NewWorldOrder

On 1/22/2024 at 3:11 PM, THE_BEYONDER said:

What’s the differential?

15-20%

On 1/22/2024 at 11:19 AM, toro said:

The competitors put out an email today that basically said our cases are better than the other guys. 

... but their final prices at auction sure aren't better.

I do not want to hear anymore from their "supposed competitors."   There is barely only one and they have missed more opportunities to capture market share then the Buffalo Bills at winning Superbowl's.  So if CGC truly ever has a real competitor they haven't opened up business yet.  You can write those other losers off.  Right now CGC stands alone.  Like it or not.

On 1/17/2024 at 5:58 AM, GDN said:

ASM 300 in 9.6 sold for the lowest it has since ~July 2020.  $750.

Heritage is not a great place to sell common post 1980 books. 

Same book on eBay would sell higher at .99c auction 7-day auction, which 2 did just a couple days prior.

BTW the fact a CGC 9.6 is still commanding  as of Jan 2024 those prices just shows us how popular Venom and McFarlane are.

The book is so common even at CGC 9.6 a ASM #300 going for $500 is still high.

On 12/15/2023 at 5:18 AM, flchris said:

Just me or has there been an uptick in cancellations for whatever reasons lately? 

Interesting you say that.  In my 20 years on selling on eBay what I noticed is at the beginning of each new year in January there is an uptick.

My best guess is credit cards bills come due for all the useless junk most people buy during the Holiday season, and then they go "uh ohhhh" I cant afford this comic."  My best guess as to why this happens mainly in Jan/Feb.

Also then you see higher sales in March April May as income tax refunds come in, and people as per usual stupid with their money splurge. 

On 12/15/2023 at 3:37 AM, Key Largo Comics said:

Blocked for non-payment: hrach8485

Sent me this thoughtful message after I accepted his offer giving him a large discount...

"Hey I’m gonna need to cancel this order i have just over spent and need to stop spending money for awhile.. I’m sorry 😞 if I happen to do any bidding in the future with you I will pay promptly .."

Never ever cancel for a buyer in these kind of examples, just say nothing.  Relist and cancel for non-payment after 4-days.

eBay for me is an assembly line of buyers (mostly good).  I have no emotion to the bad ones just block and move on.

I quite enjoy my block bidder list, its like a badge of dis-honor

On 1/9/2024 at 5:36 PM, shadroch said:

So, CGC owns half a million dollars' worth of books.  Books they graded themselves.  Now what?  Does the unbiased third-party grading company go into selling comics?  The 9.8 they paid the market price for but is closer to a 9.2 will sell better in a 9.4 slab.  They'd be much better off returning the 9.2 and giving the owner a nice check.

Not my problem anymore.  As long as I get my market value $ for the book I move on, and call it a day.

What they do with the book is up to them, they bought it from me its now their's.

But yes that would be a nice thing for CGC to do for their customers I agree.

On 1/9/2024 at 3:50 PM, wiparker824 said:

Not everyone has the same financial means or the inventory on hand. When you have said financial means or inventory on hand sometimes you may hear a “get rich quick” scheme pitched to you which is usually a scam. Not saying this did or didn’t happen, but there are many reasons why a scammer involves other parties, this is one example.

True, but like we both agree.  We just many never know the full details.

On 1/9/2024 at 3:41 PM, BrashL said:

Man you love those straw men don't you. So easy to knock down.

It's also hard to have a rationale conversation with someone who thinks every CGC slab since 2000 is now null and void. 

On 1/9/2024 at 3:43 PM, mrd160 said:

Knowing the people involved. I do not agree. I won’t post it here but there is evidence out there that I have shared with CGC

I am saying how I would do it.  The scammer was even more moronic to show others how he did it if that is the case (pun intended lol).

On 1/9/2024 at 3:37 PM, wiparker824 said:

There are things about your case that are unique and largely important even if the book you bought happens to be legit. A lot of the sales of these books were funneled thru an eBay account or two or three, which are also important but don’t have the same interactions as a private sale. I really do hope the effort was not wasted and that it’s being investigated. 

Also to keep in mind while I agree I am sure he had some "rat holes" doesnt mean the scammer showed his skills to others.

Personally if I were the scammer I would keep the process to myself, but just need others to sell the items through.

Does that make sense?

On 1/9/2024 at 3:28 PM, mrd160 said:

Here’s another take that may not be that popular here,CGC is technically the victim. What’s happening here is not their fault they have to take responsibility, I get it, but the companies been taking advantage of by a bad actor. That’s not me being a CGC apologist it happens to be a fact

Well the other factor I am not seeing people really talk about here is these tampered books still have value.

Just take the 350 books total market value lets say is $1 million (just making this number up it up for example).

Some will get a clean bill of health and the value is still there (CGC owns nothing besides reholder/shipping/worker wages of that book)

Others will get a new grade and CGC has to decide how to pay the difference/credit.  Example ASM #300 CGC 9.8, but is really a CGC 9.2.  They have to buy the book, but still have a legit CGC 9.2 in a new tamper-free holder.

So it could be CGC would only owe half of that amount in buybacks.

Crude example but I think you get my point.

