Grading shenanigans at CGC? 9 9

[mattn792]

On 10/19/2024 at 11:20 PM, crazyhips said:

Plot twist. This was all a concerted effort to revive the CVA sticker, which may soon be acquired by blackrock. Look for a whole host of 9.8 EVA to come to market. 😆

Why would BlackRock want anything to do with that pitiful Currently Verifying Anything sticker?

[RockMyAmadeus]

On 10/20/2024 at 8:11 AM, MatterEaterLad said:

(I don't buy the "some people just know what to look for that's how this guy got so many 9.9s." Raw books in that shape aren't out there in that quantity or we would have seen them before).

 

[RockMyAmadeus]

On 10/20/2024 at 9:03 AM, mattn792 said:

On 10/19/2024 at 9:20 PM, crazyhips said:

Plot twist. This was all a concerted effort to revive the CVA sticker, which may soon be acquired by blackrock. Look for a whole host of 9.8 EVA to come to market. 😆

Why would BlackRock want anything to do with that pitiful Currently Verifying Anything sticker?

[Gaard]

Two questions to ponder ...

1) If that 12/21 submission was submitted by one of us, would we have gotten as many (or any) 9.9s?

2) If any of those 9.9s were cracked out and resubmitted, would they come back as 9.9s?

[mattn792]

On 10/20/2024 at 11:20 AM, RockMyAmadeus said:

You ruined my potential fun…. 

[jcjames]

On 10/20/2024 at 6:19 AM, Axelrod said:

Your book is going to get the same "perfect = 9.8" grading that it always did.  People like whoever submitted the order that started this thread (who is definitely some big auction house/similar) will get the lion's share of these grades.  

I am sure that CGC has, and will continue to, "Promise" that preferential gift-grading to big auction-related submitters does not occur within their unbiased, priced-by-FMV "third-party grading" system company. 

 

 

[RockMyAmadeus]

On 10/20/2024 at 9:27 AM, Gaard said:

Two questions to ponder ...

1) If that 12/21 submission was submitted by one of us, would we have gotten as many (or any) 9.9s?

2) If any of those 9.9s were cracked out and resubmitted, would they come back as 9.9s?

 

[lou_fine]

On 10/20/2024 at 8:11 AM, MatterEaterLad said:

How can the dominant grading company just "adjust" their grading standards. That means they have no grading standards.

That's because they want you to dig even deeper into your pocket so that you can purchase the new and much improved next edition of their official grading book to get a better understanding of their ever shifting grading standards.    

[ExNihilo]

On 10/20/2024 at 9:16 AM, RockMyAmadeus said:

 

That's all fine and dandy, but that doesn't explain how the number of 9.9s and 10s as a percentage of overall submissions has increased steadily from 2023 onwards.  Just eyeballing the chart, it appears that the average rate up through Feb-23 of 9.9s was about 0.3%.  By Dec-23 it's 1%.  And Aug-24 it's about 1.8%.  You can't convince me that's the result of a single submitter or even a group of them.  Especially since it's a combination of skill, time, expenses, and experience.

On 10/17/2024 at 4:39 PM, bc said:

Combined all three charts into one based on the 6 month moving average:

-bc

 

[lou_fine]

On 10/20/2024 at 9:16 AM, RockMyAmadeus said:

 

Am I missing something here, but it seems like most boardies here are clearly making the mistake and sincerely believe that CGC grades are scientifically determined to the nth degree of accuracy, whereas in reality they are probably much more directly related to CCG/CGC's current business agenda of the day.    

[lou_fine]

Couldn't fully figure out why this book sold for the rather grandiose price of $42K or some 33X condition guide value a couple of weeks ago on CC, but it all makes sense to me as it surely looks undergraded now and will no doubt hit 6-figures when it gets encased with one of those new "common as dirt" CGC 9.9 labels:  

https://www.comicconnect.com/item/1052459

[RockMyAmadeus]

On 10/20/2024 at 10:59 AM, ExNihilo said:

That's all fine and dandy, but that doesn't explain how the number of 9.9s and 10s as a percentage of overall submissions has increased steadily from 2023 onwards.  Just eyeballing the chart, it appears that the average rate up through Feb-23 of 9.9s was about 0.3%.  By Dec-23 it's 1%.  And Aug-24 it's about 1.8%.

