Is it likely that the most valuable Comic books will be faked? 0

[GermanFan]

I dont know if this has been discussed here before. Every item that is valuable will be faked if its worthwhile (art is the best example). Its just a matter how high are the costs of producing the fake and whats left for profit. Now with the million dollar barrier beeing broken on the top books do you think this will happen? Is it technically possible (to find the old paper stock etc.). Seems to me its not that difficult.

[VintageComics]

I think it's pretty much guaranteed that someone will try. It's already happened for some books in fact.

 

I think a better question might be will a book with a proven provenance or lineage carry a premium?

[ComicConnoisseur]

I think it has already started in China, they can fake anything.

I read somewhere where there are thousands of fake Marvel comics from China.

I heard those guys in China can make that Robo jo guy or Ewert look like a amateur.

Edited May 6, 2010 by ComicConnoisseur

[GermanFan]

Are you just joking or is this really happening?

[ComicConnoisseur]

Are you just joking or is this really happening?

google fake china marvel comics

 

[G.A.tor]

[VintageComics]

Are you just joking or is this really happening?

 

Cerebus #1, Teenage Mutant Ninja Turtles#1, Eerie #1, X-men #94 have already been counterfeited. I have a duplicate copy of All American #16 that is not a terrific reprint but to the average person it would pass as a real comic.

 

What's to stop someone counterfeiting a million dollar book?

[ComicConnoisseur]

Here is a quick link, I am headed out to see Ironman 2, when I have some time I will try to find the other links.

Feds warn of fake China stuff. from barbie to Marvel comics.

Edited May 6, 2010 by ComicConnoisseur

[GermanFan]

Hopefully CGC will be able to track fakes in the future when they appear.

[AtlasFan]

I work in downtown NYC...Last month, this guy in Chinatown was selling a stack of MARVEL MYSTERY COMICS #1 for $10 each...do you think they were fakes???

[nearmint]

I work in downtown NYC...Last month, this guy in Chinatown was selling a stack of MARVEL MYSTERY COMICS #1 for $10 each...do you think they were fakes???

 

If it said Marvel Mystery Comics #1, it was definitely a fake, as no such book exists.

[Bronty]

Are you sure? I think there were some squarebound timely reprints a while back including I think a MMC #1. Ie. no such 30s book exists, but I think a 90s or aughts one does

[nearmint]

What did the Marvel Mystery Comics #1 reprint?

[sfcityduck]

I think it is highly unlikely that anyone would be able to fake a GA comic book. Heck, Marvel and DC have had enough trouble converting them into a presentable form for Archives or Masterworks that they resorted to lower quality scanning or redrawing to create a presentable facsimile -- and those are readily distinguishable from the originals by a mere eyeball test, without even doing any of the sorts of scientific evaluation that might be used to assess whether a painting is a fake.

 

And its not like you can just pass off a counterfiet Action 1 on a street corner. Realistically, you are going to have to fool sophisticated collectors, auctioneers, and, probably, third party graders. I wouldn't lose any sleep over this one.

 

I also don't think that the very slight risk would create much more interest in a comic's "provenance" than now exists. Seems like many collectors and dealers are already under suspicion for shady practices at one point or another -- whether thats restoring books, passing off restored books as unrestored, overly generous grading, or even, I've read, forging the identifying marks of certain pedigrees on to non-pedigree books. So provenance ultimately seems a negative concern, not a positive one, if it can be discerned at all. Why would anyone care about provenance when CGC certification rules the market?

 

[sfcityduck]

Marvel Mystery #1 came out last year, and it wasn't a reprint.

 

See here:

 

http://marvel.com/catalog/?id=11832

Edited May 6, 2010 by sfcityduck

[AtlasFan]

I work in downtown NYC...Last month, this guy in Chinatown was selling a stack of MARVEL MYSTERY COMICS #1 for $10 each...do you think they were fakes???

 

If it said Marvel Mystery Comics #1, it was definitely a fake, as no such book exists.

 

It was strange...it had some flaming guy on the cover and a Hulk story on the inside...

[adamstrange]

I dont know if this has been discussed here before. Every item that is valuable will be faked if its worthwhile (art is the best example). Its just a matter how high are the costs of producing the fake and whats left for profit. Now with the million dollar barrier beeing broken on the top books do you think this will happen? Is it technically possible (to find the old paper stock etc.). Seems to me its not that difficult.

 

If they can counterfeit a dollar bill then they can counterfeit a comic. It wouldn't be all that easy to do as you have to find the right paper stock for both the cover and contents and then recreate the artwork for both and produce accurate colors. I don't think getting all these things right is easy at all and if I were a counterfeiter I would spend a lot more time on easier targets like stamps.

[BB-Gun]

This one can fool a lot of new fans. It is the right size and looks good. Just like the Spiderman reprints: sometimes they're too good.

[markseifert]

If they can counterfeit a dollar bill then they can counterfeit a comic. It wouldn't be all that easy to do as you have to find the right paper stock for both the cover and contents and then recreate the artwork for both and produce accurate colors. I don't think getting all these things right is easy at all and if I were a counterfeiter I would spend a lot more time on easier targets like stamps.

 

Yeah. With the same skill set it would be (and probably is) much easier to counterfeit a piece of original art and given the secrecy of the high end market easier to get away with it.

 

Re Roy's earlier comment about provenance enhancing desirability, I think even on non-pedigree books we are heading towards that. Sooner or later, someone's going to create an opt-in registry that tracks a book's history.

[Weird Paper]

I dont know if this has been discussed here before. Every item that is valuable will be faked if its worthwhile (art is the best example). Its just a matter how high are the costs of producing the fake and whats left for profit. Now with the million dollar barrier beeing broken on the top books do you think this will happen? Is it technically possible (to find the old paper stock etc.). Seems to me its not that difficult.

 

If they can counterfeit a dollar bill then they can counterfeit a comic. It wouldn't be all that easy to do as you have to find the right paper stock for both the cover and contents and then recreate the artwork for both and produce accurate colors. I don't think getting all these things right is easy at all and if I were a counterfeiter I would spend a lot more time on easier targets like stamps.

 

A good art forger uses paints and substrates identical to that of the original. For a million-plus dollar upside somebody with the right set of skills could refurbish a vintage webpress and recreate the process, starting with scanning a printed book and stripping it down digitally to the equivalent of black and white line art. Then they cut color in the same way it was done back in the day, using the same palette and formulations. Create the separations... burn plates... formulate inks identical to those used in 1938. This is not inventing anything new.

Print... examine... tweak. Once you have ten or so perfect copies, age them with temperature and light extremes. Would it pass CGC? Who knows. Do they actively examine every tone of every page of a key book? Is forgery even a real consideration with them? It's not a matter of can it be done, it's only a matter of when will it be done.

Let me say, I would never do this. I enjoy not being a criminal. But, I've been in the graphics business all my adult life, so I have considered how it could be done.