Amazing Spiderman 313 Cover - Hammers at $71,200 on Ebay

[blowout]

Tough one. what do you think Stephen? 40 - 50 range?

 

I can't see it below 25 or above 75

 

Yeah, probably somewhere in the 40-50K range would be my guess. Its importance is apparent, however I suspect that there will be less and less interest in the series/character as time goes by. In fact, I think there's less interest each year. The same is not true of TMNT, which continues to have a stake in popular culture even to today, and could possibly attract new generations of young fans as time goes by.

 

Hari

 

 

Sad to say, I also believe interest in Cerebus will fade with time. And in turn, value in related collectibles will fade as well. It's inevitable.

 

TMNT, on the other hand, was purchased last year by Viacom/Paramount/Nickelodeon. They intend to exploit the property to the fullest. They hope it will be for them what Mikey Mouse is to Disney and Bugs Bunny is to Warner Brothers.

 

Although I don't believe there was more than one buyer at the time (or even now) for the TMNT #1 art at $250K, that doesn't mean I don't believe it may eventually turn out to be a very shrewd purchase.

 

If there's no crash, of course:P

 

Well, if Dave Sim does still have the cover to Cerebus #1 and is reading this thread, now is the time to sell!

 

Does anyone think he would part with it if offered $50K?

[Bronty]

How much do you guys think the Cover to ASM 324 would bring.

 

Pros :

It's an ASM core title cover.

It's a Todd Mcfarlane Cover

It's got a fairly major Marvel Villain on the cover. (Sabretooth's popularity was HUGE about 15 years ago but has dwindled in more recent years partially due to the they have turned Wolverine into).

 

Cons:

Where the hell is Spider-Man?! You only see a partial image of his hands.

Sabretooth really isn't a Spider-Man villain.

Where the hell is Spider-Man?!

 

So no Spider-Man on an Mcfarlane ASM cover, how much do you think this one would go?

 

great question. as a pro I'd add that its a pretty cool rendition of sabertooth - ie its a nice image

 

Let me throw out my completely unknowledgeable and uninformed guess based on no facts or market research whatsoever. 20k? Anybody else?

 

It would sell for more than $20K. Probably a lot more. Off the top of my head:

 

1. In the case of a private sale...dealers will use the #313 sale as a comp and price it in that neighborhood. Then it's a matter of negotiating. No matter what, the final price will be closer to $71K than $20K.

 

2. If it shows up for auction (via eBay or Heritage)...seems to me there's a core group of McFarlane art owners who will make sure no ASM covers sell "cheap", to keep perceived market value up.

 

3. Even if #2 doesn't happen, there's likely enough real demand anyway to drive the price well beyond $20K. I saw first-hand McFarlane's effect on 90s-era fanboys. Those guys are going to be around awhile.

 

This is all if there's no crash in the hobby. I referenced Gene's doom-and-gloom predictions earlier in this thread...I wasn't joking about that. If a crash happens, throw everything I just said out the window. Although given the typical profile of the high-end McFarlane collector, that segment will probably survive. As with everything, time will tell.

 

I was talking about an ebay sale. I guess I can understand 20k being low but if 313 is 70 I can't see this being more than 40, 45... ie at best in the middle between 20 and 70. I mean wouldn't you agree?

[Bronty]

Tough one. what do you think Stephen? 40 - 50 range?

 

I can't see it below 25 or above 75

 

Yeah, probably somewhere in the 40-50K range would be my guess. Its importance is apparent, however I suspect that there will be less and less interest in the series/character as time goes by. In fact, I think there's less interest each year. The same is not true of TMNT, which continues to have a stake in popular culture even to today, and could possibly attract new generations of young fans as time goes by.

 

Hari

 

 

Sad to say, I also believe interest in Cerebus will fade with time. And in turn, value in related collectibles will fade as well. It's inevitable.

 

TMNT, on the other hand, was purchased last year by Viacom/Paramount/Nickelodeon. They intend to exploit the property to the fullest. They hope it will be for them what Mikey Mouse is to Disney and Bugs Bunny is to Warner Brothers.

