Ed Piskor Has Passed 5 5

[ThothAmon]

On 4/3/2024 at 7:34 PM, jimjum12 said:

I only entered this discussion when people started to insinuate that Ed somehow deserved his suicidal end because he flirted with a 17 year old. That disgusted me and always will.

Unless I’m missing something I think you have assumed the insinuation where none exists. No one in this thread has done this in my opinion.  Most just aren’t willing to blame her (regardless of how we judge her actions) for what he has done to himself.  There are no winners. 

[Dr. Balls]

On 4/3/2024 at 6:41 PM, ThothAmon said:

Most just aren’t willing to blame her (regardless of how we judge her actions) for what he has done to himself.  There are no winners. 

This is where I am at. He has chosen a permanent solution to a temporary problem. She will likely never be able to move on knowing that her actions had so much influence on him. Yes, it's "her story" and all that, but somewhere out there there is a woman defending herself by building up a psychological wall over all of this - which is not good for your brain or your soul. I sure as Hell wouldn't feel terribly good about someone doing something drastic like that over the result of something I said - even if I was right.

Sucks all around.

[Prince Namor]

On 4/4/2024 at 7:58 AM, Dr. Balls said:

This is where I am at. He has chosen a permanent solution to a temporary problem.

Maybe. As much as social media is a part of some people's every waking moment, he was going to get blasted every time he was online for... how long? 3 years? 4 years?

That's a long time to deal with people who... well just look at the virtue of some of the people in here. There was no physical contact between Ed and Molly and yet we got a barrage of people comparing it to sexual assault and 13 year olds and letting us know how much THEY are against those things. 

He had a long road ahead of him... not saying he was RIGHT. Just saying... the WAY people react to a situation like this is different than, say... if it had been a 17 year old MALE. 

Kevin Spacey is just now starting to get work again after being ERASED from a movie, losing a starring role, and pretty much blacklisted for 5 years. And he WON his case against Anthony Rapp. 

Ed obviously felt, either he couldn't handle however temporary it might've been or just that he couldn't handle it at all.

Not saying he was RIGHT. Just that... it was a tough road ahead.

On 4/4/2024 at 7:58 AM, Dr. Balls said:

She will likely never be able to move on knowing that her actions had so much influence on him. Yes, it's "her story" and all that, but somewhere out there there is a woman defending herself by building up a psychological wall over all of this - which is not good for your brain or your soul. I sure as Hell wouldn't feel terribly good about someone doing something drastic like that over the result of something I said - even if I was right.

Sucks all around.

This is looking at it sensibly. 

There are no good answers here. We ASSUME she did it to ease some pain she felt because of what had happened. She should have the right to do that. Most sensible people SUPPORT her right to do that. BUT, it sent an immediate backlash that she obviously didn't see coming, because... the internet and court of public opinion is a fickle little pickle. 

That's not condemning it. That's just what happened. 

And now... she has to live with what happened to ED. I ASSUME she didn't want to see that.

Ultimately... did sharing her story make her life better? Did she gain piece of mind from it? Or is it so much more complicated and painful than it was?

No judgement here. It does, as you say 'suck all around'. 

But everyday we all make decisions that could have an effect on other human beings... it helps to think long and hard about how easy it is for just a single Instagram post to open the world up to our entire life... for people who don't know us or care about us or will ever have anything to do with us to suddenly be privy to and make judgements about us that will be seen by hundreds of thousands and possibly millions of other people.

And how, we can do that to someone ELSE just as easily...

Again... no judgement for Molly. I assume she did what she thought was right.

But it just makes me think... for myself and anyone else who takes part in this social media monster we've created. 

Edited April 4 by Prince Namor

[wombat]

On 4/3/2024 at 7:34 PM, jimjum12 said:

I only entered this discussion when people started to insinuate that Ed somehow deserved his suicidal end because he flirted with a 17 year old

I don't think a single person has said or insinuated this. 

[Randall Dowling]

On 4/3/2024 at 7:58 PM, Dr. Balls said:

This is where I am at. He has chosen a permanent solution to a temporary problem. She will likely never be able to move on knowing that her actions had so much influence on him. Yes, it's "her story" and all that, but somewhere out there there is a woman defending herself by building up a psychological wall over all of this - which is not good for your brain or your soul. I sure as Hell wouldn't feel terribly good about someone doing something drastic like that over the result of something I said - even if I was right.

Sucks all around.

