Where will the original comic art market be in 20 years? Predictions anyone?

[Bronty]

I agree that the Lee piece is melodramatic but IMHO Kane was a fairly mediocre artist, frankly. If it wasn't for his association with Batman no one would give two kraps about Bob Kane. IMHO this is a case of modern drek vs vintage drek

 

(dodges the tomatoes thrown at him)

[Bronty]

One point about 'beginner's mistakes.' If there are enough beginners doing the same thing, they aren't mistakes any more. Older collectors questioned the valuations of silver marvel at every step along the way as the prices just rose and rose and rose. Now it's at the point where a truly hg AF15 or FF1 will set you back the cost of an action 1. I'm sure there's more than a few old timers that view at as sacrilege, but its reality.

 

That being said, I have to agree that based on my very limited perspective from the outside looking in, modern art does appear to be overvalued in many cases. I think chasing modern art in some ways is like chasing modern books... most of the books/art will cool off after a few years. I would think that's currently being negated by the influx of new money, but sooner or later once the hobby reaches an equilibrium and some time passes the 'hot new art' from the 'hot new series' is going to be yesterday's news except for the top 1 or 2% of quality.

[jjeanius]

Again, supply and demand. How many new collectors have fond memories of Golden Age Wonder Woman? Sure, it's historically significant, and has stood the test of time, and no one is debating that...but at the same time, to say that the art is undervalued when it's had some 50 years in the marketplace to establish itself...well, it's just your opinion. Sure, the new art hasn't been around long enough to have a proven track record, or to "stand the test of time", but bottom line is that it seems there are many, many new collectors who are doing exactly what they SHOULD be doing...buying what they LIKE, and not just what someone else tells them is "classic, undervalued" material. I totally agree that in the long run much of the modern art might "fade away" in terms of value...similar to pricing trends on modern comic books, where you are "hot" one day and quarter bin material the next...but in the long run, it's always about quality. Who is to stay which of today's books will stand out 10 years from now? Certainly, some will prove to have winning track records and end up as great investments in the long run, others will fizzle out...but in the meantime, as long as you enjoy the artwork at the price you pay for it and don't look at it solely as an investment, then I don't see why it matters. Certainly, if a lot of people get burned over the next ten years on modern art that doesn't pan out, many will learn their lesson and pricing will tend to correct itself. What with such a huge influx of new collectors, though, I wouldn't expect too much of a correction. Unlike with comics, you can't just increase the print run to meet demand. There are only 22 pages + cover for monthly books, and that's the same whether there are 10 collectors after them, or 200.

[Bronty]

Oh I agree with most of that. I said as much. My point was that some of this stuff is going for what I perceive to be too much.

 

I know the 'buy what you like and if you paid too much for it who cares if you enjoy it' horse is trotted out a lot, but I never could agree with that line of thinking. If you paid too much or paid a price in excess of what you can pick up a comparable for later, you simply paid too much. You paid for your impatience as much as you paid for the art.

[jjeanius]

I know the 'buy what you like and if you paid too much for it who cares if you enjoy it' horse is trotted out a lot, but I never could agree with that line of thinking. If you paid too much or paid a price in excess of what you can pick up a comparable for later, you simply paid too much. You paid for your impatience as much as you paid for the art.

 

Yes, I agree. Problem is, with new material, everyone is still feeling out the market...and with the huge influx of new collectors, it's a totally new environment for OA collecting, and there really is no precedent to judge current pricing on the "hot" modern material. So everyone ends up feeling around in the dark a bit, guessing and hoping. Certainly, it could end up that years from now that we look back and classify the bulk of modern art as having been "overpriced"...but at the same time, the opposite is every bit as likely. The demand is obviously there right now for quality new material...it's just a question of whether or not it will prove to have staying power.

[Mister Trent]

As a matter of interest, Mr LuckCantor, tell us a little about yourself . . . who you are . . . what you collect . . . a link to an on-line Gallery, etc.

 

You've made a lot of posts in a short few days . . .and I'm kinda intrigued who you are?

[Bronty]

 

Yes, I agree. Problem is, with new material, everyone is still feeling out the market...and with the huge influx of new collectors, it's a totally new environment for OA collecting, and there really is no precedent to judge current pricing on the "hot" modern material. So everyone ends up feeling around in the dark a bit, guessing and hoping. Certainly, it could end up that years from now that we look back and classify the bulk of modern art as having been "overpriced"...but at the same time, the opposite is every bit as likely. The demand is obviously there right now for quality new material...it's just a question of whether or not it will prove to have staying power.

 

Sure. Ultimately the future is always a guessing game. Doesn't mean you can't look at the fundamentals and make a reasonable prediction though. For example when 9.8 cgc spawn #1s and wolverine #1 were commanding hundreds (I seem to recall a 9.8 wolvie 1 around $750) it didn't take a genius to see those prices were headed straight for the toilet. (A quick ebay search showed a sale at $175).

