @WernerVonDoom and his magic searching powers get to it first.

[WernerVonDoom]

On 8/10/2023 at 7:13 AM, FlyingDonut said:

I'll hold out for a well-centered 9.8 with white pages. I can wait...unless @WernerVonDoom and his magic searching powers get to it first.

Well, I think you right on the edge jumping back in. At least you don't have to worry about me for most of them. 

[tth2]

On 8/10/2023 at 10:13 PM, FlyingDonut said:

I'll hold out for a well-centered 9.8 with white pages.

[RobAnybody]

I view this question similarly to how I view buying a new TV: "Always go slightly bigger". Basically, if you are buying a new TV, always go at least 1 size bigger.  If you are looking at a 70" TV, just get a 75". You'll never regret it, but you *might* regret not getting the bigger one & kinda wish you did, 'cause you are gonna have it for a long time & you are stuck with your original choice. You never want to regret that original choice,

Same with buying graded comics. When you are collecting (not flipping, not looking to sell), you will never regret buying the higher grade. Especially if they increase in price & you kinda even half pay attention to that that, even if you have no intention in selling it (because, if you're here, you probably do that).

A personal example: Batman Adventures 12 (1st Harley Quinn). Many years ago, I didn't want to pay $400-500 for a 9.8, so I bought a 9.6 for roughly $150 by bidding on several auctions on ebay until I won one. I'm never gonna sell this comic. But I do enjoy tracking the price of it occasionally (recent ebay auctions: 9.6 @$851; 9.8 @2,469).

It would've been more "fun" tracking the 9.8 if I'd bought it way back then, not to mention just seeing the 9.8 instead of the 9.6 in my collection. So, my advice is: No Ragrets (I mean assuming price isn't a financial issue). Buy the higher grade, every time. You will never regret it. You WILL occasionally regret NOT doing so.

[lou_fine]

On 9/1/2023 at 5:18 PM, RobAnybody said:

A personal example: Batman Adventures 12 (1st Harley Quinn). Many years ago, I didn't want to pay $400-500 for a 9.8, so I bought a 9.6 for roughly $150 by bidding on several auctions on ebay until I won one. I'm never gonna sell this comic. But I do enjoy tracking the price of it occasionally (recent ebay auctions: 9.6 @$851; 9.8 @2,469).

So, it looks like you've confirmed what many boardies have already said here, that you can indeed get a better ROI when you go for the lower grade as opposed to the higher grade.  

[MAR1979]

On 8/4/2023 at 3:17 PM, seanfingh said:

Well, I think part of it is also that we are kind of talking about different types of books.  I think that your comment is spot on when you say You could spend $1,000 on one 9.8 book and see a 20% return, or spend $1,000 across 3 9.2 books and see a cumulative 40% return for example.  That is an analysis of books like keys or mini-keys, particularly when you are buying before price spikes.

I am talking about books like Super-Friends #1 or Joker #1 or Marvel Two-In-One #1 - books that have not much else going for them other than that they are #1s from Marvel or DC.

So in addition to your MAR1979's quite accurate "no one size fits all", I think that there are different points of inflection based upon where we are in the business cycle (hot vs. not) type of book and tons of other potential variables.  

 

I do agree with your point, but not as it applies to Joker #1.

I may be wrong but Joker #1 represents the 1st Marvel or  DC ongoing solo title where a Villain (pure Villain not an Anti-Hero) is the protagonist.  Not to mention a now semi-classic cover with every pre-1980 A-Level Batman Villain on it.

Add Peter Parker The Spectacular Spider-Man #1 to the list.

 

Edited December 6, 2023 by MAR1979