[RockMyAmadeus]

On 10/20/2024 at 11:01 AM, lou_fine said:

Am I missing something here, but it seems like most boardies here are clearly making the mistake and sincerely believe that CGC grades are scientifically determined to the nth degree of accuracy, 

On 10/20/2024 at 11:01 AM, lou_fine said:

whereas in reality they are probably much more directly related to CCG/CGC's current business agenda of the day.    

[lou_fine]

On 10/20/2024 at 11:21 AM, RockMyAmadeus said:

On 10/20/2024 at 11:01 AM, lou_fine said:

Am I missing something here, but it seems like most boardies here are clearly making the mistake and sincerely believe that CGC grades are scientifically determined to the nth degree of accuracy, 

Well, from some of the posts that I read here, it seems like they tend to believe this or maybe it's just mental rationalization on their part.   

[RockMyAmadeus]

On 10/20/2024 at 11:27 AM, lou_fine said:

Well, from some of the posts that I read here, it seems like they tend to believe this or maybe it's just mental rationalization on their part.   

[Stefan_W]

On 10/20/2024 at 2:27 PM, lou_fine said:

Well, from some of the posts that I read here, it seems like they tend to believe this or maybe it's just mental rationalization on their part.   

Steve Borock makes an interesting point during interviews that I fully believe, which is that the mid-grades are far tougher to grade accurately and consistently than high grades. The theme of this argument is there are many, many way to get to a 5.5 (for example), but when you get to 9.8 and above you are playing with a greatly reduced pool of potential factors. 

Graders are not machines that are 100% consistent. But when you are talking about the highest grades you can reasonably expect a larger degree of consistency simply because there fewer issue present for graders to interpret and evaluate. Any inconsistencies would likely fall at borderlines between grades where one grader may see a small tick in a place that is easily noticeable and call it a 9.6 while another calls it a 9.8. In terms of 9.9s, based on the Publishing Defect video CGC put out, the distinction between 9.8 and above seems largely focused on how sharp the corners are with less forgiveness for manufacturing issues that caused imperfections. 

[crazyhips]

On 10/20/2024 at 12:20 PM, RockMyAmadeus said:

Ooooops. My bad. Thanks for the correction. I should stick with the day job. 😅. 

[Tnexus]

On 10/20/2024 at 5:38 AM, DanJD said:

Maybe I am wrong, but I thought if someone submits a book in modern tier and it grades a 9.9 or 10, CGC will upgrade the tier and charge the higher cost based on FMV.  Maybe the artificial holding back of the higher grades in modern or vintage tiers is based on the pushback they would get from people getting random huge bills from CGC when expecting to pay $25 a piece.  I get that many people would be like who cares and it’s worth the cost to get that grade, but I could see many people not being prepared to pay that higher unexpected expense.  The higher tier submission is already expecting to pay those higher fees and accept the risk of over paying if it doesn’t grade out.  Just a thought.  

I think you could influence a grade if you're submitting comics to a higher tier. If you're submitting a $100 comic in the $1000 tier, you could potentially bias the grader by making them think the comic is worth the higher tier's costs in the first place.

[wombat]

Do some people actually believe CGC waken up one day and said "we need to correct our sins of the past and give books the grades they deserve". 

Edited Monday at 02:23 PM by wombat

[lou_fine]

On 10/20/2024 at 1:51 PM, Tnexus said:

I think you could influence a grade if you're submitting comics to a higher tier. If you're submitting a $100 comic in the $1000 tier, you could potentially bias the grader by making them think the comic is worth the higher tier's costs in the first place.

That's the same thinking that I used to have and probably still do to a certain extent, but I have been told by many others that the graders do NOT know the specific tier that a book has been submitted in and hence in theory, simply grade the book that's in front of them irrespective of the tier that it was submitted in.