 

This situation isn't as clear but I would have to think the smart money would be on most modern art cooling off over time

[Sharkey]

 

It just seems to me alot of newbies are getting into this hobby and making what I perceive to be 'beginners mistakes' (yes, I know that might seem harsh as the adage is 'buy what they like'). I guess at bottom, I just feel there is alot of new money coming into this hobby that is not looking at the past but fixated only in the present. I think alot of people will be sad when their new art doesnt maintain its value in the coming decades and I think that there is a value associated with history and 'track records' that many new collectors are incorrectly dismissing. JMHO.

 

 

I think it all depends on their motivation for buying the art. If they like it, want it, and are willing to pay the seller's price for it, then that's not a mistake. The mistake might be assuming that they are buying art for its potential long-term investment value, as opposed to, say, buying it because they really happen to like Jim Lee or Jim Balent or Roger Rapidograph or whomever happens to be today's hot artist.

 

I know when I was first buying original art pages I bought pages from artists I liked without giving two seconds thought about the "investment value" of the art. I paid what I thought was a fair price for the pages. I have only purchsed one piece in my life that I bought with specific intent to resell or use as trade bait, and even then it was a page that I would have been happy to hang onto for years.

 

There's no reason to criticize "newbies" for making purchasing decisions that you don't think are prudent. In 30 years Jim Lee may be the equivalent of Frank Frazetta to the next generation of art fans. Ok, that's a crazy analogy, but you get my point. New fans don't give a rats hairy patoot about Bob Kane's Batman art from oh so many decades ago. I'm not a big fan of many Golden Age artists. But I know a lot of fans who don't like Kirby or Ditko, and I don't begrudge them that.

 

This may be hard to believe, but not everyone makes buying decisions about art based on its long-term investment potential. No, really, it's the truth.

[mister_not_so_nice]

This may be hard to believe, but not everyone makes buying decisions about art based on its long-term investment potential. No, really, it's the truth.

 

Say it ain't so, RHINO, say it ain't so! ! ! ! !

 

My kids have gone without braces and corrective shoes so I could buy more art for thier future. They may have buck teeth and limps, but, darn-it, it was worth it

[Buck Biggins]

About 7-12 months ago I started to get interested in OA. I didn't buy my first piece until 2 months ago. All the time before I the time spent before I bought my first piece I spent looking and watching OA. I wanted to educate myself not only on pricing a bit but really wanted to get a feel for what I would like. I was not about to rush into OA and dump all the cash I could afford and 2 years latter have a bunch of stuff I really didn't like. I wanted choice pieces of OA that I would appreciate not only tomorrow but 5 years from know.

 

It seems to me that there is a trend of people moving to OA in the past year and I have a gut feeling that this is only going to esculate. For me the decision to get into OA was simple, why spend $600+ on a cgc9.6 bronze when for double that I may be able to get a nice splash or cover of that issue. As more and more people relize this I see the OA community growing until one of 2 things happens.

1) OA prices climb with the growing demand and creat a new entry point

2) High grade comic prices drop and less people leave that part of the market.

 

I'm new this OA stuff so what the heck do I know.

[LuckyCantor-migration]

About 7-12 months ago I started to get interested in OA. I didn't buy my first piece until 2 months ago. All the time before I the time spent before I bought my first piece I spent looking and watching OA. I wanted to educate myself not only on pricing a bit but really wanted to get a feel for what I would like. I was not about to rush into OA and dump all the cash I could afford and 2 years latter have a bunch of stuff I really didn't like. I wanted choice pieces of OA that I would appreciate not only tomorrow but 5 years from know.

 

It seems to me that there is a trend of people moving to OA in the past year and I have a gut feeling that this is only going to esculate. For me the decision to get into OA was simple, why spend $600+ on a cgc9.6 bronze when for double that I may be able to get a nice splash or cover of that issue. As more and more people relize this I see the OA community growing until one of 2 things happens.

1) OA prices climb with the growing demand and creat a new entry point

2) High grade comic prices drop and less people leave that part of the market.

 

I'm new this OA stuff so what the heck do I know.

 

So what'd you buy?

 

Welcome to the hobby!!!!

[Buck Biggins]

So far I bought 2 Goon pages and I will have the 3rd piece by the end of next month. I'll post it after I get it. Selling some books to pay it off. Here are the Goon pages.....

 

 

My first piece thanks to Mike!

 

This piece I just finished paying off after selling some books.

[LuckyCantor-migration]

So far I bought 2 Goon pages and I will have the 3rd piece by the end of next month. I'll post it after I get it. Selling some books to pay it off. Here are the Goon pages.....

 

 

My first piece thanks to Mike!

 

This piece I just finished paying off after selling some books.

 

Sweet mercy! I know of some posters who are a-gonna be jealous!!!!

[Buck Biggins]

Not comic related but I just had this piece completed. Its my kids playing in the front yard the day before Halloween last October. Wife and I are in the front window with our 2 dogs and 1 of our cats in the forground. In watercolor.

 

Can you find all 8 hidden spooks?

