ebay Sellers: Problems regarding shipping outside the US

[Black Lantern]

a topic which really bothers me very often regarding ebay sellers who ship worldwide is the following: i'm living in austria and if you order something from outside of the EU, you usually have to pay import sales tax (20% of the value including shipping costs) and customs charges (10 or 20% of the goods value) additionally to the price of the goods. sometimes the goods get trough free. that depends on how big the package is, how much the value is and often who is processing the package. there are some lazy people and some busy ones, if you get lucky you have the lazy one processing your package

 

so, if you let the goods be shipped as a gift or with a lower value quoted on the package, the package gets through free without additional costs. you can do this with comics because nobody knows the real value. plus when it is a gift, it's also free of charge. really many ebay sellers have no problem doing this. but i also came across some dealers in the past, who wouldn't want to do this. and when i asked why not they answered "that are the rules, i have to quote the real value of the books on the package". so if you ask me, i think that's wildly_fanciful_statement because nobody cares what you quote there. the seller ships the package and then it's gone. everything what comes next is only affecting the buyer. and if i want it shipped that way, why not? not only are some books getting ridiculous expensive (and not worth buying anymore at these costs) with the extra costs, it also takes much longer to get them. the customs authority are sending you a letter first with questions, you have to ship this letter back, and only then the package will get processed. this takes 1-2 weeks. so it really is a pain in the if this happens and i don't order from sellers anymore, who only write the real value of the books on the package.

 

any opinion to this topic? is my anger comprehensible?

[goldust40]

Some sellers insist on putting the full value of the books on the package because they feel (erroneously) that they'll get into trouble with EU customs otherwise - this is probably to do with U.S. / Canada transactions, which are strictly monitored. Most U.S. sellers wouldn't be that conversant with customs laws in Europe.

 

Anyway, if a seller states that he'll put full value on the package and it's too much hassle, then leave it. It's the same as sellers who don't take Paypal...too much trouble, expense and paperwork to get an IMO sorted. In the U.K. we're fortunate that comics, like books, attract no duty and are zero VAT rated, so that is hard luck with what you have to put up with in your country.

[Stromm]

I think the main problem is not that they are afraid of the Customs agents, it's the few buyers that use this to cheat the sellers who do mark the package as a gift, and undervalue it.

Come on, who in their right mind would ship a $100 book and only value it at $10? That's just asking to be ripped off.

While not all buyers are corrupt, it's the few that are that make us have to be upfront with the shipping information. Not only that, but you can't insure your package for more that the declared value.

Regardless of the value, it's just not worth the hassle that a lost or opened package would cause if it was shipped with a lesser that actual value.

I am sorry your Government feels the need to tax you so, but that's life.

[Black Lantern]

Some sellers insist on putting the full value of the books on the package because they feel (erroneously) that they'll get into trouble with EU customs otherwise - this is probably to do with U.S. / Canada transactions, which are strictly monitored. Most U.S. sellers wouldn't be that conversant with customs laws in Europe.

 

Anyway, if a seller states that he'll put full value on the package and it's too much hassle, then leave it. It's the same as sellers who don't take Paypal...too much trouble, expense and paperwork to get an IMO sorted. In the U.K. we're fortunate that comics, like books, attract no duty and are zero VAT rated, so that is hard luck with what you have to put up with in your country.

 

of course i levae it, but sometimes it's annoying when it is something you would like to buy, but it's failing because of this.

[FlyingDonut]

I think the main problem is not that they are afraid of the Customs agents, it's the few buyers that use this to cheat the sellers who do mark the package as a gift, and undervalue it.

Come on, who in their right mind would ship a $100 book and only value it at $10? That's just asking to be ripped off.

While not all buyers are corrupt, it's the few that are that make us have to be upfront with the shipping information. Not only that, but you can't insure your package for more that the declared value.

Regardless of the value, it's just not worth the hassle that a lost or opened package would cause if it was shipped with a lesser that actual value.

I am sorry your Government feels the need to tax you so, but that's life.

 

Also, if you're using Paypal's automatic shipping option now, the value of the items is uploaded onto the form.

[Black Lantern]

I think the main problem is not that they are afraid of the Customs agents, it's the few buyers that use this to cheat the sellers who do mark the package as a gift, and undervalue it.

Come on, who in their right mind would ship a $100 book and only value it at $10? That's just asking to be ripped off.