 

Although I don't believe there was more than one buyer at the time (or even now) for the TMNT #1 art at $250K, that doesn't mean I don't believe it may eventually turn out to be a very shrewd purchase.

 

 

probably was only one buyer for the book at 250k, but I bet there are multiple buyers for the cover at 75 or 100k

[pinupcartoonguy]

How much do you guys think the Cover to ASM 324 would bring.

 

Pros :

It's an ASM core title cover.

It's a Todd Mcfarlane Cover

It's got a fairly major Marvel Villain on the cover. (Sabretooth's popularity was HUGE about 15 years ago but has dwindled in more recent years partially due to the they have turned Wolverine into).

 

Cons:

Where the hell is Spider-Man?! You only see a partial image of his hands.

Sabretooth really isn't a Spider-Man villain.

Where the hell is Spider-Man?!

 

So no Spider-Man on an Mcfarlane ASM cover, how much do you think this one would go?

 

great question. as a pro I'd add that its a pretty cool rendition of sabertooth - ie its a nice image

 

Let me throw out my completely unknowledgeable and uninformed guess based on no facts or market research whatsoever. 20k? Anybody else?

 

It would sell for more than $20K. Probably a lot more. Off the top of my head:

 

1. In the case of a private sale...dealers will use the #313 sale as a comp and price it in that neighborhood. Then it's a matter of negotiating. No matter what, the final price will be closer to $71K than $20K.

 

2. If it shows up for auction (via eBay or Heritage)...seems to me there's a core group of McFarlane art owners who will make sure no ASM covers sell "cheap", to keep perceived market value up.

 

3. Even if #2 doesn't happen, there's likely enough real demand anyway to drive the price well beyond $20K. I saw first-hand McFarlane's effect on 90s-era fanboys. Those guys are going to be around awhile.

 

This is all if there's no crash in the hobby. I referenced Gene's doom-and-gloom predictions earlier in this thread...I wasn't joking about that. If a crash happens, throw everything I just said out the window. Although given the typical profile of the high-end McFarlane collector, that segment will probably survive. As with everything, time will tell.

 

I was talking about an ebay sale. I guess I can understand 20k being low but if 313 is 70 I can't see this being more than 40, 45... ie at best in the middle between 20 and 70. I mean wouldn't you agree?

 

I could see it being on the lower side. A good case in point is the recent Miller Daredevil covers on Heritage, where one went for a ton and the other a relatively modest amount.

[Nexus]

How much do you guys think the Cover to ASM 324 would bring.

 

Pros :

It's an ASM core title cover.

It's a Todd Mcfarlane Cover

It's got a fairly major Marvel Villain on the cover. (Sabretooth's popularity was HUGE about 15 years ago but has dwindled in more recent years partially due to the they have turned Wolverine into).

 

Cons:

Where the hell is Spider-Man?! You only see a partial image of his hands.

Sabretooth really isn't a Spider-Man villain.

Where the hell is Spider-Man?!

 

So no Spider-Man on an Mcfarlane ASM cover, how much do you think this one would go?

 

great question. as a pro I'd add that its a pretty cool rendition of sabertooth - ie its a nice image

 

Let me throw out my completely unknowledgeable and uninformed guess based on no facts or market research whatsoever. 20k? Anybody else?

 

It would sell for more than $20K. Probably a lot more. Off the top of my head:

 

1. In the case of a private sale...dealers will use the #313 sale as a comp and price it in that neighborhood. Then it's a matter of negotiating. No matter what, the final price will be closer to $71K than $20K.

 

2. If it shows up for auction (via eBay or Heritage)...seems to me there's a core group of McFarlane art owners who will make sure no ASM covers sell "cheap", to keep perceived market value up.

 

3. Even if #2 doesn't happen, there's likely enough real demand anyway to drive the price well beyond $20K. I saw first-hand McFarlane's effect on 90s-era fanboys. Those guys are going to be around awhile.