On 1/9/2024 at 3:26 PM, mrd160 said:

I will share this here I met the alleged scammer in person and it really set off red flags for me, something about him, and I bought from them anyway which I’m still kicking myself on. We need to trust our judgment when it comes to people and  I did a fairly big deal with him privately and I’m lucky that it turns out my book is probably legit. But that’s just luck because he offered me a bunch more books at the same time some of which are on the hot 350 list. I will say this in CGC‘s defense matter what they do scammers are always going to try to scam. I just want this whole thing routed out because based on information I have (which I have already shared with CGC), It is very unlikely he acted alone. For the record that is not speculation that is based on my actual real life interaction. And believe me I have the receipts

Well I really hope the information you provided CGC really helped.  Thanks for calling in and helping.

On 1/9/2024 at 3:22 PM, skybolt said:

Not to mention that CGC actually did spot some of the trimming and gave him qualified grades. I just wish they had put 2 and 2 together quicker.

Didn't you just prove my point with some?

Zero chance you can stop micro-trimming consistently with out the help of maybe AI.

I have no proof it is still happening and I hope to God it is not, but there stopping a professional seems impossible unlike this current scandal at the CGC level.

On 1/9/2024 at 3:21 PM, comicjel said:

At this point, even if nothing else is changed, CGC will need to review the photo they kept of the original book before they put in new holder without regrading - I can't imagine they have not already implemented that procedure.

totally agree

On 1/9/2024 at 3:20 PM, mrd160 said:

Since I don’t really do slabs….it would have gotten by me. 

IDK I am sure your life-long skills in the hobby would have sniffed it out.

On 1/9/2024 at 3:18 PM, bc said:

Not really sure that matters if he damages the corner and claims an ME or shipping damage after the swap.

-bc

Right, but I think he was referring to more getting it by buyers via sales.

On 1/9/2024 at 3:16 PM, mrd160 said:

For first try I thought it was pretty good imo  

It was

I give him that.

Yes I mean it wouldn't surprise me if they gotten it past some collectors for sure, but again who knows the real number.

On 1/9/2024 at 3:14 PM, mrd160 said:

Immaculate comics did a video showing exactly how easy it was to swap the books.

You mean the video that showed with the heat gun and how easy it was for even a novice to spot it was tampered with?

That one?

On 1/9/2024 at 3:11 PM, greggy said:

Are you going to be there for cocktail hour?

I wasn't sure if it was going to be worth it but I just do it to kill time if no one else is there yet. 

Umm yeah I will be there starting Friday.

Anymore questions just PM me because I dont want to the "sky is falling" boardies here to think we are bringing some fun & sunshine to their stormy mind to derail this thread.

On 1/9/2024 at 3:02 PM, greggy said:

Yes but Joey won't be there until Saturday night. 

He is going to miss cocktail hour?  boooooooo

On 1/9/2024 at 2:25 PM, BrashL said:

I know you keep going back to this out of wishful thinking but it's a useless analogy. That was 20 years ago. CGC wasn't what it is today, the comic market wasn't what it is today, social media wasn't what it is today. I could go on. You keep using this silly straw man like it's some brilliant thought.

You keep coming back to doom and gloom and how your collecting life is over, which most think is silly.

On 1/9/2024 at 2:58 PM, shadroch said:

If the scammers managed to get a slab past CGC, what is to stop them from selling directly to the market?  Swapping a 6.0 PLOD of a key book for a blue label can be worth thousands.  The scam has been exposed. Not the scammers, and there is no reason to think they have stopped.

There are always scams in anything in life that money is involved 24/7.

On 1/9/2024 at 2:55 PM, greggy said:

Hi John. 

@greggy

Hello Greggy!

You coming to soCal con with Joey in a couple weeks?

On 1/9/2024 at 2:39 PM, EastEnd1 said:

There are two HUGE differences between Ewert and this one.  The first is the one you mention, the requirement for Ewert to go through the gatekeeper.  The second is the exponential growth of social media in the intervening years.  From my recollection, the Ewert controversy was largely centered around the CGC board and if you weren't on this board, or well connected with the dealer circuit, there was a good chance you wouldn't have heard about it.  With social media today, word spreads like wildfire... even the casual collector can easily stumble across this one.  

Correct if social media was around back then like it is now.  OMG this thread would be up to 1000+ pages.

Every week for 4-7 years that thread was going and going.  Plus there were numerous other threads started weekly besides the main one.  It was nuts.

On 1/9/2024 at 2:41 PM, shadroch said:

I'm not sure why you think the Ewert scandal was bigger than this, but it doesn't really matter. 

I had my eye on five Ditko spideys at auctions this week. Four went for less than my target price.  As I didn't bid, the seller lost at least $5 on every book.  If I'd bid my maximums, the seller could have made perhaps $200 more.  This hobby isn't so big that a couple of hundred big collectors greatly reducing their BA/CA slab purchases won't have ripple effects.  The hobby/market revolves, and perhaps the era of blind faith in third-party companies is passing.

As some old guy once said.  It's not the end, it's not even the beginning of the end, but perhaps it is the end of the beginning.  I'm surprised it took this long for someone to counterfeit slabs, and now we find out they didn't have to.  I only own about two dozen CGC books, but they are all high value.  My long-term confidence in them as an investment has been shaken.  Just as importantly- I now need to be concerned with what I'd be selling. The book may be in a slab, but it's my reputation.

Because you can stop this but you cant stop a Jason Ewert type with the same level of protocols and safeguards.

Maybe with AI?

Many buyers/sellers left after COVID and when interest rates went up.