While not all buyers are corrupt, it's the few that are that make us have to be upfront with the shipping information. Not only that, but you can't insure your package for more that the declared value.

Regardless of the value, it's just not worth the hassle that a lost or opened package would cause if it was shipped with a lesser that actual value.

I am sorry your Government feels the need to tax you so, but that's life.

 

please tell me exactly where the cheating is in this? the seller get's his money. and the only one i'm cheating as a buyer is the customs authoritys, but that's my business, not the sellers. and that doesn't make me corrupt. the taxes are there so that you won't buy for example a personal computer in the US or any foreign country, where it's cheaper. that would be unfair to local sellers. but vintage US comics can't be bought here in austria. these are no new goods like technical goods which can be bought everywhere. so i don't hurt anybody when i'm ordering these in foreign countrys, but i still have to pay taxes for them? no way, not with me. that's not right.

 

why not ship a $100 book with a value at $10 when the buyer asks for this? the seller shouldn't care about this. when the book is not insured enough, it's my problem as a buyer. i have to live with it when it's damaged or lost. the main thing US sellers don't get is, that when the package is shipped to europe, nothing will happen to them. nobody will come and say "hey, your undervalued this". why are they so afraid something like that will happen. i really don't understand this. if the buyer want's this, then let him have it this way.

[whomerjay]

I'm usually all for ignoring/disobeying unfair rules, but your anger at the shipper is misplaced. First of all, when shippers mistate the value on a package they essentially forfeit any protection they have if you dispute the transaction, especially if you paid via paypal. So you are asking them to take a risk beyond whatever the consequences are with law (probably nil).

 

The problem is the tax law and that's where you should focus your anger and energies. Its true effect is to punish those who comply and reward those who cheat. I would imagine that whatever $ they bring in is offset by the hit the economy takes because the law is a deterrent to trade.

 

BTW, know one here is likely to take your side on this, like someone said factor the tax cost into your purchase and don't buy if you don't like it.

[skypinkblu]

I think the main problem is not that they are afraid of the Customs agents, it's the few buyers that use this to cheat the sellers who do mark the package as a gift, and undervalue it.

Come on, who in their right mind would ship a $100 book and only value it at $10? That's just asking to be ripped off.

While not all buyers are corrupt, it's the few that are that make us have to be upfront with the shipping information. Not only that, but you can't insure your package for more that the declared value.

Regardless of the value, it's just not worth the hassle that a lost or opened package would cause if it was shipped with a lesser that actual value.

I am sorry your Government feels the need to tax you so, but that's life.

 

please tell me exactly where the cheating is in this? the seller get's his money. and the only one i'm cheating as a buyer is the customs authoritys, but that's my business, not the sellers. and that doesn't make me corrupt. the taxes are there so that you won't buy for example a personal computer in the US or any foreign country, where it's cheaper. that would be unfair to local sellers. but vintage US comics can't be bought here in austria. these are no new goods like technical goods which can be bought everywhere. so i don't hurt anybody when i'm ordering these in foreign countrys, but i still have to pay taxes for them? no way, not with me. that's not right.

 

why not ship a $100 book with a value at $10 when the buyer asks for this? the seller shouldn't care about this. when the book is not insured enough, it's my problem as a buyer. i have to live with it when it's damaged or lost. the main thing US sellers don't get is, that when the package is shipped to europe, nothing will happen to them. nobody will come and say "hey, your undervalued this". why are they so afraid something like that will happen. i really don't understand this. if the buyer want's this, then let him have it this way.

 

This is exactly why I no longer offer to ship to other countries, when I sell on Ebay. First of all, I don't want to lie on the forms, I have to sign them, and I just don't feel comfortable lying on Government forms (our government forms, btw).

Secondly, I have private insurance that covers these packages. If I ship them to you and they get lost, it's not covered if I lie. If YOU don't get them, Paypal is going to charge ME, not you. It's great that you say it will be covered, but once something actually gets lost, that might change. People get emotional about missing packages, and I don't blame them.

I've had only 1 package lost in 10 years , and that was to Peru. I've had only 1 package damaged and that was to Canada...and both those transactions were nightmares, AFTER each of the buyer's assured me, that they would be responsible if I said it was a gift.

I had been offering shipping to Canada, but now, with the new rules, I took it back off. I only ship out of the US if someone asks, and then I tell them, that I won't lie on the forms...or if I sell on here.

