COMIC STORES 2023: 'IT'S NEARLY 2024 AND I'M MORE THAN CONCERNED' 4 4

[Mr Sneeze]

On 11/27/2023 at 4:53 PM, squidmo2000 said:

 

Have you seen the new season?

Drop average?

Shakespeare and Thad?

[Ken Aldred]

Never liked pickles.  Make me retch a bit.

And, I'm Sagittarius.

Don't know if they're really that popular with other Brits.

Edited November 29, 2023 by Ken Aldred

[Cat]

On 11/30/2023 at 1:56 AM, Ken Aldred said:

Never liked pickles.  Make me retch a bit.

And, I'm Sagittarius.

Don't know if they're really that popular with other Brits.

Probably too spicy for Brits.

[Ken Aldred]

On 11/29/2023 at 5:00 PM, Cat said:

Probably too spicy for Brits.

Chicken Tikka Masala is now considered one of our national dishes, and that’s a touch mild for Brit curry lovers.

And, we do like our curries. A nice Madras for me.

[Cat]

On 11/30/2023 at 10:26 AM, Ken Aldred said:

Chicken Tikka Masala is now considered one of our national dishes, and that’s a touch mild for Brit curry lovers.

And, we do like our curries. A nice Madras for me.

I can't get a good curry around me in Brissie where I live. The only place that's any good has stopped serving beef, the only meat I eat (besides bacon). Closest good curry place that serves beef is 25 minutes away, and I'm right up the road from a major shopping centre/food district, and not that far from the CBD. Luckily out where I'm staying at the moment with my aunt there's a terrific curry joint, does a terrific beef pepper fry. It's heavenly. Even just their spinach and cheese naan bread is S tier. 

I do enjoy a good madras though. Damn, now you've got me wanting curry at nearly 11am.

Edited November 30, 2023 by Cat

[ganni]

On 11/30/2023 at 8:44 AM, Cat said:

I can't get a good curry around me in Brissie where I live. The only place that's any good has stopped serving beef, the only meat I eat (besides bacon). Closest good curry place that serves beef is 25 minutes away, and I'm right up the road from a major shopping centre/food district, and not that far from the CBD. Luckily out where I'm staying at the moment with my aunt there's a terrific curry joint, does a terrific beef pepper fry. It's heavenly. Even just their spinach and cheese naan bread is S tier. 

I do enjoy a good madras though. Damn, now you've got me wanting curry at nearly 11am.

Curry for Cat and lasagna for garfield

[VintageComics]

We've discussed various aspects of why comic book stores are failing. 

I stand by the points that I've made that big corporate involvement through various avenues is adulterating the art form.

I also stand by the point that Manga (or Japanese comics), which is overtaking American comics are probably a model most should consider. 

I just had a very interesting conversation with a person (pretty much a stranger, I've only met them twice now including today) about Manga and why the read it. 

They basically told me that Manga is like The Simpsons, in that they have a huge amount of social commentary and open discourse that is permitted because the characters are not 'human' in the discussions, making the topics thought provoking without making them offensive. 

They told this sort of direct view into social culture is what makes Manga so appealing to them, and I can understand why. 

Outside of Battle of the Planets in the 80's and Frank Miller's obvious Japanese influence in comics, my experience to Japanese comic books is pretty limited. 

Does this ring true to any of the manga readers here?

[Lazyboy]

On 12/1/2023 at 3:21 PM, VintageComics said:

They basically told me that Manga is like The Simpsons

Well, they do both suck. But The Simpsons used to be great, so the comparison fails there.

On 12/1/2023 at 3:21 PM, VintageComics said:

they have a huge amount of social commentary

Wait, is social commentary good, or bad? I'm confused. Maybe only some is good?

[Lightning55]

On these boards, I would think there is only a tiny % of Manga readers to begin with. But I could be surprised to find out there are a lot.

[Prince Namor]

On 12/2/2023 at 4:21 AM, VintageComics said:

We've discussed various aspects of why comic book stores are failing. 

I stand by the points that I've made that big corporate involvement through various avenues is adulterating the art form.

Your example is so easy to disprove.

