lou_fine

The GA market had cooled off by the early/mid 2000's according to my recollection, where the SA/BA market had heated up again (there was a slight crossover). The roles seemed to reverse again somewhere about 2010 or so IIRC . In 2010, 2011 you could still find GA keys and classic covers sitting around unsold. Am I correct in my recollection? No, I believe the bull market which you are referring to is the rather extended current one which we are in right now. Had not really followed the market too closely back then, but if I remember correctly, didn't the BA/CA and CGC's highest gradest copies of what would otherwise be common books hit a peak around the 2007-2008 time period. After a short pause for the financial crisis, I believe the market heated up again, with the hottest flames being focused on the SA market. At this current stage, it looks like the hottest part of the flames (in general as there are always some exceptions) have moved onto the GA market since 2015. At least that's my take on the current bull market, although I really haven't been following it that closely until the past year or so. The bull market which I was referring to was probably prior to your times as a dealer and it was in the early to mid 90's and well before CGC was even a thought in anybody's head. This one was of a much shorter time frame and probably started with the Marvel SA keys finally waking up from their decade long slumber in the very late 80's. From there the new book market really heated up for a few short years with Wizard and Image creating a wild frenzy of rampant speculation which almost killed the entire new comic book market. Through all of this fervor, the SA market (not sure about BA or CA then?) continued to move up significantly, with the GA market seemingly taking a back seat and just watching what was unfolding. After about 5 years of SA heat and following the crash of the new comic book market, the GA boys decided to join the party around '94 or thereabouts. Better late than never, I guess, as they seemingly took over the dance floor and pushed everybody to the sidelines. Unfortunately, the old geezers just didn't have the legs and they could only keep it going for about 18 months to 2 years before it was the end of the night and the lights were turned off at the party for everybody. But during that short 18 months to 2 years time period, the fire and heat was blazing red hot and burning with great ferocity. This was time when big dealers were offering multiples of guide for pedigree GA books, basically sight unseen and more on pedigree reputation only. I remember a dealer offering $10K at the time for a pedigree copy of All-Select 1 when the top of guide at the time was only around $2,200 or thereabouts, as he stated it would be an easy sale for him at $15K. Further gas was poured onto this fire with the release of the Overstreet books by Diamond which fanned the flames as they were just starting to catch fire. I remember Overstreet raising the price of Fox's Mystery Men 1 from $2,100 in guide all the way up to $8,500 in just one year, which is really saying something as we all know how slow old Bob moves when it comes to raising prices. That sudden jump effectively killed the MM 1 book for years to come as it was no longer seen to be an undervalued book which I guess, is what collectors like to chase after in the marketplace. I believe the party was already starting to wind down around the time that Bill's More Fun Collection arrived on the scene. Definitely a short, but fun and exciting time there for awhile. The bull market party which we are in this time definitely seems to be longer lasting and would appear to have more legs to it, but not sure how much longer it can last. The other difference in terms of the GA at least, is that most of the fervor were with the high grades, whereas this time, the breadth of the fire seems to be more widespread as it has also engulfed the entry level copies and the lower grade copies, especially with respect to the GA keys and HTF classic covers. Interesting to note that the mid 90's was also the time that the much coveted early Fox books were finally made available in the marketplace, and it looks like they are going to be available once again in the next 2 CC auctions, after a more than 2 decade absence except for the small handful of scattered Fox books here and there in every auction. Signs and portents of things to come, who really knows.

Interesting to note that although the circulation for the Fox books appears to be running at about 25% of the DC's on a per issue basis, their availability in the current vintage collectible marketplace appears to be substantially less than that. I guess it's possible that the above circulation might not be reflective of the actual copies sold, as DC would most likely have a much higher sell through rate due to the higher popularity of their comic book characters at the time.

I would not base myself on that wait and see what the next 9.2 sells for (plus this 9.4 has not even sold yet) and even then the PQ makes a big difference....white pages brings a premium. Now, now, are you trying to cause big time trouble here also. You should know that totally unsupported and illogical comments like these is an open door invitation for Jaydog to also take over this thread here.

