The Official The Walking Dead Discussion Thread 13 13

[JS]

I'll address this since you added this to your post after my last reply.

 

Also - I doubt my actions had anything to do with the uptick in pricing at splashpage -- its much more likely that there has been a huge influx of new readers / interest in the comic art market as a whole -- the whole market is experiencing a rebirth -- haven't you noticed OA being moved a lot more lately?

 

1. Flipping (which you actively participate in) absolutely has led to Splash Page raising their prices. Why should they leave money on the table?

 

 

Flipping sort of suggests that its bought and sold fairly quickly for immediate profit. I can say, honestly, I have sold one page I bought from splashpage - and that page I sold to a friend, for cost. It was a page from issue 23...a long time ago...

 

Other than that one page - get ready to write this down - I have NEVER sold another page from splashpage.

 

Said another way - I have every single page from splashpage I ever bought.

 

 

2. If prices are being raised by Splash Page because of increased interest and the pages are selling...then what are you complaining about? That's the free market at work, right?

 

 

You seem to think its all black and white - sell or not sell, high or low -- the fact is - pages from the same artist/book can vary in price - first appearances, well drawn, splash, all sorts of other factors --

 

My issue is, Mark's pricing - to me, seems to be arbitrarily set - which is fine - but to me, charging $900 for that page - is in way excess of current market..

 

I pointed out the page I bought last week on the open market for $400 as a comparison to what people can get! That is a true enough determination of what the real market is..

 

If people pay what Mark asks - it doesn't mean that is now current market - it means people might not care what it is really worth, or might not know.

 

I've said a bunch of times -- Mark selling for high prices helps all of us who own pages..especially nice pages

 

3. WD OA has very little impact on the OA market as a whole. The OA market, on the whole, would be doing what it's been doing with or without WD.

 

Agreed...in fact - some people who aren't up to WD pricing are completely floored when I show them prices on recent sales..

 

 

[JS]

 

Bingo.

 

I don't like the prices, either. And I'm not paying them. But other people clearly are. Good for Charlie. When the art is moving, what else is there to say? I find the constant kvetching tiresome. Beyond that, it's also annoying to be hearing it from another dealer whose main concern is not being able to buy it on the cheap anymore.

 

I hope you don't mean me....I really hope you don't actually think I am a dealer...right?..

 

edit - if you did mean me -- about being able to buy it on the cheap -- you are WRONG. thats how this entire discussion started, by me POINTING OUT a page I got for $400 (which I think is actually a pretty fair price)...last week!

Edited December 22, 2012 by Jerry S

[Stumptown]

Pre-sale #106 Infinity and Beyond variants (signed and unsigned) now up on Ebay directly from the shop in the UK.

 

They say it's limited to 2000 copies.

 

http://www.ebay.com/itm/IMAGE-THE-WALKING-DEAD-106-EXCLUSIVE-ADLARD-100-INFINITY-BEYOND-COVER-/350676232731?pt=UK_Books_Comics_Magazines_US_Comics_ET&hash=item51a5eeaa1b

 

 

http://www.ebay.com/itm/IMAGE-THE-WALKING-DEAD-106-EXCLUSIVE-ADLARD-100-INFINITY-BEYOND-COVER-SIGNED-/190774409215?pt=UK_Books_Comics_Magazines_US_Comics_ET&hash=item2c6b0a77ff

 

Oh, and they also still have copies of the #85 I&B variant cover too.

Edited December 22, 2012 by Stumptown

[Nexus]

Flipping sort of suggests that its bought and sold fairly quickly for immediate profit. I can say, honestly, I have sold one page I bought from splashpage - and that page I sold to a friend, for cost. It was a page from issue 23...a long time ago...

 

Other than that one page - get ready to write this down - I have NEVER sold another page from splashpage.

 

Said another way - I have every single page from splashpage I ever bought.

 

But it's all available "For Sale/Trade" right? You're just waiting for the buyer with the "special affinity".