Individual print runs of comics have been on a downward slope for MOST of 60 years. Ever since they raised the price to 12 cents.

(There was the 'collectable' boom of the late 80's/early 90's)

 

Using the Amazing Spider-man as an example:

60's: 340,000 monthly

70's: 270,000 monthly

80's: 240,000 monthly (early 80's)

80's: 280,000 monthly (late 80's)

90's: 320,000 to 590,000 (early 90's)

90's: 120,000 (late 90's)

00's: 120,000 (early 00's)

10's: 100,000 (early 10's)

10's: 75,000 (late 10's)

20's: Unknown

 

The biggest drop in print runs was in the mid-90's when the bubble burst. In 5 years, the Amazing Spider-man went from 592,000 copies a month in 1993 to 119,000 a month in 1998. LONG before Blackrock or anyone's politics came into the discussion.

It's been a slow erosion ever since.

The biggest reasons are the most obvious:

PRICE - VALUE - MARKET - SERVICE - AGE

PRICE has gotten exorbitant. The #1 reason most former readers bring up.

VALUE - Video games, the quality of movies, smart phones, the Internet... comic books can't keep up, especially vs the cost. 

MARKET - Digital sales in particular is eating away at stores sales, much of it coming directly from Marvel and DC on their websites - but easy access to FREE digital copies takes its toll as well.

SERVICE - I can probably name, maybe... three comic book stores in my life that I ever went into that I thought the service was GREAT. Most have been terrible. Not welcoming at all. Add to that an inability to market themselves properly and... that's a disaster for ANY type of business. 

AGE - It's an aging fanbase. Dying off or quitting every year.

 

Without even bringing in, some fantasy scenario of cigar smoking corporate tycoons, grabbing Marvel editors by their tie, and saying, "Put more lesbians in the book, Bub!", there are more than enough factors to show why NEW comic book sales in stores are down. 

 

On 12/2/2023 at 4:21 AM, VintageComics said:

I also stand by the point that Manga (or Japanese comics), which is overtaking American comics are probably a model most should consider. 

I just had a very interesting conversation with a person (pretty much a stranger, I've only met them twice now including today) about Manga and why the read it. 

They basically told me that Manga is like The Simpsons, in that they have a huge amount of social commentary and open discourse that is permitted because the characters are not 'human' in the discussions, making the topics thought provoking without making them offensive. 

They told this sort of direct view into social culture is what makes Manga so appealing to them, and I can understand why. 

Outside of Battle of the Planets in the 80's and Frank Miller's obvious Japanese influence in comics, my experience to Japanese comic books is pretty limited. 

Does this ring true to any of the manga readers here?

Not at all. 

PART of Manga's overall appeal comes from exactly the type of content YOU believe is screwing up the American market. There's no shortage of fairies, feminine male characters, homosexuals (MALE maybe even more than female), Transgender, deviant HETROsexual behaviors... violence, ultra violence... RAPE... Manga does NOT hold back at all. 

Today's TEEN has grown up most of their life with the power of the internet in their hands. 

What haven't they seen?

Mainstream comics must seem... pretty tame to them.

When people show me what they think is offensive in most American comics, I can only laugh at how naive it is.

Tim Vigil's Faust is over 30 years old. Back then, THAT was a truly shocking American comic. 

Today it'd be no more shocking than some mainstream manga.

 

The OTHER part of Manga that makes it appealing - and I would say the most IMPORTANT part, is something you can probably relate to more. It is the CREATORS, completely in charge of their story and ideas, and NOT influenced by the editorial control of a COMPANY.

Whereas I don't agree with your Blackrock/ESG premise, there's no question that as a COMPANY, Marvel Comics has an editorial vision, motivated NOT by Politics, but from what THEY perceive as beneficial to them - long term or some decisions (adding diversity) and short term on others (endless rebooting/variants).

Manga doesn't have to deal with that.

Much like HBO (who blows the whole Blackrock theory up as an example), they agree to a Creators vision and then allow them to go make it, WITHOUT interference*. The audience decides if they like it or not. 

That creator will stay with the series for almost as long as it exists, allowing it to remain true to its essence.