 

[COI]

There's no reason to criticize "newbies" for making purchasing decisions that you don't think are prudent. In 30 years Jim Lee may be the equivalent of Frank Frazetta to the next generation of art fans. Ok, that's a crazy analogy, but you get my point. New fans don't give a rats hairy patoot about Bob Kane's Batman art from oh so many decades ago. I'm not a big fan of many Golden Age artists. But I know a lot of fans who don't like Kirby or Ditko, and I don't begrudge them that.

 

This may be hard to believe, but not everyone makes buying decisions about art based on its long-term investment potential. No, really, it's the truth.

 

 

Let me add that though I do like modern art, I also like vintage stuff as well. As I've said, anything that appeals to me aesthetically I'll collect, whether its from 2006 or 1946. It just turns out that I'm finding more modern art appealing because it's more available and it's closer to the style I grew up with. And as hard as it might be to accept for some old-timers, there were talented people then, and there are talented people NOW.

 

With all that said, I would trade all the modern pieces I own and will ever own for a Frazetta painting.

[Sharkey]

 

With all that said, I would trade all the modern pieces I own and will ever own for a Frazetta painting.

 

ooooh yeahhhhh. Frazettaaaaaa.

[COI]

How many new collectors have fond memories of Golden Age Wonder Woman? Sure, it's historically significant, and has stood the test of time, and no one is debating that...but at the same time, to say that the art is undervalued when it's had some 50 years in the marketplace to establish itself...well, it's just your opinion. Sure, the new art hasn't been around long enough to have a proven track record, or to "stand the test of time", but bottom line is that it seems there are many, many new collectors who are doing exactly what they SHOULD be doing...buying what they LIKE, and not just what someone else tells them is "classic, undervalued" material.

 

Exactly. Putting the "investment"(ugh) angle aside, it has always baffled me that collectors can have such passion towards certain characters, artists, or era's, yet show no understanding or respect to other collectors who have the same amount of passion for DIFFERENT characters, artists or era's. It's pathetic, really. People say that non-collectors don't understand this hobby, or give us a hard time about it, but the only insults or mockery I have EVER received for buying/collecting anything have been from fellow collectors, the people that should be the MOST understanding as to why I collect, regardless of personal tastes. It's sad that some people are so insecure that they have to beat everyone over the head about what they collect, and why it's "superior".

[COI]

That being said, I have to agree that based on my very limited perspective from the outside looking in, modern art does appear to be overvalued in many cases. I think chasing modern art in some ways is like chasing modern books... most of the books/art will cool off after a few years. I would think that's currently being negated by the influx of new money, but sooner or later once the hobby reaches an equilibrium and some time passes the 'hot new art' from the 'hot new series' is going to be yesterday's news except for the top 1 or 2% of quality.

 

This is true of any era....quality lasts, filler dosen't. However, comparing comics to art, especially when trying to predict future prices makes for a specious argument at best. From where I'm sitting, there is no correlation at all..

[pkveronese]

About 7-12 months ago I started to get interested in OA. I didn't buy my first piece until 2 months ago. All the time before I the time spent before I bought my first piece I spent looking and watching OA. I wanted to educate myself not only on pricing a bit but really wanted to get a feel for what I would like. I was not about to rush into OA and dump all the cash I could afford and 2 years latter have a bunch of stuff I really didn't like. I wanted choice pieces of OA that I would appreciate not only tomorrow but 5 years from know.

 

It seems to me that there is a trend of people moving to OA in the past year and I have a gut feeling that this is only going to esculate. For me the decision to get into OA was simple, why spend $600+ on a cgc9.6 bronze when for double that I may be able to get a nice splash or cover of that issue. As more and more people relize this I see the OA community growing until one of 2 things happens.

1) OA prices climb with the growing demand and creat a new entry point

2) High grade comic prices drop and less people leave that part of the market.

 

I'm new this OA stuff so what the heck do I know.

 

So what'd you buy?

 

Welcome to the hobby!!!!

 

What do you collect Lucky? Any Scans?

[Mister Trent]

About 7-12 months ago I started to get interested in OA. I didn't buy my first piece until 2 months ago. All the time before I the time spent before I bought my first piece I spent looking and watching OA. I wanted to educate myself not only on pricing a bit but really wanted to get a feel for what I would like. I was not about to rush into OA and dump all the cash I could afford and 2 years latter have a bunch of stuff I really didn't like. I wanted choice pieces of OA that I would appreciate not only tomorrow but 5 years from know.

 

It seems to me that there is a trend of people moving to OA in the past year and I have a gut feeling that this is only going to esculate. For me the decision to get into OA was simple, why spend $600+ on a cgc9.6 bronze when for double that I may be able to get a nice splash or cover of that issue. As more and more people relize this I see the OA community growing until one of 2 things happens.

1) OA prices climb with the growing demand and creat a new entry point

2) High grade comic prices drop and less people leave that part of the market.

 

I'm new this OA stuff so what the heck do I know.

 

So what'd you buy?

 

Welcome to the hobby!!!!

 

What do you collect Lucky? Any Scans?

 

I already asked this. 'Lucky' posted a reply, in which he talked about being a sanctuary-seeker in a Naples Monastery (or something to that effect), then he quickly deleted his message. To be honest, his response sounded a bit on the krazy side . . .