 

When you list your art for sale on eBay at 4-5X FMV, don't you think Splash Page notices? It's fine that you'll accept a fair offer, but right or wrong, asking prices have an effect on how others value their property.

 

My issue is, Mark's pricing - to me, seems to be arbitrarily set - which is fine - but to me, charging $900 for that page - is in way excess of current market..

 

My issue is anyone asking $3K for a nondescript page, whether they're open to fair offers or not, has very little ground to stand on when it comes to questioning prices.

 

 

[JS]

We are looping back and forth now -- first - I put every single page on CAF up like that to encourage emails -- I do a lot more trading than selling (after all isn't that really the core of this hobby - it is for me)

 

I love talking art - and I get a ton more emails by leaving my CAF up like that...it doesn't mean I would sell them all immediately..

 

Regarding the ebay auction - I actually don't think 3k is all that wild of a price - its a beauty of a splash page, large art, 4 characters first appearances - and its got a really funny dialogue on the page - which to me makes it charming --

 

I think the page has the quote - in the book "Anyone want some meatloaf"

 

[Nexus]

I hope you don't mean me....I really hope you don't actually think I am a dealer...right?..

 

I do think you're a dealer. Not in the same sense as Mark, in that you're not hanging a shingle. But everything you buy is available for sale for the right price. To a degree that's true for all of us, but I don't think most collectors would buy for X and then be willing to sell to the first person willing to pay 2X. Not if they loved what they collected.

 

Plus, you advertise your OA for sale on Craigslist for its investment potential. That's something a dealer would do.

 

At the very least, you're more dealer than collector. Is that fair? I will give you credit for being more open about it than others who try to do it on the sly.

 

edit - if you did mean me -- about being able to buy it on the cheap -- you are WRONG. thats how this entire discussion started, by me POINTING OUT a page I got for $400 (which I think is actually a pretty fair price)...last week!

 

You've made the distinction before about how Mark should price for the "primary market" so as to leave room for the "secondary market". I have no idea how else to take that.

[JS]

 

I do think you're a dealer. Not in the same sense as Mark, in that you're not hanging a shingle. But everything you buy is available for sale for the right price. To a degree that's true for all of us, but I don't think most collectors would buy for X and then be willing to sell to the first person willing to pay 2X. Not if they loved what they collected.

 

Plus, you advertise your OA for sale on Craigslist for its investment potential. That's something a dealer would do.

 

At the very least, you're more dealer than collector. Is that fair? I will give you credit for being more open about it than others who try to do it on the sly.

 

You've made the distinction before about how Mark should price for the "primary market" so as to leave room for the "secondary market". I have no idea how else to take that.

 

I don't agree at all - there's a threshold that once someone throws stupid money at you, you will sell -- I have a few pieces that are personal to me that I actually list as not for sale on CAF - like 3-4 -- but yes, if someone offered me 50k for them, I'd take them (after making a nice color copy for myself )

 

I just think I am active in the OA market and I take the hobby seriously...take that for what you will - but I definitely don't think of myself as a dealer..

 

Maybe I was wrong before about the secondary market - maybe WD prices have hit the ceiling where there is no room for resale -- that's something I was never interested in related to purchasing from splashpage - maybe Mark is right for pricing how he is and I am completely off base -- any way it gets chopped up -- my thoughts are those I just express on the board...

 

Either way, I would like to say I appreciate you taking the time to talk through the points with me -- but I still don't like how this conversation started, with you questioning why people should take me seriously - I have no idea how it even relates?

 

 

[Claudio]

JerryS, if you want to know why he asks if people take you seriously, I would bet it is because of stuff like this. You berate other people's selling practices (Mark) and other people's art (Nowell Bros) but if someone takes a swipe at you, you get your feathers ruffled. Earlier, when you complained about Mark, I tried pointing out how your selling pracitice could also be viewed at critically by others. Instead, it just turned into

 

 

The Nowell brothers strike again!

 

Whatya mean? Issue 40 cover? .

 

yeah.