 

 

*I mean, they try a LITTLE, depending on where it's published. But it's nuanced. A great manga to read that goes into great detail about it, while being extremely entertaining is BAKUMAN. It really goes through the good, the bad, the ugly and the history of manga creation. 

 

 

Edited December 2, 2023 by Prince Namor

[Hamlet]

On 12/1/2023 at 6:43 PM, Prince Namor said:

It's been a slow erosion ever since.

The biggest reasons are the most obvious:

PRICE - VALUE - MARKET - SERVICE - AGE

PRICE has gotten exorbitant. The #1 reason most former readers bring up.

VALUE - Video games, the quality of movies, smart phones, the Internet... comic books can't keep up, especially vs the cost. 

MARKET - Digital sales in particular is eating away at stores sales, much of it coming directly from Marvel and DC on their websites - but easy access to FREE digital copies takes its toll as well.

SERVICE - I can probably name, maybe... three comic book stores in my life that I ever went into that I thought the service was GREAT. Most have been terrible. Not welcoming at all. Add to that an inability to market themselves properly and... that's a disaster for ANY type of business. 

AGE - It's an aging fanbase. Dying off or quitting every year.

I would add that the old comic book structure of producing a small piece of entertainment once a month just isn’t how many people want to consume content these days.  I want content to adhere to my schedule of consumption, and more and more of it does.  The idea of waiting to watch a TV show on a specific day and time once a week is dying.  I’d rather just wait until the season is complete and then stream it whenever I want to watch it.  I think the idea of going to the comic book store once a week for new releases is kind of in the same category. 

Trades seem so much better to me.  I think the only reason floppies are still around is nostalgia from people that grew up collecting like that.  I can’t imagine someone new who wanted to read comics preferring that experience to buying trades.  I don’t know anything about Manga, but isn’t it mostly sold in a trade format?

 

 

[Buzzetta]

On 12/1/2023 at 10:42 PM, Hamlet said:

I would add that the old comic book structure of producing a small piece of entertainment once a month just isn’t how many people want to consume content these days.  I want content to adhere to my schedule of consumption, and more and more of it does.  The idea of waiting to watch a TV show on a specific day and time once a week is dying.  I’d rather just wait until the season is complete and then stream it whenever I want to watch it.  I think the idea of going to the comic book store once a week for new releases is kind of in the same category. 

Trades seem so much better to me.  I think the only reason floppies are still around is nostalgia from people that grew up collecting like that.  I can’t imagine someone new who wanted to read comics preferring that experience to buying trades.  I don’t know anything about Manga, but isn’t it mostly sold in a trade format?

 

 

That is a REALLY good point. 

The only reason I still buy anything "monthly" is to keep up my ASM collection.  I cannot be bothered to make an appointment every two weeks to make a trip to a comic store and "hope" that ASM has not sold out.  I also do not expect any comic store to hold my copy of ASM for me.  It's not worth their time apparently.  Ever since my old LCS owner retired, no store wanted to pick up a pull bag for one title.  

Now, fair enough.   No grudge or disappointment there.  However, it also means that I am not walking into a comic store once every two months and making any other purchases there either. 

So, I just received ASM 928, 929, 930, 931, 932 and some of the ASM Disney variants from MCS.  Conan and MCS are top notch.  I have nothing but positive things to say about every aspect of their business from ease of ordering, checkout,   

That was an invigorating 25-30 minute read for $45

Does Marvel REALLY expect people to sit down and consume "an episode" of their comic book that last for 6 minutes then wait for another 2-4 weeks for the next 6 minute episode?

That is preposterous. 

 

 

[squidmo2000]

the big sneeze,almost bought that......don't want be rich...happy being lower,middle class...

[squidmo2000]

happier than my parents were what a hard life,saw it first hand....oofaa..

[squidmo2000]

sorry,drunk individual_without_enough_empathy again...

[squidmo2000]

[squidmo2000]

lost $140 in AC...sad.....

[squidmo2000]

cant i just hit 50k on a 2 dolla ticket?...

 

[squidmo2000]

unec..

[squidmo2000]

horrible people.Im ashamed of all of you.lolololol