 

This is all if there's no crash in the hobby. I referenced Gene's doom-and-gloom predictions earlier in this thread...I wasn't joking about that. If a crash happens, throw everything I just said out the window. Although given the typical profile of the high-end McFarlane collector, that segment will probably survive. As with everything, time will tell.

 

I was talking about an ebay sale. I guess I can understand 20k being low but if 313 is 70 I can't see this being more than 40, 45... ie at best in the middle between 20 and 70. I mean wouldn't you agree?

 

OK, but even so, still considerably more than $20K.

[J.Sid]

Re: ASM324

 

I'll chime in with $31k (McFarlane didn't draw the issue, so less people read/remember/love it)*

 

 

 

 

 

*that is, if there's no crash in the hobby

[MyNameIsLegion]

Ruben i can't believe that you actually feel that John Byrne just happened to be on a popular storyline... that must be one of the funniest comment i have read in a while. Krazy Kat??? Little Nemo? or Raymond Flash Gordon?? If i ever have a longing to collect something that artistically TO ME is as fun as listening to elevator music then i will let you know.

 

It always amazes me how upset people get about hearing someone else's opinion. For the record I loved the Byrne/Austin X-Men stuff. I read and re-read it. Loved the story and the artwork as well. My point for those that missed it is that there is so much nostalgia tied up in those pages that you don't know where the enthusiasm to collect those pages originates from. If nostagia was completely removed, would they be even 1/2 as popular? 1/4 as popular? Who knows. IMO, they wouldn't be.

 

I'm sure you threw in the dig at the older stuff just to get on my nerves. I could care less as that is just your opinion and as far as I'm concerned an uninformed one. Those guys (+ Foster Tarzan and Prince Val) were the poineers of the industry. They did things that are still being copied today and as far as Herriman and McCay are concerned, they did things that if someone tried them today would still be considered groundbreaking. I'm glad you think they're like elevator music. One less person to complete against.

 

 

 

Pretty much every response in this thread has reaffirmed what you and I have been saying. Even when they admit outright that "I loved McFarlane Spidey when I was 15, he was just soooo rad dude!" and now that I'm 35 with trust fund money to away I can drop 75K on a cover. Well duh! And did Todd create Spidey? No.

 

Are they climbing over each other to drop that kinda coin on an Infinity Inc. cover drawn by Todd? No. If it isn't one of about 3 dozen Marvel books with costumed heroes on the page, they could care less. There's a McFarlane Spidey page that a guy's been trying to flip for a few months on Ebay and Comiclink right now for $1600, down from 2k, and no one's scrambling for it, cuz it's Peter and MJ sitting in a limo. No Spidey, No Wolvie, No Hulk, No sale.

 

I thought Todd was so great, so innovative, so rare and revolutionary? Oh you just want McFarlane rendered shots of costumed heroes designed and created by the likes of Kirby and Ditko. Well why didn't you just say so in the first place?

 

If Todd was selling Spawn art, there'd be some commotion I imagine, but nothing approaching the Spidey market, or do we just have to wait for the 12 year-olds who saw Spawn in 1992 to come of age? They're not as educated in the medium to realize how highly derivative all the Image dreck was, and that Spawn was an amalgam of Spidey and Batman.

 

About the only thing I can recall that passed for creative outta the bunch was Sam Keith's The Maxx, and that wasn't entirely unique either. Oy vey. Look in the mirror, drop the cognitive dissonance and rationalizations. The Image guys stood on the shoulders of giants, and reaped far greater reward than their predecessors on the thinnest of resumes. How did that happen? A combination of nostalgia and working with iconic properties.

 

[Nexus]

Tough one. what do you think Stephen? 40 - 50 range?

 

I can't see it below 25 or above 75

 

Yeah, probably somewhere in the 40-50K range would be my guess. Its importance is apparent, however I suspect that there will be less and less interest in the series/character as time goes by. In fact, I think there's less interest each year. The same is not true of TMNT, which continues to have a stake in popular culture even to today, and could possibly attract new generations of young fans as time goes by.

