If pressing was detectable should it be given a blue label designation?

[FFNut]

Just sayin'...

[whisp]

In all seriousness it should just get the purple label if detectable with it noted like the other restorations.

 

 

[thehumantorch]

 

 

yawa og daerht siht ekam esaelP

 

 

 

 

wow, dad racecar, mom boob, did eye racecar

[conditionfreak]

Seems to me that a pressed book should be labeled as such, with a "Qualified" label. I am not sure exactly how a book gets pressed but I understand that only portions can get pressed and not the whole book. I also am under the imPRESSion that when pressing is done to a book, that some kind of moisture or substance is used. Is that correct?

 

I have several books that are CGC graded with "Qualified" labels, that either have an interior page tear, or a signature (ie: Stan Lee) on an interior page or on the cover, and also that have a missing page. If a signature that was not witnessed by CGC, gives a book a "qualified" label, and/or a book with a torn page or missing page (coupon) also gives a qualified designation. Why would pressing not? The missing page or torn page, did not add anything to the book, but pressing does. If nothing else, it adds correctiveness and repair.

 

I'm just saying.

 

I believe that pressed books would in fact be designated as such by CGC, if two things were not so.

 

1) They could detect it with accuracy and consistentency. (I won't even go into their record with a few trimmed books (or not trimmed books)).

 

2) They did not have a vested interest in books being annontated as "pressed" or not pressed.

 

I have always been of the mind that if a book is pressed, it would not prevent me from purchasing said book. But If I had the knowledge that a book is pressed and there is a similar book available that is NOT known to me as having been pressed, I would pay more for the latter. It may not even be a pressing candidate (I never consider whether a book is a pressing candidate or not when acquiring books, because I will never press one).

 

The more this pressing debate goes on (and on and on), the more I leaned towards not wanting to personally own any pressed books in my collection, unless there are no alternatives (like maybe the only one I can find of that issue in that grade).

 

How can someone who has books for several years, remember whether or not a particular book has been pressed? How can they know whether or not the book they bought slabbed, on the internet or at a Con, was ever pressed? Maybe you guys keep records about such things, but I doubt many do.

[bronze_rules]

Seems to me that a pressed book should be labeled as such, with a "Qualified" label. I am not sure exactly how a book gets pressed but I understand that only portions can get pressed and not the whole book. I also am under the imPRESSion that when pressing is done to a book, that some kind of moisture or substance is used. Is that correct?

 

I have several books that are CGC graded with "Qualified" labels, that either have an interior page tear, or a signature (ie: Stan Lee) on an interior page or on the cover, and also that have a missing page. If a signature that was not witnessed by CGC, gives a book a "qualified" label, and/or a book with a torn page or missing page (coupon) also gives a qualified designation. Why would pressing not? The missing page or torn page, did not add anything to the book, but pressing does. If nothing else, it adds correctiveness and repair.

 

I'm just saying.

 

I believe that pressed books would in fact be designated as such by CGC, if two things were not so.

 

1) They could detect it with accuracy and consistentency. (I won't even go into their record with a few trimmed books (or not trimmed books)).

 

2) They did not have a vested interest in books being annontated as "pressed" or not pressed.

 

I have always been of the mind that if a book is pressed, it would not prevent me from purchasing said book. But If I had the knowledge that a book is pressed and there is a similar book available that is NOT known to me as having been pressed, I would pay more for the latter. It may not even be a pressing candidate (I never consider whether a book is a pressing candidate or not when acquiring books, because I will never press one).

 

The more this pressing debate goes on (and on and on), the more I leaned towards not wanting to personally own any pressed books in my collection, unless there are no alternatives (like maybe the only one I can find of that issue in that grade).

 

How can someone who has books for several years, remember whether or not a particular book has been pressed? How can they know whether or not the book they bought slabbed, on the internet or at a Con, was ever pressed? Maybe you guys keep records about such things, but I doubt many do.

 

Good discussion. The point of the thread makes the assumption that there is some hithero non-utilized method that exists (spectroscopy, for instance), that could reliably detect whether non-natural pressing (such as fibers that were exposed to unusual amounts of short term heat and or h20) could be distinguished from natural pressing. I believe it is possible to do so reliably and some of that discussion is being carried out in the "Hypothesis: Pressing causes long-term damage to comics" thread.

 

The poll steps past that, and makes the assumption it is possible. So given that it's possible (and might some day be actually implemented), should a detected pressed comic still be awarded a blue label? All of these peripheral side discussions about whether or not pressing is good or harmful, are just distractions from the real issue, which is whether or not it should be mandatory to have disclosure up front on a label (then, let the informed buyer decide whether or not they want to pay a premium from there). The idea is to make the disclosure systematic, rather than on a case by case basis (sure if the buyer asks, I'll tell them that the car was flooded, that's fair right?).