 

Just to make YOU feel a little better, US sellers are paying Paypal fees on the shipping fees, so that when I sell something for $40 on Ebay and the shipping is $40, I get to pay 4%(+) on the shipping, as well as on the item...we are also charged a higher rate...so, it works both ways.

[Black Lantern]

This is exactly why I no longer offer to ship to other countries, when I sell on Ebay. First of all, I don't want to lie on the forms, I have to sign them, and I just don't feel comfortable lying on Government forms (our government forms, btw).

Secondly, I have private insurance that covers these packages. If I ship them to you and they get lost, it's not covered if I lie. If YOU don't get them, Paypal is going to charge ME, not you. It's great that you say it will be covered, but once something actually gets lost, that might change. People get emotional about missing packages, and I don't blame them.

I've had only 1 package lost in 10 years , and that was to Peru. I've had only 1 package damaged and that was to Canada...and both those transactions were nightmares, AFTER each of the buyer's assured me, that they would be responsible if I said it was a gift.

I had been offering shipping to Canada, but now, with the new rules, I took it back off. I only ship out of the US if someone asks, and then I tell them, that I won't lie on the forms...or if I sell on here.

 

Just to make YOU feel a little better, US sellers are paying Paypal fees on the shipping fees, so that when I sell something for $40 on Ebay and the shipping is $40, I get to pay 4%(+) on the shipping, as well as on the item...we are also charged a higher rate...so, it works both ways.

 

ok, the insurance is a good point. but if paypal is charching you when the package is lost, they already know the real value of the items. it's not that you have hidden the value from them. or am i missing something? i don't know. i only want to know if there is really a good reason for this or if it's only the usual "i don't want to lie on our forms" speech.

 

regarding the 4%(+) on the shipping: i'm sure that those costs will often be secretly added to the shipping costs. many packages i got from the US had lesser shipping costs on them as i had paid for. that's ok with me if the sellers tells me this before. but to learn this afterwards feels like being ripped off.

 

BTW, know one here is likely to take your side on this, like someone said factor the tax cost into your purchase and don't buy if you don't like it.

 

i'm pretty sure many foreign board users would take my side, but don't want to start a fight with the US board users ok, only joking. really

[jordanscott]

For me it's an insurance question.

 

Why did I ask for 200$ insurance on a 10 item, you ask Mr Postie?

 

No reason, sir.

[skypinkblu]

This is exactly why I no longer offer to ship to other countries, when I sell on Ebay. First of all, I don't want to lie on the forms, I have to sign them, and I just don't feel comfortable lying on Government forms (our government forms, btw).

Secondly, I have private insurance that covers these packages. If I ship them to you and they get lost, it's not covered if I lie. If YOU don't get them, Paypal is going to charge ME, not you. It's great that you say it will be covered, but once something actually gets lost, that might change. People get emotional about missing packages, and I don't blame them.

I've had only 1 package lost in 10 years , and that was to Peru. I've had only 1 package damaged and that was to Canada...and both those transactions were nightmares, AFTER each of the buyer's assured me, that they would be responsible if I said it was a gift.

I had been offering shipping to Canada, but now, with the new rules, I took it back off. I only ship out of the US if someone asks, and then I tell them, that I won't lie on the forms...or if I sell on here.

 

Just to make YOU feel a little better, US sellers are paying Paypal fees on the shipping fees, so that when I sell something for $40 on Ebay and the shipping is $40, I get to pay 4%(+) on the shipping, as well as on the item...we are also charged a higher rate...so, it works both ways.

 

ok, the insurance is a good point. but if paypal is charching you when the package is lost, they already know the real value of the items. it's not that you have hidden the value from them. or am i missing something? i don't know. i only want to know if there is really a good reason for this or if it's only the usual "i don't want to lie on our forms" speech.

 

regarding the 4%(+) on the shipping: i'm sure that those costs will often be secretly added to the shipping costs. many packages i got from the US had lesser shipping costs on them as i had paid for. that's ok with me if the sellers tells me this before. but to learn this afterwards feels like being ripped off.

 

BTW, know one here is likely to take your side on this, like someone said factor the tax cost into your purchase and don't buy if you don't like it.