 

Hari

 

 

Sad to say, I also believe interest in Cerebus will fade with time. And in turn, value in related collectibles will fade as well. It's inevitable.

 

TMNT, on the other hand, was purchased last year by Viacom/Paramount/Nickelodeon. They intend to exploit the property to the fullest. They hope it will be for them what Mikey Mouse is to Disney and Bugs Bunny is to Warner Brothers.

 

Although I don't believe there was more than one buyer at the time (or even now) for the TMNT #1 art at $250K, that doesn't mean I don't believe it may eventually turn out to be a very shrewd purchase.

 

 

probably was only one buyer for the book at 250k, but I bet there are multiple buyers for the cover at 75 or 100k

 

Maybe. For sure a bigger pool of potential bidders for anything at $75K than $250K.

 

However, even at $75K-100K (and there's a huge difference between $75K and $100K), I really wonder just how many current OA collectors would be interested at that level (although enough for it to sell). We all know who the BSDs are in the hobby and what they're into. I happen to believe the TMNT #1 cover is hugely important to the Copper Age, but not sure how many BSDs care.

 

I don't get the sense that any of the BSDs see much from the 80s independent scene as true "blue chip" material worthy of a $75K-100K price tag. The one exception (besides TMNT #1) I can think of is *maybe* the best Dave Stevens art. But for the most part, interest at that level is limited to Big Two superhero stuff.

 

Anyway, like 90% of this thread, it's all just speculation until it happens.

[tth2]

Ruben i can't believe that you actually feel that John Byrne just happened to be on a popular storyline... that must be one of the funniest comment i have read in a while. Krazy Kat??? Little Nemo? or Raymond Flash Gordon?? If i ever have a longing to collect something that artistically TO ME is as fun as listening to elevator music then i will let you know.

 

It always amazes me how upset people get about hearing someone else's opinion. For the record I loved the Byrne/Austin X-Men stuff. I read and re-read it. Loved the story and the artwork as well. My point for those that missed it is that there is so much nostalgia tied up in those pages that you don't know where the enthusiasm to collect those pages originates from. If nostagia was completely removed, would they be even 1/2 as popular? 1/4 as popular? Who knows. IMO, they wouldn't be.

 

I'm sure you threw in the dig at the older stuff just to get on my nerves. I could care less as that is just your opinion and as far as I'm concerned an uninformed one. Those guys (+ Foster Tarzan and Prince Val) were the poineers of the industry. They did things that are still being copied today and as far as Herriman and McCay are concerned, they did things that if someone tried them today would still be considered groundbreaking. I'm glad you think they're like elevator music. One less person to complete against.

 

 

pretty much every response in this thread has reaffirmed what you and I have been saying. Even when they admit outright that "I loved McFarlane Spidey when I was 15, he was just soooo rad dude!" and now that I'm 35 with trust fund money to away I can drop 75K on a cover. Well duh! And did Todd create Spidey? No. Are they climbing over each other to drop that kinda coin on an Infinity Inc. cover drawn by Todd? No. If it isn't one of about 3 dozen Marvel books with costumed heroes on the page, they could care less. There's a McFarlane Spidey page that a guy's been trying to flip for a few months on Ebay and Comiclink right now for $1600, down from 2k, and no one's scrambling for it, cuz it's Peter and MJ sitting in a limo. No Spidey, No Wolvie, No Hulk, No sale. I thought Todd was so great, so innovative, so rare and revolutionary? Oh you just want McFarlane rendered shots of costumed heroes designed and created by the likes of Kirby and Ditko. Well why didn't you just say so in the first place? If Todd was selling Spawn art, there'd be some commotion I imagine, but nothing approaching the Spidey market, or do we just have to wait for the 12 year-olds who saw Spawn in 1992 to come of age? They're not as educated in the medium to realize how highly derivative all the Image dreck was, and that Spawn was an amalgam of Spidey and Batman. About the only thing I can recall that passed for creative outta the bunch was Sam Keith's The Maxx, and that wasn't entirely unique either. Oy vey. Look in the mirror, drop the cognitive dissonance and rationalizations. The Image guys stood on the shoulders of giants, and reaped far greater reward than their predecessors on the thinnest of resumes. How did that happen? A combination of nostalgia and working with iconic properties.

