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ASM #252 CGC 9.8 Record Sale - something fishy going on? - Holder Tampering Incident confirmed by CGC
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Started by spidermanbeyond,

9,029 posts in this topic

William-James88

William-James88

Posted
Posted
On 12/23/2023 at 12:17 AM, thehumantorch said:

In a way they did by not making a statement....

I'm pretty sure that as far as they are concerned, this is just a comic in a 9.8 holder that doesn't look like a 9.8. However scammy way that may have happened, that's the end result. And that happens all the time and they never respond to that at a public level. It's basically buyer beware.

 

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drotto

drotto

Posted
Posted
On 12/23/2023 at 12:41 AM, William-James88 said:

I'm pretty sure that as far as they are concerned, this is just a comic in a 9.8 holder that doesn't look like a 9.8. However scammy way that may have happened, that's the end result. And that happens all the time and they never respond to that at a public level. It's basically buyer beware.

 

Until someone with deep pockets and 100k's worth of books takes them to court. You advertise as a grading expert that certifies books and condition, the law will treat you as an expert. 

I could also see a lawer bring a class action suit on the same basis.  This is the US, people love to sue, and we have lots of layers looking for work.

I can see tables of grading experts called as witnesses to argue over books in court.  Could be very entertaining.

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Bo1983

Bo1983

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Posted
On 12/23/2023 at 1:08 AM, drotto said:

Until someone with deep pockets and 100k's worth of books takes them to court. You advertise as a grading expert that certifies books and condition, the law will treat you as an expert. 

I could also see a lawer bring a class action suit on the same basis.  This is the US, people love to sue, and we have lots of layers looking for work.

I can see tables of grading experts called as witnesses to argue over books in court.  Could be very entertaining.

Exactly imagine someone breaking out there 8.0 Fantastic four 1 for a regrade and it comes back restored.

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Steven Valdez

Steven Valdez

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Posted
On 12/23/2023 at 5:08 PM, drotto said:

Until someone with deep pockets and 100k's worth of books takes them to court. You advertise as a grading expert that certifies books and condition, the law will treat you as an expert. 

I could also see a lawer bring a class action suit on the same basis.  This is the US, people love to sue, and we have lots of layers looking for work.

I can see tables of grading experts called as witnesses to argue over books in court.  Could be very entertaining.

It's the same thing as your bank getting hacked and losing your money. They're liable for not having adequate security measures in place.

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drotto

drotto

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On 12/23/2023 at 1:13 AM, Steven Valdez said:

It's the same thing as your bank getting hacked and losing your money. They're liable for not having adequate security measures in place.

Plus, they present themselves as experts. So simple things like missing pages, missing MVS, restoration should not get past them.  In fact that is part of how they advertise the value of their service. They can garentee a book meets certain criteria. It is also why they say grading is somewhat subjective, to give themselves some wiggle room. Meaning one grade up or down roughly, not 3 or 4 off.  It is also why they allow pressing and dry cleaning, if they can not reliably pick it up they legally do not want to garentee it is not there.

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Steven Valdez

Steven Valdez

Posted
Posted
On 12/23/2023 at 5:22 PM, drotto said:

Plus, they present themselves as experts. So simple things like missing pages, missing MVS, restoration should not get past them.  In fact that is part of how they advertise the value of their service. They can garentee a book meets certain criteria. It is also why they say grading is somewhat subjective, to give themselves some wiggle room. Meaning one grade up or down roughly, not 3 or 4 off.  It is also why they allow pressing and dry cleaning, if they can not reliably pick it up they legally do not want to garentee it is not there.

I've heard that they actually offer their own pressing service... not a fan of pressing, as it's always obvious when it's been done and it's literally a form of restoration.

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VintageComics

VintageComics

Posted
Posted
On 12/22/2023 at 10:19 PM, Steven Valdez said:

As I mentioned earlier, strongly adhesive hologram stickers on every edge of the case would mitigate opportunities for fraud.

4 times the headache, 4 times the quality control problems, 4 times the opportunity for something to go wrong, 4 times the hassle.

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brute_nm

brute_nm

Posted
Posted
On 12/22/2023 at 11:04 PM, Bo1983 said:

I wouldn’t be surprised if there’s a lot of silver age slabs involved in this!

Oh, for sure. With my limited resources, I've found the following cached eBay listings. All from zaneglor circa 2016-2017:

  1. ASM #1 7.0 
  2. ASM #1 7.5
  3. ASM #2 6.5
  4. ASM #2 7.0
  5. ASM #41 9.0
  6. FF #1 4.5

Someone with WorthPoint (like @agamoto) could give way more details

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Steven Valdez

Steven Valdez

Posted
Posted (edited)
On 12/23/2023 at 5:29 PM, brute_nm said:

Oh, for sure. With my limited resources, I've found the following cached eBay listings. All from zaneglor circa 2016-2017:

  1. ASM #1 7.0 
  2. ASM #1 7.5
  3. ASM #2 6.5
  4. ASM #2 7.0
  5. ASM #41 9.0
  6. FF #1 4.5

Someone with WorthPoint (like @agamoto) could give way more details

Son of a diddly! :ohnoez:

Edited by Steven Valdez
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Steven Valdez

Steven Valdez

Posted
Posted (edited)
On 12/23/2023 at 5:29 PM, VintageComics said:

4 times the headache, 4 times the quality control problems, 4 times the opportunity for something to go wrong, 4 times the hassle.

I would have thought tamper-proof (or tamper-evident) cases would alleviate the majority of concerns, stress and headaches? Well worth the extra 5 minutes of work per case, especially at minimum wage. Or you could get a robot to do it.

Edited by Steven Valdez
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Lightning55

Lightning55

Posted
Posted
On 12/23/2023 at 1:27 AM, Steven Valdez said:

I've heard that they actually offer their own pressing service... not a fan of pressing, as it's always obvious when it's been done and it's literally a form of restoration.

You've "heard"? They have had pressing available for maybe 20 years! Nothing slips past you. :baiting:

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