You stated it exactly correctly- "permanent solution to a temporary problem"

Having known a couple people that ended their own life (and some friends that had family members do so also), one of the most surprising things to me about suicide is that, in many cases, it's an act of both shame and blame.  Or put differently, depression and rage.  The world has let them down and they're both sad and angry about it.

At least one of the people I knew of, left a very angry note behind.  It was filled with accusations and blame for people in their life, much of which was just very misplaced.  But that didn't stop the family members from feeling really, really awful and responsible for it.  Permanently scarred.

As you said, sucks all around.

OPEN MESSAGE TO ANYONE STRUGGLING WITH THESE THOUGHTS:  If anyone reading this is ever in such a dark place, I highly recommend you find someone, anyone, to share what you're hurting over.  Tell them as much as you can and listen to their response.  Let go of your certainty and try to open up to other possibilities.  It's really, really hard, but I promise you won't regret it.  It's a big world, and there's always a place to find and restart if necessary.  Don't give up, more people care than you probably think.

[postersandstuff]

On 4/3/2024 at 3:11 AM, Ken Aldred said:

 

 

Absolutely.  I have Asperger's, depression, borderline mood fluctuation, ADD, OCD, trauma-related PTSD, and it should be obvious to others that a mixture of that intensity creates serious problems about remaining on an even keel.  Except it's largely invisible, with little external indication, no clearly perceivable physical marker.  I had no assistance whatsoever or diagnosis until I was 40 years old, and until then it felt like being trapped in an abyss.   Given how much I get hammered down by my spectrum condition, and the very negative ideation induced by it, I can understand the overwhelming despair in a situation like this one.  Certainly, at present, it's quite a struggle, and maybe miraculous I've made it through six decades.  Mental illness tests resilience, the ability to work through the nihilism and manage to reach and experience another brighter day, and not all of us make it. It's horrendous to be in thrall to that.

Its not just people that are socially awkward that can be inapp , last time I checked George Lazenby doesnt have autism and some of the stories hes told from back in the day arent always pc (like dragging a girl by her hair into a car....happened in Lon)

Edited April 4 by postersandstuff

[postersandstuff]

On 4/3/2024 at 5:34 PM, Chip Cataldo said:

It has nothing to do with who they are that they LIKE that stuff begin with?

Why choose lyrics about shooing someone? Why not helping someone instead?

It's like the Saw movies. Why do people enjoy movies about humans being killed in disgusting ways with copious amounts of gore? Why?

Fiction......also just cuz some people dont like it , they dont have to ban it (cough cough , video nasties) 

[Ryan.]

On 4/3/2024 at 10:14 PM, Prince Namor said:

But it just makes me think... for myself and anyone else who takes part in this social media monster we've created

If any lesson is to be taken from this whole situation I hope it's this. 

[Ken Aldred]

On 4/4/2024 at 6:37 AM, postersandstuff said:

Its not just people that are socially awkward that can be inapp , last time I checked George Lazenby doesnt have autism and some of the stories hes told from back in the day arent always pc (like dragging a girl by her hair into a car....happened in Lon)

I observe a lot of social ignorance in the neurotypical population.

I'm not convinced the group's quite that superior. 

There's certainly far, far more of an innate, comfortable, instinctive ability to socially integrate which we lack to some degree, and that makes a big difference. Like anything, that ability can be interpreted as a grey area; caring and positive, or abusive and destructive. Superior? Hardly. That's flattery. 

 

Edited April 4 by Ken Aldred

[Ken Aldred]

On 4/4/2024 at 4:55 AM, Randall Dowling said:

You stated it exactly correctly- "permanent solution to a temporary problem"

Having known a couple people that ended their own life (and some friends that had family members do so also), one of the most surprising things to me about suicide is that, in many cases, it's an act of both shame and blame.  Or put differently, depression and rage.  The world has let them down and they're both sad and angry about it.

At least one of the people I knew of, left a very angry note behind.  It was filled with accusations and blame for people in their life, much of which was just very misplaced.  But that didn't stop the family members from feeling really, really awful and responsible for it.  Permanently scarred.

As you said, sucks all around.

OPEN MESSAGE TO ANYONE STRUGGLING WITH THESE THOUGHTS:  If anyone reading this is ever in such a dark place, I highly recommend you find someone, anyone, to share what you're hurting over.  Tell them as much as you can and listen to their response.  Let go of your certainty and try to open up to other possibilities.  It's really, really hard, but I promise you won't regret it.  It's a big world, and there's always a place to find and restart if necessary.  Don't give up, more people care than you probably think.