 

i'm pretty sure many foreign board users would take my side, but don't want to start a fight with the US board users ok, only joking. really

 

Nope, I don't secretly add anything...it just costs me the extra, just like it costs you exta. Lying is NOT a good thing in any case (didn't your mother teach you that? ) Paypal doesn't cover the insurance, my insurance company does. Anything you do that is not above board, can void insurance, so why bother?

I agree with Jay, you need to factor in the costs when you bid, but console yourself with the fact that your Euro is worth the extra 20% you are paying and MORE;)

[chromium]

Part of this discussion has taken place in this thread Why I hate international bidders, some valid points from both sides pop up

[skypinkblu]

Allan, it's always a pleasure:)

 

I must have a bug about this subject, I see I was writing on the other thread, ...and I've certainly had GREAT transactions on this board, with people out of the US, and a few people on Ebay are just on my unblocked bidder list...

 

Shipping is always a sore point, because you see a price and you figure that is what you are spending, when customs and shipping get added on, it just shocks you, sometimes...just like when I go to a store and I conveniently forget there will be sales tax (because I want to think I'm getting a bargain;) ...so, Black Lantern, just figure that as the real cost.

[chromium]

Allan, it's always a pleasure:)

 

[VintageComics]

I have no problem meeting the needs of individual buyers. Whether they want insurance, box or a pillow case around their books is their business. As far as declared value?

 

When they stop taking millions of dollers in taxes from smokes, liqour, gas and casinos, stop their employees from rampantly spending those millions on hookers, 1st class travel and visits to the spa for their concubines and stop feeding healthy people who are able to work then I will rethink my position.

 

I'm tired of giving 30-40% of my wages so that some slob can eat chips and play video games all week.

 

Until the governement gets it's own spending in check I have no problem sliding one or two packages a month under the radar. It's actually a calculated risk on the part of the buyer and a calculated loss on the part of the government. It's not a big secret for either side.

 

I know, I know...I know the arguements. Still...that's the way it is. To me it's no different than speeding 10 or 15 over the limit.

 

 

R.

 

 

 

 

 

 

[joe_collector]

Personally, I have never asked that a seller use a "gift" option on the customs forms, but if they are nice and choose to, then that's cool too.

 

What I really hate are the maroons who sell you a comic for $10, then put $50 on the customs form, because that's what they "value" it at. I have had to put in many a customs refund claim due to pure stupidity like this.

 

But if I buy something for $100, I would never expect/demand the seller put a lower value on it.

[Black Lantern]

Nope, I don't secretly add anything...it just costs me the extra, just like it costs you exta. Lying is NOT a good thing in any case (didn't your mother teach you that? ) Paypal doesn't cover the insurance, my insurance company does. Anything you do that is not above board, can void insurance, so why bother?

I agree with Jay, you need to factor in the costs when you bid, but console yourself with the fact that your Euro is worth the extra 20% you are paying and MORE;)

 

that you don't do it doesn't mean your seller buddies doesn't do it. i have my experience, believe me. i'm buying since 1998 from US sellers. regarding lying: whom do i hurt? not me, not the seller. the big politics in my country? not even them, they lie to us every day. we are so pissed with our government at the moment, i will gladly lie back to them. living in austria gets more expensive every day and they do nothing against it. btw, you must be a saint becaus you NEVER lie. should i believe that?

 

as for the insurance, is it not enough to show them the paypal infos? do you have to show them the shipping form to?

 

but i have to say i really am to 99% always pleased with US sellers. it's not that i am angry because some won't see my point, but it's the reason they give me as an answer. why don't they say it's because of insurance? that they don't want to lie is in my opinion a really weak and laughable reason. i mean, they don't stand in court.

[Black Lantern]

Part of this discussion has taken place in this thread Why I hate international bidders, some valid points from both sides pop up

 

good points from you in that discussion (thumbs u

[50 Cent #II (1st)]

One the slightest chance that you get caught, why would a seller risk it? Also if you state a $100 book is worth $10 and insurance is included free, why would the shipper risk putting $10 on the value and then something happen to the package. They can only claim the value of the contents and they've put $10 on the forms and signed it.

 

[VintageComics]

One the slightest chance that you get caught, why would a seller risk it? Also if you state a $100 book is worth $10 and insurance is included free, why would the shipper risk putting $10 on the value and then something happen to the package. They can only claim the value of the contents and they've put $10 on the forms and signed it.

 

Because some people don't buy insurance.

 

R.