 

Heck for all we know, the pressed designation could command a premium over non-pressed books. Only the market will ultimately make that verdict, right?

What's important is that they are given uniform disclosure to make that verdict up front.

[bronze_rules]

so with a little clarification, it looks like the voting results have actually changed

from some earlier threads.

 

non-blue/blue ~60/40

Thanks for participating and taking a step in the right direction. (thumbs u

[Aces]

If pressing was detectable should it be given a blue label designation?

 

Answer this first:

 

If sheet didn't smell bad would it be OK to leave it lying around the house?

[bronze_rules]

If pressing was detectable should it be given a blue label designation?

 

Answer this first:

 

If sheet didn't smell bad would it be OK to leave it lying around the house?

 

Witty contribution. Thanks for sharing.

[Aces]

If pressing was detectable should it be given a blue label designation?

 

Answer this first:

 

If sheet didn't smell bad would it be OK to leave it lying around the house?

 

Witty contribution. Thanks for sharing.

 

 

I don't think it will ever be detectable so it's a useless excerise.

Even if by some miracle pressing became detectable, could you imagine the cost of the molecule examining machine?

$2000 grading fee for moderns...

[KryptoSpidey]

i have been watching the pressing threads for weeks now and really havent chimmed in yet..here are my thoughts...

1)pressing should be disclosed! PERIOD!

2)pressing is a part of our hobby that is not going to go away....i.e. HAMMER

3)should a non-pressed cgc 9.6 be worth more than a pressed book of the same grade and page quality? YES!

4)disclosure should be a part of the cgc submission process...if a fool proof detection method is not available,a weekly list of all BOOKS THAT ARE PRESSED BY THEM should be forwarded to cgc from all the reputable companies that are a part of this board,nos,ect THAT ARE DOING THE PRESSING ..... discolure should be on the part of the people doing the work on the books,ESPECIALLY WHEN THEY ARE SUBMITTING MANY OF THE BOOKS DIRECT TO CGC...

 

[bronze_rules]

If pressing was detectable should it be given a blue label designation?

 

Answer this first:

 

If sheet didn't smell bad would it be OK to leave it lying around the house?

 

Witty contribution. Thanks for sharing.

 

 

I don't think it will ever be detectable so it's a useless excerise.

Even if by some miracle pressing became detectable, could you imagine the cost of the molecule examining machine?

$2000 grading fee for moderns...

 

It doesn't take a miracle. A little incentive maybe. The cost of a typical spectrometer (or access to a lab) is easily affordable to an outfit like CGC IMO. And I think they make fat enough margins to absorb the cost without passing exorbitant increases to the consumer. If you want to be practical, that's fine, but let's discuss details here.

[John A III]

CGC's stance notwithstanding, No, i dont think it should get a purple label

 

Not necessary to automatically assume purple, could make it green or some other color/designation beyond blue. The question is focused on whether it should be given 'blue' label status.

 

Don't call it restoration if you want, just put it in a class that is not blue label.

Call it qualified, pressed, or some other designation that classifies it as something other than a blue label designation.

 

+1

[Mac Man]

Every time I have asked the question whether we know of any long-term, negative affects of pressing (i.e. does it speed of the degradation of the paper), my post always gets "lost in the sauce" of all the arguments. And if someone eventually did respond, I probably stopped paying attention to the thread after 50+ posts of being overlooked, so my apologies if someone out there did respond and sees me asking the same question again. But that question is what still keeps me on the fence and I still haven't seen a direct response.

 

If this action does not actually damage the book, then I don't see it being a defect; but it should be noted since it is not an "original" grade. If it does cause long term damage, then it should be a defect and be graded with a green label and noted as being pressed. While I might not be a slab collector and people might say that I have no horse in the race, I'd argue that this is just an important for raw collectors as CGC's grading (despite having undisclosed standards) has had a massive effect on how all collectors grade their comics.

 

Plus, I think I'm ok with the blue label so long as it is noted. Some people will get the grade they want for a fraction of the cost through getting a pressed 9.8; others will find a new way to take pleasure in their books by having a new, distinguishing factor that sets their book above others (i.e. White Pages) when they own an unpressed 9.8. Personally, I think the notation will give the high grade collectors a new rabbit to chase.

 

And here's the only concern I have about noting "slight pressing" versus "extensive pressing"--what if someone stores their books that there is some natural pressing that takes place? They should have a possible stigma attached to their books as being "slight amateur pressed?" I'm not sure that's fair and it might turn a lot of people off from slabbing their books.

[KryptoSpidey]

Every time I have asked the question whether we know of any long-term, negative affects of pressing (i.e. does it speed of the degradation of the paper), my post always gets "lost in the sauce" of all the arguments. And if someone eventually did respond, I probably stopped paying attention to the thread after 50+ posts of being overlooked, so my apologies if someone out there did respond and sees me asking the same question again. But that question is what still keeps me on the fence and I still haven't seen a direct response.