Great post.

A recrimination motivation is only addressing part of the spectrum.  Sometimes, the individual might simply have had enough and sees no reason to continue with an appalling quality of life. That's personal experience, as my father had terminal emphysema, looked like an emaciated cancer patient, was housebound, couldn't care for himself, and killed himself in a very horrific way, which still gives me PTSD symptoms to this day. No note, no blaming anyone else, no transferral of responsibility, just abject, unremitting hopelessness.  

What I'm left with, though, is survivor's guilt, induced blame, that is, you wonder if you could've done far, far more to create a more comfortable, palliative environment, at the very least? 

In my father's case he didn't want to open up about his thoughts and be obstructed, and he only had a few months left at most, but, the level of ongoing, constant isolation and hopelessness he experienced must've been quite hellish.  And, I totally agree, if anyone has that internal miasma to deal with, then reach out and talk about it.  It's a cloud that needs to be dispelled not sustained, and I've seen it at its darkest. 

 

Edited April 4 by Ken Aldred

[jimjum12]

On 4/4/2024 at 11:31 AM, Ken Aldred said:

A recrimination motivation is only addressing part of the spectrum.

 

On 4/4/2024 at 11:31 AM, Ken Aldred said:

 And, I totally agree, if anyone has that internal miasma to deal with, then reach out and talk about it.  It's a cloud that needs to be dispelled not sustained, and I've seen it at its darkest.

.... and where are the recriminators when it comes time to actually step up and reach out? Quite probably finding others to recriminate for other things, so they can continue to satisfy that internet ego pump. 

I too, have had more than one dear friend commit suicide, there is rarely a common denominator, and it is NEVER just a simple choice. If anything, it is probably more like an undertow. Anytime I see someone minimizing suicide, or having a cavalier and dismissive attitude towards it, is going to get my . That level of insensitivity and presumption isn't getting a pass if I'm around. GOD BLESS ...

-jimbo(a friend of jesus)

 

Edited April 4 by jimjum12

[sfcityduck]

On 4/4/2024 at 9:22 AM, jimjum12 said:

 

.... and where are the recriminators when it comes time to actually step up and reach out? Quite probably finding others to recriminate for other things, so they can continue to satisfy that internet ego pump. 

I too, have had more than one dear friend commit suicide, there is rarely a common denominator, and it is NEVER just a simple choice. Anytime I see someone minimizing suicide, or having a cavalier and dismissive attitude towards it, is going to get my . That level of insensitivity and presumption isn't getting a pass if I'm around. GOD BLESS ...

-jimbo(a friend of jesus)

I think you missed the point of Randall Dowling and Ken Aldred's posts. Randall was addressing people who commit suicide, at least in part, in a bid to make others feel bad. As he said: "At least one of the people I knew of, left a very angry note behind.  It was filled with accusations and blame for people in their life, much of which was just very misplaced.  But that didn't stop the family members from feeling really, really awful and responsible for it.  Permanently scarred." A good case can be made that Ed's final missive reflects those attitudes and may well have a similar effect on some of the people he was lashing out at. In short, Randall, as I read him is addressing recrimination by the person committing suicide.

Ken, in responding to Randall, was addressing an entirely different scenario. Someone who is committing suicide in the face of, as he puts it, a "terminal" disease. He's saying that even in that situation, one where there was "no note, no blaming anyone else" (e.g. no recrimination by the person committing suicide) he still is haunted by his father's action and feels guilt. 

I don't believe either was talking about recrimination by others which caused a person to commit suicide.

I do think your post illuminates a disconnect in the debate here. Based on your experiences, your paramount concern is for persons at risk for suicide. You are offended by what you view as attacks on the victim - the person who has died. Others here, due to different experiences, have a paramount concern for the woman who told her story and are offended by what they view as attacks on that victim. 

Carry on.

 

[jimjum12]

On 4/4/2024 at 1:52 PM, sfcityduck said:

I think you missed the point of Randall Dowling and Ken Aldred's posts. Randall was addressing people who commit suicide, at least in part, in a bid to make others feel bad. As he said: "At least one of the people I knew of, left a very angry note behind.  It was filled with accusations and blame for people in their life, much of which was just very misplaced.  But that didn't stop the family members from feeling really, really awful and responsible for it.  Permanently scarred." A good case can be made that Ed's final missive reflects those attitudes and may well have a similar effect on some of the people he was lashing out at. In short, Randall, as I read him is addressing recrimination by the person committing suicide.