 

Rick's eyes always bugged me in that drawing.

 

But it's still a cover!

 

I sold that cover to them and I would love to see what covers Jerry owns...

 

I can't tell if you are kidding or not?

 

Either way, I don't own any WD covers anymore - I just sold the Jim Rugg one last week..didn't mean anything by the comment about 40..just saying its not really a grail piece or anything to get caught in a fuss about..

 

 

 

Right...#40, although featuring Rick, is "meh" and not "anything to get caught in a fuss about..."

 

On the other hand, #39, although featuring a nobody, is apparently a freakin' diamond:

This is the cream of the crop - short of getting a cover from Tony Moore you could not ask for something better.

 

As you know - this cover was drawn by the talented Charlie Adlard back in 2006 - THE SAME YEAR HE WON THE EISNER AWARD!!

 

As you also know - issue 39 was a VERY pivotal issue with some huge things happening in it which will no doubt be included in the hit TV SHOW!

 

This cover is an absolute gem - EARLY covers DO NOT COME ON THE MARKET VERY OFTEN --

 

Don't believe me? It says so right here in Jerry's auction:

 

http://cgi.ebay.com/ws/eBayISAPI.dll?ViewItem&_trksid=p4340.l2557&hash=item20c6366ffb&item=140764409851&nma=true&pt=LH_DefaultDomain_0&rt=nc&si=uPFsLp32%252Be8%252F860MtJqOnV2fI6w%253D&orig_cvip=true&rt=nc

 

[Szuter]

Pre-sale #106 Infinity and Beyond variants (signed and unsigned) now up on Ebay directly from the shop in the UK.

 

They say it's limited to 2000 copies.

 

http://www.ebay.com/itm/IMAGE-THE-WALKING-DEAD-106-EXCLUSIVE-ADLARD-100-INFINITY-BEYOND-COVER-/350676232731?pt=UK_Books_Comics_Magazines_US_Comics_ET&hash=item51a5eeaa1b

 

 

http://www.ebay.com/itm/IMAGE-THE-WALKING-DEAD-106-EXCLUSIVE-ADLARD-100-INFINITY-BEYOND-COVER-SIGNED-/190774409215?pt=UK_Books_Comics_Magazines_US_Comics_ET&hash=item2c6b0a77ff

 

Oh, and they also still have copies of the #85 I&B variant cover too.

 

Thanks

[Nexus]

I don't agree at all - there's a threshold that once someone throws stupid money at you, you will sell -- I have a few pieces that are personal to me that I actually list as not for sale on CAF - like 3-4 -- but yes, if someone offered me 50k for them, I'd take them (after making a nice color copy for myself )

 

You're agreeing with what I said-- to a degree, we'll all sell for the right price. But I don't know many collectors who make EVERYTHING available, even if the motivation is only to have a friendly chat.

 

I just think I am active in the OA market and I take the hobby seriously...take that for what you will - but I definitely don't think of myself as a dealer..

 

To me, anyone who advertises their OA for sale on Craigslist for its investment potential is a dealer. You can call it whatever you want.

 

Maybe I was wrong before about the secondary market - maybe WD prices have hit the ceiling where there is no room for resale -- that's something I was never interested in related to purchasing from splashpage - maybe Mark is right for pricing how he is and I am completely off base -- any way it gets chopped up -- my thoughts are those I just express on the board...

 

Either way, I would like to say I appreciate you taking the time to talk through the points with me -- but I still don't like how this conversation started, with you questioning why people should take me seriously - I have no idea how it even relates?

 

Because I find much of what you say to be not very well thought out. Such as the point about "primary" and "secondary" markets. As you note (I think), you're just expressing yourself here. Seemingly freely. Which is your right. But for being strongly opinionated, your posts aren't always well thought out. Is that fair?