 

If this action does not actually damage the book, then I don't see it being a defect; but it should be noted since it is not an "original" grade. If it does cause long term damage, then it should be a defect and be graded with a green label and noted as being pressed. While I might not be a slab collector and people might say that I have no horse in the race, I'd argue that this is just an important for raw collectors as CGC's grading (despite having undisclosed standards) has had a massive effect on how all collectors grade their comics.

 

Plus, I think I'm ok with the blue label so long as it is noted. Some people will get the grade they want for a fraction of the cost through getting a pressed 9.8; others will find a new way to take pleasure in their books by having a new, distinguishing factor that sets their book above others (i.e. White Pages) when they own an unpressed 9.8. Personally, I think the notation will give the high grade collectors a new rabbit to chase.

 

And here's the only concern I have about noting "slight pressing" versus "extensive pressing"--what if someone stores their books that there is some natural pressing that takes place? They should have a possible stigma attached to their books as being "slight amateur pressed?" I'm not sure that's fair and it might turn a lot of people off from slabbing their books.

+1

[joe_collector]

Who wrote these choices, an foreign exchange student on crack?

 

Why not try this:

 

If a book may be detectable by normal means, then the resultant grade should be within tolerable amounts given the paper's consistency, with no other restoration, while staying within the pressable limits of the era, and given a blue label.

 

Better?

[Park]

If pressing was detectable should it be given a blue label designation?

 

Answer this first:

 

If sheet didn't smell bad would it be OK to leave it lying around the house?

 

Witty contribution. Thanks for sharing.

 

 

I don't think it will ever be detectable so it's a useless excerise.

Even if by some miracle pressing became detectable, could you imagine the cost of the molecule examining machine?

$2000 grading fee for moderns...

 

It doesn't take a miracle. A little incentive maybe. The cost of a typical spectrometer (or access to a lab) is easily affordable to an outfit like CGC IMO. And I think they make fat enough margins to absorb the cost without passing exorbitant increases to the consumer. If you want to be practical, that's fine, but let's discuss details here.

 

There is no incentive for CGC to detect pressing. If it ever was detectable, then the integrity of about 1,000,000 slabs is now put into question.

 

I think it would also slow down the resub game as well. As a business, I do not think CGC wants to discourage submissions.

[Subliminal]

Perhaps there is a declaration of pressing that could be drawn up that pro and anti pressers could come to agreement on that incorporates language that describes it and outlines what should be done about a book thats been pressed. An agreement to end the war.

 

There must be some common ground that everyone stands on or can at least agree represents what a pressed book is and that is is an integral part of the book once it has occurred and should not be concealed if known.

 

In my almost perfect world pressed and unpressed books would live in harmony with no secrets between them and buyers would know if a book was pressed because the seller knows it definitely was and shares that or it isn't as far as the sellers knows and that's ok because there is trust there.

I think pressed books are a currently accepted mild form of restoration that should be allowed in a blue label just like other light resto books but there should be listed on the label in all fairness if it is detected.

 

Declared pressing would be beneficial to pressers too since they would know a potential purchase has already been thru the wringer.

 

The common ground seems to be documentation and declaration to me and there seems to be no reason why pressing businesses should not exist since there is a demand and some acceptance of it.

[bronze_rules]

Who wrote these choices, an foreign exchange student on crack?

 

Why not try this:

 

If a book may be detectable by normal means, then the resultant grade should be within tolerable amounts given the paper's consistency, with no other restoration, while staying within the pressable limits of the era, and given a blue label.

 

Better?

 

Talk about obfuscation.

 

No, I think it's pretty clear as it stands.

[kc120us]

Perhaps there is a declaration of pressing that could be drawn up that pro and anti pressers could come to agreement on that incorporates language that describes it and outlines what should be done about a book thats been pressed. An agreement to end the war.

 

There must be some common ground that everyone stands on or can at least agree represents what a pressed book is and that is is an integral part of the book once it has occurred and should not be concealed if known.

 

In my almost perfect world pressed and unpressed books would live in harmony with no secrets between them and buyers would know if a book was pressed because the seller knows it definitely was and shares that or it isn't as far as the sellers knows and that's ok because there is trust there.

I think pressed books are a currently accepted mild form of restoration that should be allowed in a blue label just like other light resto books but there should be listed on the label in all fairness if it is detected.

 

Declared pressing would be beneficial to pressers too since they would know a potential purchase has already been thru the wringer.

 

The common ground seems to be documentation and declaration to me and there seems to be no reason why pressing businesses should not exist since there is a demand and some acceptance of it.

 

There was. it's called disclosure. But now it is apparently not enough.

[RockMyAmadeus]

What if pressing were DELECTABLE...?

 

Huhh?

 

HUHHH??