PROBATION DISCUSSIONS 21 21

[Bosco685]

Reread what I wrote, it should make sense. If one of the greatest documents ever written has room to be expanded, changed and corrected how can we stand on ceremony that the Probation List rules are untouchable?

You rebel!

 

[divad]

I lost faith in the probation list when putting a member on it for non-payment before the 30-day period, which violated the rules. It was just a few members that decided yes this buyer should be on the list but the rules (to my knowledge) where never changed to accommodate buyers remitting payment before 30-days. Leniency or bending the rules once shatters the process as a whole.

 

Voting to put members on the list or banning sketch sellers who haven’t actually harmed any parties account for this type of circumventing the process. This community does a great job at policing itself and I believe these instances are justifiably handed case by case by individual members. If it is the rules that need to be changed based on an ever-changing selling environment then we should do this as a community and look to use these three cases as examples rather than trying to incorporate them into unfound rules. Once the community loses faith in this probation system, what do you have left?

 

What I see being done here truly saddens me and is so far from the spirit of the boards that I originally joined.

 

In all fairness, I believe this was applied only in one or two instances where the buyer flat out said that they had no intention of paying. It seems harsh to force the seller to wait 30 days under those circumstances. Especially if it means they have to hold onto books for a month instead of putting them back up for sale.

 

Exceptions to the rules are being made willy-nilly is not right either. The rules need to be changed then if everyone things that a 30 day window is to long. The rules should be enforced to stop the pitch-fork menatility that can develop rather quickly here. I feel that new problems are coming up and perhaps it is time to look at what is happening and make changes together not just have one or two inputs.

 

Awwww, you'll be back You know how many times I've thrown my hands up in the air? It's all for the greater good.

[seanfingh]

 

Personally, i think the discourse that has been generated as a result of both of these incidents has been well-reasoned and beneficial. The bottom line is that this is a huge gathering of comic buying individuals. Over time there have been, and are going to be, more and more people coming here to sell. For the express purpose of selling. Some of those folks are going to be not-so-nice.

 

I think our group does an excellent job of helping one another out, watchdogging and just plain old downright sleuthing to get to the bottom of most scams before they even get off the ground. Does this lead to a "pitchfork mentality?" Maybe. But it is better than the alternative.

 

My 2 cents on the current situation is that Yannis can only be put on by Matt. It was a one-to-one deal. Only Matt was harmed and it is up to him. DRFRANKENSTEIN perpetrated a fraud upon the forums as a whole. I would be much more open to some sort of forum decision in a situation like that.

[TSwift25]

I just want to throw my two cents in; I'm not a very vocal user but I'd like to think that through my transactions both buying and selling I'm an established one:

 

I do not understand what good the hall of shame, the probation list and the "long memories" do if users on those lists continue to post, get aliases or otherwise continue the proliferation of wrongdoings.

 

It may be in the board's best interests to add user titles for the probation members or the Hall of Shame members, that way, all board members are aware that they are "on the list." I speak purely for myself, but I am unfortunately not able to be constantly kept abreast of the board dealings. This isn't a call for a tar and feathering so much as it is a call for accountability. If these threads exist, we clearly want accountability, so why not assist those who otherwise would not know they are dealing with someone "on the list." Additionally, there may be added incentive to right the wrongs that put them on probation or in the hall of shame if that appears under their user name.

 

To make it more specific, as it pertains to the 30 day rule; anticipatory repudiation is a fundamental right in contract law. Since we seem to continually harken back to the most primitive of contract law, that is, "a deal agreed to is a deal," I see nothing wrong with shortening the 30 day rule if there is good cause to believe that time is inconsequential to the consummation of the agreement.

 

Thanks for letting me rant,

 

Trent

[mschmidt]

I just want to throw my two cents in; I'm not a very vocal user but I'd like to think that through my transactions both buying and selling I'm an established one:

 

I do not understand what good the hall of shame, the probation list and the "long memories" do if users on those lists continue to post, get aliases or otherwise continue the proliferation of wrongdoings.

 

It may be in the board's best interests to add user titles for the probation members or the Hall of Shame members, that way, all board members are aware that they are "on the list." I speak purely for myself, but I am unfortunately not able to be constantly kept abreast of the board dealings. This isn't a call for a tar and feathering so much as it is a call for accountability. If these threads exist, we clearly want accountability, so why not assist those who otherwise would not know they are dealing with someone "on the list." Additionally, there may be added incentive to right the wrongs that put them on probation or in the hall of shame if that appears under their user name.

 

To make it more specific, as it pertains to the 30 day rule; anticipatory repudiation is a fundamental right in contract law. Since we seem to continually harken back to the most primitive of contract law, that is, "a deal agreed to is a deal," I see nothing wrong with shortening the 30 day rule if there is good cause to believe that time is inconsequential to the consummation of the agreement.