You keep making it sound as if people who like McFarlane and other Image artists are dissing the older artists by doing so.

 

Why does it have to be a zero-sum game? Why can't people like McFarlane and also like Kirby/Ditko, etc.?

 

By the way, Kirby and Ditko art with their most famous superheroes goes for a lot more than other art done by them. So it's not like ALL art by the greats goes for mega bucks either.

 

Finally, please consider using that innovation known as the paragraph break.

[MyNameIsLegion]

Ruben i can't believe that you actually feel that John Byrne just happened to be on a popular storyline... that must be one of the funniest comment i have read in a while. Krazy Kat??? Little Nemo? or Raymond Flash Gordon?? If i ever have a longing to collect something that artistically TO ME is as fun as listening to elevator music then i will let you know.

 

It always amazes me how upset people get about hearing someone else's opinion. For the record I loved the Byrne/Austin X-Men stuff. I read and re-read it. Loved the story and the artwork as well. My point for those that missed it is that there is so much nostalgia tied up in those pages that you don't know where the enthusiasm to collect those pages originates from. If nostagia was completely removed, would they be even 1/2 as popular? 1/4 as popular? Who knows. IMO, they wouldn't be.

 

I'm sure you threw in the dig at the older stuff just to get on my nerves. I could care less as that is just your opinion and as far as I'm concerned an uninformed one. Those guys (+ Foster Tarzan and Prince Val) were the poineers of the industry. They did things that are still being copied today and as far as Herriman and McCay are concerned, they did things that if someone tried them today would still be considered groundbreaking. I'm glad you think they're like elevator music. One less person to complete against.

 

 

 

Pretty much every response in this thread has reaffirmed what you and I have been saying. Even when they admit outright that "I loved McFarlane Spidey when I was 15, he was just soooo rad dude!" and now that I'm 35 with trust fund money to away I can drop 75K on a cover. Well duh! And did Todd create Spidey? No.

 

Are they climbing over each other to drop that kinda coin on an Infinity Inc. cover drawn by Todd? No. If it isn't one of about 3 dozen Marvel books with costumed heroes on the page, they could care less. There's a McFarlane Spidey page that a guy's been trying to flip for a few months on Ebay and Comiclink right now for $1600, down from 2k, and no one's scrambling for it, cuz it's Peter and MJ sitting in a limo. No Spidey, No Wolvie, No Hulk, No sale.

 

I thought Todd was so great, so innovative, so rare and revolutionary? Oh you just want McFarlane rendered shots of costumed heroes designed and created by the likes of Kirby and Ditko. Well why didn't you just say so in the first place?

 

If Todd was selling Spawn art, there'd be some commotion I imagine, but nothing approaching the Spidey market, or do we just have to wait for the 12 year-olds who saw Spawn in 1992 to come of age? They're not as educated in the medium to realize how highly derivative all the Image dreck was, and that Spawn was an amalgam of Spidey and Batman.

 

About the only thing I can recall that passed for creative outta the bunch was Sam Keith's The Maxx, and that wasn't entirely unique either. Oy vey. Look in the mirror, drop the cognitive dissonance and rationalizations. The Image guys stood on the shoulders of giants, and reaped far greater reward than their predecessors on the thinnest of resumes. How did that happen? A combination of nostalgia and working with iconic properties.

 

You keep making it sound as if people who like McFarlane and other Image artists are dissing the older artists by doing so.

 

Why does it have to be a zero-sum game? Why can't people like McFarlane and also like Kirby/Ditko, etc.?

 

By the way, Kirby and Ditko art with their most famous superheroes goes for a lot more than other art done by them. So it's not like ALL art by the greats goes for mega bucks either.

 

Finally, please consider using that innovation known as the paragraph break.

 

Fixed that for ya. sheesh.