Not sure why you think these prices feel like nosebleed in terms of the Iron Man issue? After all, only $800 pewny little dollars for an Iron Man 33 in 9.8 condition is peanuts compared to what this Iron Man 30 in the same 9.8 condition went for: http://www.comicconnect.com/bookDetail.php?referral=EAlist&id=689571&title=IRONMAN Now, that's what I call not only a nosebleed price, but more like a brain bursting price.

Not everyone for sure. But as presented on these boards and in the market...the majority of folks Well, I guess there's always at least one exception to every rule.

Yes, indeed! I believe their lots have generally always closed 30 seconds apart, and then it's available for extended bidding after that.

Not sure about any actual data, but if you have been looking at the auction offerings over the past years, it is quite apparent that the DC super hero books are readily available in most condition grades across the board. Especially in comparison to the dearth of early Fox books in these same auctions, as there is usually no more than a handful of them scattered here and there between the various titles in any one auction. And especially if you are talking about trying to find them in grade, and these usually show up in the form of a high dollar pedigree copy only. I guess this upcoming CC auction and then the Berk Auction after that will really be the 2 largest amounts of Fox books to hit the open market in over 2 decades now. Can't wait to see the action as some of these books have not shown up anywhere in say almost forever.

Still a nice price for having issues that book had Based upon what I am seeing in the auction marketplace over the past couple of years, it looks like both CL and especially CC are taking a big step forward, while Heritage seems to be stepping back from the comic books themselves and focusing much more of their attention to the comic OA related market.

Of course you should also consider the possibility of interior defects which may not show up on the front & back cover scans, and as a result, the book may possibly not grade any higher upon a resubmission. That is why the Grader's Notes would be critical in these types of situations. It is clear, however, that the marketplace is definitely rewarding books that have visual eye appeal, especially when they present noticeably better than their assigned grades.

Beautiful book ickwinzs! No need to reholder, you can remove the scratches with Meguiar's PlastX. It's a clear plastic cleaner and polisher. Works amazing, and I have used it on scratches such as this on my CGC cases with fantastic results! Yes, now that sounds like a much better and practical idea that what I had suggested earlier. Avoids the unnecessary shipping and reholdereing cost along with the additional chance for potential damage to the book during the shipping and reslabbing process.

Examples of what? Are you saying that CGC is intentionally giving lower grades to books that don't use the CCS pressing service? No, not saying that at all as in theory the graders should not be able to tell if a book has been pressed or not if it has been done properly. I am saying if submittors are not keeping on top of changes that are taking place at CGC, they are most likely not maxing out their potential with respect to their books. Especially with the new grading team in place where it seems that barely perceptible creases and stress lines are most likely playing much more of factor in the determination of the final grade, as compared to before where the older traditional defects had more of an impact. This is completely understandable since Matt's experience and background is all about pressing, so it's only natural that this defect would move right up the chart on his list of no-no's. And probably the reason why we are seeing a much larger percentage of books that present much nicer from a visual eye appeal point of view relative to their assigned grades, especially when compared to the past.

You should be and as you say, shows extremely well for only a CGC 2.0 graded copy of this rare and hard to find early Fox book. All of these relatively lower graded GA books slabbed during the summer and fall of 2016 seems to present much better than their assigned grade on a pretty consistent basis from what I am seeing.

I agree regarding PQ. The $57K 5.0 had c/ow pages... I guess CR/OW must be the new and much coveted White Pages. Especially since the 'Tec 29, 'Tec 38, and the 5.0 copy of AF 15 all had the now coveted CR/OW PQ designation and we all know what happened to the prices on these 3 books.

Man, that's a ton of wear on your case and right at the critical spot down the whole spine. You should probably consider getting it reholdered as it's hard to tell between what's on the case, as opposed to what is on the actual spine itself.

eBay and the 3 major auction houses are completely different marketplaces and as such, generally cater to a completely different clientele.