 

You once called another boardie here a "morron" for not selling his WD cover when he got a $10K offer on it. It didn't matter if the boardie loved the piece and didn't want to sell...he was nonetheless a morron for not taking the money. And it was OK to call him a morron because the discussion was about WD art and "wait for it!" this is a forum for discussing WD art. That you couldn't believe he didn't take the money is telling and that it's OK to say whatever you want about another boardie if the discussion originates from WD art...well, there should be no problem here.

 

[Garf]

I just think I am active in the OA market and I take the hobby seriously...take that for what you will - but I definitely don't think of myself as a dealer..

 

If you look at the purchases that Jerry posts it doesn't seem like he's putting money from deals into anything else other than OA. i.e. it's the same game of poker that a lot of people here play with comics just different chips.

 

If I can get away with trading up on my collecting then I will.

 

----------------

 

As far as primary vs secondary market goes... well Splash are doing really well. They are selling more than 22 pages a month and the inventory is trending down. I think the pricing is spot on for them. The secondary market currently seems better value... and currently it's not such a leap away from the better pages on Splash to try and grab one of the better older pages.

 

Fact remains you can say what you like about their prices now. It's just opinion

 

[JS]

JerryS, if you want to know why he asks if people take you seriously, I would bet it is because of stuff like this. You berate other people's selling practices (Mark) and other people's art (Nowell Bros) but if someone takes a swipe at you, you get your feathers ruffled. Earlier, when you complained about Mark, I tried pointing out how your selling pracitice could also be viewed at critically by others. Instead, it just turned into

 

 

 

I don't think this has been a fight at all - its a discussion - also I don't really think I only berate others selling practices - In the last week I posted a link to some nice cheap art ending on Ebay for a fellow boardie..

 

[JS]

I don't agree at all - there's a threshold that once someone throws stupid money at you, you will sell -- I have a few pieces that are personal to me that I actually list as not for sale on CAF - like 3-4 -- but yes, if someone offered me 50k for them, I'd take them (after making a nice color copy for myself )

 

You're agreeing with what I said-- to a degree, we'll all sell for the right price. But I don't know many collectors who make EVERYTHING available, even if the motivation is only to have a friendly chat.

 

I just think I am active in the OA market and I take the hobby seriously...take that for what you will - but I definitely don't think of myself as a dealer..

 

To me, anyone who advertises their OA for sale on Craigslist for its investment potential is a dealer. You can call it whatever you want.

 

Maybe I was wrong before about the secondary market - maybe WD prices have hit the ceiling where there is no room for resale -- that's something I was never interested in related to purchasing from splashpage - maybe Mark is right for pricing how he is and I am completely off base -- any way it gets chopped up -- my thoughts are those I just express on the board...

 

Either way, I would like to say I appreciate you taking the time to talk through the points with me -- but I still don't like how this conversation started, with you questioning why people should take me seriously - I have no idea how it even relates?

 

Because I find much of what you say to be not very well thought out. Such as the point about "primary" and "secondary" markets. As you note (I think), you're just expressing yourself here. Seemingly freely. Which is your right. But for being strongly opinionated, your posts aren't always well thought out. Is that fair?

 

You once called another boardie here a "morron" for not selling his WD cover when he got a $10K offer on it. It didn't matter if the boardie loved the piece and didn't want to sell...he was nonetheless a morron for not taking the money. And it was OK to call him a morron because the discussion was about WD art and "wait for it!" this is a forum for discussing WD art. That you couldn't believe he didn't take the money is telling and that it's OK to say whatever you want about another boardie if the discussion originates from WD art...well, there should be no problem here.

 

We went through all this ages ago bud...I wasn't the one who brought up the sale - in fact a bunch of other people chimed in before I did, if memory serves - I expressed an opinion about the offer...and the thought to sell -- I suppose calling the person a insufficiently_thoughtful_person was a bit harsh -- but in my opinion it still holds true -- obviously what is pricey and stupid money varies from person to person, but I did think that was a no-brainer type sale..

 

As for the craigslist thing - I put up a LOCAL ad letting people know I had some art available for trade/sale in the NYC area outside of NYCC -- I haven't had the listing up in about 3 months...

