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My auction question

Started by Silver,

85 posts in this topic

DrWatson

DrWatson

Posted
Posted
That carp really goes on?

 

Hell yeah.

 

"There are lots of reasons, but as an example, would you trust a major auction site that allows its own employees to bid on its auctions?"

 

That's why Heritage is in Texas. Texas has weird/lax rules about auction houses. In Texas, Heritage employees can bid on Heritage auctions

 

"Or another that invites specific 'important' guests to physically view auction lots for manipulation potential before auctions go live?"

 

That's why Matt Nelson lives in Texas, a couple miles away from Heritage.

 

Halperin also owns stock in CGC.

 

I guess this is why, you'd do last min bids? I wonder if they have the knowledge to know your max bid and then an employee can bid just below this.

 

Oh, I'm sure it's entirely possible that this could happen.

 

The $64,000 question is...does it? hm

I think so.

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Flaming_Telepath

Flaming_Telepath

Posted
Posted
my guess is that there is something shady going on there involving comics

 

letting employees bid :o I heard that once before but didn't believe it. Does this seem unethical to the rest of you, sure does to me.

 

Oh, it's 100% unethical, but as has been pointed out, it's not illegal in Texas. :screwy:

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JvR11

JvR11

Posted
Posted
my guess is that there is something shady going on there involving comics

 

letting employees bid :o I heard that once before but didn't believe it. Does this seem unethical to the rest of you, sure does to me.

 

Oh, it's 100% unethical, but as has been pointed out, it's not illegal in Texas. :screwy:

 

And, there are ways for auction houses to get around it outside of Texas..so I guess the best thing to do is not to let the "thrill of bidding" get to you and bid in a reasonable manner.

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buttock

buttock

Posted
Posted
That carp really goes on?

 

Hell yeah.

 

"There are lots of reasons, but as an example, would you trust a major auction site that allows its own employees to bid on its auctions?"

 

That's why Heritage is in Texas. Texas has weird/lax rules about auction houses. In Texas, Heritage employees can bid on Heritage auctions

 

"Or another that invites specific 'important' guests to physically view auction lots for manipulation potential before auctions go live?"

 

That's why Matt Nelson lives in Texas, a couple miles away from Heritage.

 

Halperin also owns stock in CGC.

 

... err... yeah. Heritage....

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FlyingDonut

FlyingDonut

Posted
Posted
That carp really goes on?

 

Hell yeah.

 

"There are lots of reasons, but as an example, would you trust a major auction site that allows its own employees to bid on its auctions?"

 

That's why Heritage is in Texas. Texas has weird/lax rules about auction houses. In Texas, Heritage employees can bid on Heritage auctions

 

"Or another that invites specific 'important' guests to physically view auction lots for manipulation potential before auctions go live?"

 

That's why Matt Nelson lives in Texas, a couple miles away from Heritage.

 

Halperin also owns stock in CGC.

 

Your accounts might last longer if you didn't have the same naming convention every time - word_word.

 

I think you've got a lot of good things to say here, but it is too easy to spot you.

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short_box-migration

short_box-migration

Posted
Posted
That carp really goes on?

 

Hell yeah.

 

"There are lots of reasons, but as an example, would you trust a major auction site that allows its own employees to bid on its auctions?"

 

That's why Heritage is in Texas. Texas has weird/lax rules about auction houses. In Texas, Heritage employees can bid on Heritage auctions

 

"Or another that invites specific 'important' guests to physically view auction lots for manipulation potential before auctions go live?"

 

That's why Matt Nelson lives in Texas, a couple miles away from Heritage.

 

Halperin also owns stock in CGC.

 

Your accounts might last longer if you didn't have the same naming convention every time - word_word.

 

I think you've got a lot of good things to say here, but it is too easy to spot you.

 

Thanks Dan! :hi:

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Flaming_Telepath

Flaming_Telepath

Posted
Posted
That carp really goes on?

 

Hell yeah.

 

"There are lots of reasons, but as an example, would you trust a major auction site that allows its own employees to bid on its auctions?"

 

That's why Heritage is in Texas. Texas has weird/lax rules about auction houses. In Texas, Heritage employees can bid on Heritage auctions

 

"Or another that invites specific 'important' guests to physically view auction lots for manipulation potential before auctions go live?"

 

That's why Matt Nelson lives in Texas, a couple miles away from Heritage.

 

Halperin also owns stock in CGC.

 

Your accounts might last longer if you didn't have the same naming convention every time - word_word.

 

I think you've got a lot of good things to say here, but it is too easy to spot you.