Did we not see this exact same market cycle back in the mid-90's when the GA market picked up the flaming red hot torch from the SA market, with the 2nd / 3rd tier publishers and the classic covers being the last to feel the burning heat before the flames went out and all markets went into an extended cooling period? I believe the 2nd & 3rd tier publishers and the classic covers are pretty much the hottest part of the market and where we are about right now.

+1 Truer words have never been spoken! An absolutely classic Batman cover in its own right and one that has undeservedly taken a back seat relative to the recent craze over the 'Tec 31 cover, which most collectors did not really think too much about only a couple short decades ago. So, a perfect alignment of the stars for the consignors of 3 of the AF 15's and the consignor for the 'Tec 38 in this just completed CC auction.

Are you sure that the DPS 5 was sold on the CC auction site since I cannot find the listing for it on their Event Auction, or was it listed in one of their other smaller auctions?

Let me tell you a little secret: When you sell it for much more money later down the line, she'll be equally, if not even more irate that you did not buy more books. Congrats on your Wonderful pickup there.

Poor sucker who doesn't know about it all for the mighty buck I imagine with the new grading team in place at CGC and headed up by Matt Nelson, I imagine there would many potential 9-ish books sitting in 8-ish or possibly even 7-ish slabs if the customers did not provide CGC with the "courtesy" of using some of their additional paid services prior to grading. Especially when compared to the previous grading teams that were in place prior to this current incarnation. Any bets that if we look hard enough at some of the books in this current auction, there'll be several examples of this. Especially when it comes to what would otherwise be HG books except for tiny and barely perceptible non-color breaking creases or ticks which are probably not even visible from detailed scans.

Agree on 30, think the 35 is deserving grade. BTW, 35 was graded in DEC 2016 +1 Just that they both don't appear to be "undergraded" from an exterior cover visual appearance point of view at least , which was clearly the case with both the 'Tec 29 and 'Tec 38.

I'm in Honduras and I couldn't remember or check. Good to know. You sure seem to be spending a lot of time on these boards here while in Honduras. Are you already getting bored with your little vacation and can't find any local comic shops down there to rummaged through?

Looks like the only 2 half decent unrestored pre-Robin's that CC has on this go round are the 'Tec 30 and the 'Tec 35. Wonder if this is going to result in higher prices since it might be a case of dollars chasing after fewer books, which may have been one of the factors behind the high prices last week as they had only 3 copies in the last CC auction. Especially if you compare it to their auction in December where there were 14 copies to go around and the prices were definitely more muted in comparison to the results last week. Of course, Christmas season is traditionally not necessarily the best time to be looking for record prices. Of course, both of the 'Tec 29 and 'Tec 38 present much better than their assign 3.0 grades from a visual point of view. Not so much in the case of the 'Tec 30 and 'Tec 35 in this upcoming auction. I guess the marketplace is rewarding books for superior visual appearance now, much more so than before.

Gator; Since you are the brainchild behind the price per point (ppp) concept, just wondering you can give us your current thoughts on the PPP for the following 3 books: 1) AF 15: What was the going PPP prior to the recent CC auction, and has this auction last week raised the PPP by anything, or do we need to wait for more data points as this book actually sells quite frequently; 2) Detective 29: I thought the PPP on this book was running at something like $12K per point, but with the CC auction at $66K for a 3.0 graded copy, is this a sign that it is heading northwards and doing a little bit of catch up to 'Tec 31; and 3) Detective 38: Since the last sale in December was at a PPP of $8,750 for a 4.0 graded copy, I was expecting a PPP of something like $10K for this copy. Since it sold for $54K or at a PPP of $18K per point, and then followed mere minutes later by somebody snapping up Bob Storms 3.0 graded copy for the full $36K asking price, does this mean that the new normal for this book is going to be $12K+ on a PPP basis going forward? Thanks in advance for your insight.

I believe Jeff (nearmint) was also able to get one of his GA books to go from 6.5 all the way up to a 9.0 simply by pressing out the light subscription crease, if my memory serves me correctly.