Ken, in responding to Randall, was addressing an entirely different scenario. Someone who is committing suicide in the face of, as he puts it, a "terminal" disease. He's saying that even in that situation, one where there was "no note, no blaming anyone else" (e.g. no recrimination by the person committing suicide) he still is haunted by his father's action and feels guilt. 

I don't believe either was talking about recrimination by others which caused a person to commit suicide.

I do think your post illuminates a disconnect in the debate here. Based on your experiences, your paramount concern is for persons at risk for suicide. You are offended by what you view as attacks on the victim - the person who has died. Others here, due to different experiences, have a paramount concern for the woman who told her story and are offended by what they view as attacks on that victim. 

Carry on.

 

I haven't misread anything at all. If you find yourself disagreeing with me, perhaps you should revisit the details and maybe determine where you went astray. I'm just not a big fan of insensitivity, yours included. How about you go play in the traffic? GOD BLESS ...

-jimbo(a friend of jesus)

[CGC Mike]

I hope that when I return this evening, I will find this thread civil.  I mean it...

[jimjum12]

On 4/4/2024 at 2:00 PM, CGC Mike said:

I hope that when I return this evening, I will find this thread civil.  I mean it...

My apologies Mike. It's a touchy subject for me, and it may be best if I recuse myself from this thread due to irreconcilable differences. Godspeed to Molly and R.I.P. to Ed Piskor. GOD BLESS ...

-jimbo(a friend of jesus)

[sfcityduck]

On 4/4/2024 at 11:17 AM, jimjum12 said:

My apologies Mike. It's a touchy subject for me, and it may be best if I recuse myself from this thread due to irreconcilable differences. Godspeed to Molly and R.I.P. to Ed Piskor. GOD BLESS ...

-jimbo(a friend of jesus)

And my apologies to you.  No insult or criticism intended. I thought the post was helpful, but I too will go back to sitting on the sidelines as best as I can.

[jimjum12]

On 4/4/2024 at 2:20 PM, sfcityduck said:

And my apologies to you.  No insult or criticism intended. I thought the post was helpful, but I too will go back to sitting on the sidelines as best as I can.

We're good, and there really isn't anything else that I can constructively add, so why should I spoil it for others? ... all the harm was definitely already done, and I don't need to become the internet Howard Cosell or Doctor Phil. GOD BLESS ... 

-jimbo(a friend of jesus)

[Prince Namor]

On 4/5/2024 at 12:57 AM, jimjum12 said:

I haven't misread anything at all. If you find yourself disagreeing with me, perhaps you should revisit the details and maybe determine where you went astray.

I think that, some have gone to considerable lengths to give the original victim the benefit of the doubt and 'empathy toward how she feels', regardless of if they even completely agree and certainly in light of what happened as a result. 

That's a GOOD thing to have and to do for others.

I don't think everyone has extended the same empathy towards Ed.

[Poekaymon]

On 4/4/2024 at 7:44 PM, Prince Namor said:

I think that, some have gone to considerable lengths to give the original victim the benefit of the doubt and 'empathy toward how she feels', regardless of if they even completely agree and certainly in light of what happened as a result. 

That's a GOOD thing to have and to do for others.

I don't think everyone has extended the same empathy towards Ed.

[Prince Namor]

On 4/5/2024 at 7:05 AM, Poekaymon said:

No, I DON'T think it's beating a dead horse.

There are still most here who are giving Molly D the benefit of the doubt and automatically accepting that what she is saying is true and MUST be taken as true, as that is what society tells us we should now do. Anyone who even SLIGHTLY questions it, is automatically hit with questions like, "I don't like where you're going with this..." and comparisons to sexual assault victims and 13 year old girls being put in harms way.

And then, because ED is the ACCUSED, he is NOT afforded that same courtesy, but rather what he has said has been picked apart and doubted and seen as completely fabricated to play to an audience. HE, because he is the accused, and I would suspect to some degree because he is an ADULT MALE, has been found guilty, without the benefit of all the facts.

The complete opposite of the way the American Justice System is supposed to work.

Most, just take for granted that a 17 year old girl could never be more wiley than a 40 year old man.

And one of the people doing that, not surprisingly, found your meme funny.