 

I usually put it up around NYCC time to see about interest from people coming into town to work out trades/sales before the show...

 

Though, I still have no idea what that has to do with anything? Why are you putting everything I do under the microscope?

Edited December 22, 2012 by Jerry S

[JS]

I just think I am active in the OA market and I take the hobby seriously...take that for what you will - but I definitely don't think of myself as a dealer..

 

If you look at the purchases that Jerry posts it doesn't seem like he's putting money from deals into anything else other than OA. i.e. it's the same game of poker that a lot of people here play with comics just different chips.

 

If I can get away with trading up on my collecting then I will.

 

----------------

 

As far as primary vs secondary market goes... well Splash are doing really well. They are selling more than 22 pages a month and the inventory is trending down. I think the pricing is spot on for them. The secondary market currently seems better value... and currently it's not such a leap away from the better pages on Splash to try and grab one of the better older pages.

 

Fact remains you can say what you like about their prices now. It's just opinion

 

A few bucks have gone to pad the mattress hehe -- but yea, I agree - its a poker game, and who wouldn't love to trade up to a nicer piece?

 

If everyone at the table walks away happy - is that so wrong?

 

I also completely agree - the secondary market now not only has NICER stuff than splashpage, but its also a heck of a lot cheaper/more bang for your buck...

 

As can be seen, with my collection, I'm almost on a WEEKLY basis showing you guys whats out there, cheaper than what splashpage has..

 

And if anything, I'm overly honest with my pages - It's pretty much public knowledge what I pay for everything..

 

 

[ExcludedTim]

Damn eBay didn't notify me. They're down to about 175 left in stock at the moment.

[ThoseBackPages]

it really is apples and oranges as all of the OA are one of a kind items.

 

whatever Mark wants to charge, Mark can charge. there is no where else to get any particular page (as its the only one in existence)

 

as for what page "looks better" thats all in the eye of the person who owns it, or wants to own it.

[JS]

it really is apples and oranges as all of the OA are one of a kind items.

 

whatever Mark wants to charge, Mark can charge. there is no where else to get any particular page (as its the only one in existence)

 

as for what page "looks better" thats all in the eye of the person who owns it, or wants to own it.

 

very true - its a fair point! i have paid way over market for a few pages that i loved -- a WD page from issue 8 i bought from a boardie for 850 when i knew its value was a lot less -- i just really wanted an early example of adlards work and i love the panels..

[Nexus]

Though, I still have no idea what that has to do with anything? Why are you putting everything I do under the microscope?

 

Umm...everything related to WD is fair game here, right? Those are your rules, as I understand them. You're selling WD art. I'm talking about it. What's the problem?

 

Apparently, it's OK for you to call someone a insufficiently_thoughtful_person as it related to WD art. I haven't done that with you, so it should all be good.

 

 

[ThoseBackPages]

this is the first page i purchased. it's probably my favorite that i own. i doubt that i'll own another page featuring this many characters

 

[JS]

Though, I still have no idea what that has to do with anything? Why are you putting everything I do under the microscope?

 

Umm...everything related to WD is fair game here, right? Those are your rules, as I understand them. You're selling WD art. I'm talking about it. What's the problem?

 

Apparently, it's OK for you to call someone a insufficiently_thoughtful_person as it related to WD art. I haven't done that with you, so it should all be good.

 

 

rules? what is wrong with you? you are like in some weird cryostate where you come out of hiding just to become a boil on my ...you are talking about a listing I put up on craigslist for artwork in general - 3 months ago - which you incorrectly stated is currently posted - which, is not.

 

i dont care what you do, talk about, call me, or buy/sell -- im happy to talk with you about everything...but it just seems you and claudio have a personal vendetta against me for some weird reason..

 

tell you what - the next con we all go to - lets have a few beers and sort out the hatred with a good old fashioned game of apples to apples or something..

 

on that note - im going to get some japanese noodle soup -- tan tan ramen. yum. have a good saturday all..

Edited December 22, 2012 by Jerry S