 

Thanks Dan! :hi:

 

I'll make your future user IDs up for you...they'll have a certain...British...feel to them to throw the Mods off the trail.

 

How about...arseman? :/

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FlyingDonut

FlyingDonut

Posted
Posted
That carp really goes on?

 

Hell yeah.

 

"There are lots of reasons, but as an example, would you trust a major auction site that allows its own employees to bid on its auctions?"

 

That's why Heritage is in Texas. Texas has weird/lax rules about auction houses. In Texas, Heritage employees can bid on Heritage auctions

 

"Or another that invites specific 'important' guests to physically view auction lots for manipulation potential before auctions go live?"

 

That's why Matt Nelson lives in Texas, a couple miles away from Heritage.

 

Halperin also owns stock in CGC.

 

Your accounts might last longer if you didn't have the same naming convention every time - word_word.

 

I think you've got a lot of good things to say here, but it is too easy to spot you.

 

Thanks Dan! :hi:

 

No problem. Try something without the underline, that's the giveaway.

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Not*Sure*

Not*Sure*

Posted
Posted

Okay Is it not Okay for some reason to talk about something that is a known fact? I am just saying I know that is true. An employee at their booth I spoke with was laying it out for me. Honestly I don't see it being any different than when a user on Ebay gets their wife or daughter to make bids for them under a false ID. Are they not upfront about the fact that they reserve the right to up bids on their items by employee bid if they are not being bid on in a satisfactory amount? Was the employee telling me some trade secret I was not supposed to know or something? I am just curious.

Is shilling really illegal in some states?

I go to live auctions all the time and they are always bid up by employees. I don't absolutely agree it is the most fair thing for the customer to not start bids at a price you wish to accept. I have bid on many items to have the employee next to the caller up his bid over mine till I either reach their "happy price" or I give up. Luckily in my area the appraisers for the auction houses don't know diddly about comic books. My husband and I picked up a comic advertised as "Justice League #28" that was really a Brave and Bold #28. The bids started at $1 it was between me and the auctioneer. He bid it up to $10. We won. Of course, we were really happy.

On the other side of things the auction house always jacks up stuff like Barbies and Beanie babies. That is fine with me because I think they are junk!!

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Flaming_Telepath

Flaming_Telepath

Posted
Posted
Honestly I don't see it being any different than when a user on Ebay gets their wife or daughter to make bids for them under a false ID.

 

Correct. It's no different.

 

And the fact is that doing this on eBay is against their rules and will get you banned. (thumbs u

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Flaming_Telepath

Flaming_Telepath

Posted
Posted

And another issue is that, as an independent bidder, you have no clue whether you're bidding against other collectors or the house.

 

If it's other collectors, you'll could assume that the item is popular and you need to pick it up. If it's the house 'protecting its investment', you're going to bid lower as you'll assume that there isn't that much true interest.

 

But you never know which it is. :(

 

And yes, just about anywhere else, shill bidding is illegal. (thumbs u

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G.A.tor

G.A.tor

Posted
Posted
I don't have the funds to go after big ticket books but man would I be mad if I found out an employee was bidding against me

 

And knew what your bid was. hm

that is a good point...

I would have no problem with an employee bidding against me, after all, just because they work there, doesn't mean they are not a comic collector, etc too...

 

what i would have a problem with, is if the employee only bid to shill up to a "known" maximum... now, my understanding (from conversations) is that an employee bidding does "not" know what other proxy bids are, but I guess short of being on the inside, would be tough to confirm

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Bosco685

Bosco685

Posted
Posted
what i would have a problem with, is if the employee only bid to shill up to a "known" maximum... now, my understanding (from conversations) is that an employee bidding does "not" know what other proxy bids are, but I guess short of being on the inside, would be tough to confirm

Seriously? There are actual rules to this shilling with certain auction houses?

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Flaming_Telepath

Flaming_Telepath

Posted
Posted
what i would have a problem with, is if the employee only bid to shill up to a "known" maximum... now, my understanding (from conversations) is that an employee bidding does "not" know what other proxy bids are, but I guess short of being on the inside, would be tough to confirm

Seriously? There are actual rules to this shilling with certain auction houses?

 

Who knows? (shrug)

 

And that's the core of the problem.

 

You will often see books 'won' at a Heritage auction that appear again a short time later in different slabs. The Boy Comics (was it #17? hm ) that started off life as a 4.0, then went to 7.0, then ended up as a 9.0 :o is a prime example.

 

Was this won by the house, restored (yes, it ended up in a blue label, but you will never convince me that work that bumps a book from 4.0 to 9.0 is not restoration), and then resold?

 

Or was it a third party who kept on winning it and doing the work? hm

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