 

It's not Zero sum, but if you've been reading the same thread that Ruben and I have, some seem to imply that. And any suggestion that McFarlane art that went for 75k somehow legitimizes Todd's ascension to the ranks of Raymond, Hogarth, Kirby, et al. is smoking crack, or they have a financial stake in that claim. Otherwise, it's an open and shut case that the Spidey 313 cover sitting next to a few Raymond Flash Gordon's strips isn't even a conversation we should waste or breath over.

 

If you think that Spidey cover is a better piece of art than the Raymond, and should fetch a higher price, you shouldn't be allowed to drive, vote or walk with scissors. If you just really LOVE that cover cuz your favorite Aunt Petunia gave it to you when you got your tonsils taken out in the 4th grade. Peachy. THAT'S called nostalgia. Recognize it for what it is, and what it ain't, and it's definitely not that Todd McFarlane is the second coming of Rembrandt. That my point, that's Ruben's point.

 

 

 

 

[jjonahjameson1]

Tough one. what do you think Stephen? 40 - 50 range?

 

I can't see it below 25 or above 75

 

Yeah, probably somewhere in the 40-50K range would be my guess. Its importance is apparent, however I suspect that there will be less and less interest in the series/character as time goes by. In fact, I think there's less interest each year. The same is not true of TMNT, which continues to have a stake in popular culture even to today, and could possibly attract new generations of young fans as time goes by.

 

Hari

 

 

Sad to say, I also believe interest in Cerebus will fade with time. And in turn, value in related collectibles will fade as well. It's inevitable.

 

TMNT, on the other hand, was purchased last year by Viacom/Paramount/Nickelodeon. They intend to exploit the property to the fullest. They hope it will be for them what Mikey Mouse is to Disney and Bugs Bunny is to Warner Brothers.

 

Although I don't believe there was more than one buyer at the time (or even now) for the TMNT #1 art at $250K, that doesn't mean I don't believe it may eventually turn out to be a very shrewd purchase.

 

If there's no crash, of course:P

 

Well, if Dave Sim does still have the cover to Cerebus #1 and is reading this thread, now is the time to sell!

 

Does anyone think he would part with it if offered $50K?

 

Definately wouldn't part with it for $50K.

[CollectingFool]

If you think that Spidey cover is a better piece of art than the Raymond, and should fetch a higher price, you shouldn't be allowed to drive, vote or walk with scissors. If you just really LOVE that cover cuz your favorite Aunt Petunia gave it to you when you got your tonsils taken out in the 4th grade. Peachy. THAT'S called nostalgia. Recognize it for what it is, and what it ain't, and it's definitely not that Todd McFarlane is the second coming of Rembrandt. That my point, that's Ruben's point.

 

Well, yes that is my point, just stated a bit more aggressively than I said it. This stuff does get people's blood boiling huh?

 

 

[dem1138]

All I have to say is that this is the best thread I've read in the Original Art forum in quite some time.

[MyNameIsLegion]

All I have to say is that this is the best thread I've read in the Original Art forum in quite some time.

 

No argument there Mr. Premium Gallery Owner! (thumbs u (and you're not the only one that signed up as a result of this thread either!)

 

[Timely]

There are a lot of kids that grew up on TMNT...and still are. I've never heard any kid say, "I grew up on Cerebus."

 

 

 

[Bronty]

as far as comics go I grew up on cerebus more than tmnt

 

I don't think the statement as you posed it is really fair because those kids are talking about tmnt cartoons, movies, games, and backpacks not comics

[Timely]

That was kinda my point.

[tth2]

Finally, please consider using that innovation known as the paragraph break.

 

Fixed that for ya. sheesh.

(thumbs u

[rob_react]

All I have to say is that this is the best thread I've read in the Original Art forum in quite some time.

 

It really is. I've read a disturbing percentage of the posts in this lengthy thread.

[rob_react]

These days Cerebus is esoteric, even inside the hobby. Do a quick poll of people in comics general and I'd bet that less than 10% read cerebus for any length of time. What percentage have seen a TMNT movie/cartoon, played a video game or read the comics?