 

Thanks for letting me rant,

 

Trent

 

With reasoning skills like that, you should post more often

[Mac Man]

While I do like the idea of custom titles for those members who "earn" the title of HoF or Prob. List, it takes an administrator of the boards to do that and they are all quite clear that they will not be involved at that level. Again, I agree with the idea but it's just not an option available to us as a community.

[thirdgreenham]

I just want to throw my two cents in; I'm not a very vocal user but I'd like to think that through my transactions both buying and selling I'm an established one:

 

I do not understand what good the hall of shame, the probation list and the "long memories" do if users on those lists continue to post, get aliases or otherwise continue the proliferation of wrongdoings.

 

It may be in the board's best interests to add user titles for the probation members or the Hall of Shame members, that way, all board members are aware that they are "on the list." I speak purely for myself, but I am unfortunately not able to be constantly kept abreast of the board dealings. This isn't a call for a tar and feathering so much as it is a call for accountability. If these threads exist, we clearly want accountability, so why not assist those who otherwise would not know they are dealing with someone "on the list." Additionally, there may be added incentive to right the wrongs that put them on probation or in the hall of shame if that appears under their user name.

 

To make it more specific, as it pertains to the 30 day rule; anticipatory repudiation is a fundamental right in contract law. Since we seem to continually harken back to the most primitive of contract law, that is, "a deal agreed to is a deal," I see nothing wrong with shortening the 30 day rule if there is good cause to believe that time is inconsequential to the consummation of the agreement.

 

Thanks for letting me rant,

 

Trent

 

Yeah, what he said. (thumbs u

[Forbush-Man]

 

I do not understand what good the hall of shame, the probation list and the "long memories" do if users on those lists continue to post, get aliases or otherwise continue the proliferation of wrongdoings.

 

 

Just FYI, but I will not buy or knowingly sell to anyone who is on the probation list or Hall of Shame. So that is a reason to have the list in itself. I have seen a number of sales threads (and they should all start this way) state that if you are on the list, don't bother to participate. Hopefully that action encourages them to clean up their act and make amends.

 

[A-DONIS]

So how does one handle a board member who agreed to sell a couple of books..then said the books where shipped via USPS Priority, but can't find the "tracking" number...and later issues a refund...

 

And of course, refuses to talk to me via PM...to at least tell the truth as to why these books "misteriously" disappeared.

 

 

Edited May 7, 2010 by LBJARM

[mschmidt]

So how does one handle a board member who agreed to sell a couple of books..then said the books where shipped via USPS Priority, but can't find the "tracking" number...and later issues a refund...

 

And of course, refuses to talk to me via PM...to at least tell the truth as to why these books "misteriously" disappeared.

 

 

You out him in the Probation Discussion thread and tell him that you're doing so - which hopefully leads to an apology/explanation.

 

And if that doesn't work, you put them on Probation list after 30 days.

[A-DONIS]

Interesting..even if this person is 100% adament that he shipped the books?

Edited May 7, 2010 by LBJARM

[Bosco685]

Interesting..even if this person is 100% adament that he shipped the books?

But refunded 100% of your money even though he/she says they shipped the books?

[gcstomp]

Thats an ugly situation. I know in my early days I shipped a low cost package, without delivery confirmation, customer claimed I never shipped. I suffered paypal reversal and a negative, as well as an urge to break something. But packages are swiped off front door steps all the time, so who knows what really happened?

 

Maybe post books and CGC serial numbers, if they are out there, this group will find it in a minute.

[mschmidt]

Interesting..even if this person is 100% adament that he shipped the books?

 

Well, no - if the person confirms in a PM that your books were, in fact, shipped and has given you a full refund, it's basically your word against his. And stuff does get lost in the mail from time to time.

[Bosco685]

The great thing is the seller refunded your money 100% evern after stating they sent the books out.

 

What's the lingering issue?

[User 01001010]

Funny thing about this is...just like bosco said....I issued a full refund last friday after it was agreed mutually that if he did not receive the books that he would get his full money back and he can pay me if the books ever arrive. So since he pleaded that he saved for two weeks for the books I sent the money back.

 

Now he starts carpping in my thread after I blocked him because he kept calling me a liar.

 

 

Take what you want from it, I shipped the books, a chew #1 2nd print ss, goon 32 retailer variant and a copy of satan's sodomy baby. He says he never got the books, he has his money back and now he's bringing this up because he wants to smear me because I have a new sales thread.

[Dollarbill]

The great thing is the seller refunded your money 100% evern after stating they sent the books out.

 

What's the lingering issue?

I was thinking the same thing.

[faster friends]

This is a joke right?

[Bosco685]

And to attack the seller in their sales thread after you got 100% of your money back and the potential the books show up and the seller will not know?!

 

Come on - this just doesn't seem right.

[A-DONIS]

Wait..I pleaded that I saved for two weeks??? Where do you get your information? I paid you in full!!