1985-1989 Coin Market = 2000-2004 Comic Market?

[tth2]

DC Silver Age Horror, Showcase or Brave and Bold dude. Books. Everyone seems to love SA Marvels. Don't matter what [embarrassing lack of self control] title there is. Stan Lee can Excelsior himself.

They weren`t included in the data that created the graphs because there weren`t enough regular transactions in any DC issue to make it a reliable index component.

[benz]

I do not think rarity is the answer to a crash.

 

Trying to campare comics to other hobbies is not viable. Sure you can learn about certain patterns of ups and downs but coins and comics are two different animals. Nostalgia in the coin market is almost nil. No 70 year-old person whips out a 60 year old Mercury Dime from his pocket and remembers with longing the day he spent it on a malt. As a former coin collector there is only so much fascination to be had with them. Sure they are shiny, made of precious metal and are historical in regards to the past, but there is little passion.

 

Comics are pieces of art. Each one is different. There are several ages and dozens of collecting sub-sets.

 

Timely

 

 

VERY TRUE and I agree 100%...now i can continue buying funny books named Fantastic Four issue 1

[comicworm]

Once again my fellow collectors decide to show me just how much they suffer from "tunnel vision".

 

Morgan dollars were mass produced in the tens of millions! Show a comic book that has this same type of high "print" run? Even Action Comics (the #1 selling comic at the time) never had a print run this high (not even close)!

 

So again-my fellow collectors are comparing apples to oranges. Because this is a LOGICAL post, I really don't expect anyone to respond to it!

 

[the blob]

yes, but how many morgans are in MS 66, 67, etc? They would have had to have been put away in storage in ideal conditions. granted, the same can be said about comics. OTOH, one would think that coin collecting may have a wider population base than comic collecting (granted, the boom/bust in coins had nothing to do with "collecting", it happened when they started treating them like stocks and bonds)

 

Most circulated Morgans are just worth a few bucks, mainly for the silver value. I know I've gotten some on ebay for like $3-5 and I was probably paying too much.

[comicworm]

You answered your own question. How many comics are in 9.6+ condition from pre 1966?

 

Yes, Morgans are cheap-but if you have them graded in MS-64 or above-you will pay a minimum of $50 a coin-still to this day...

 

That being said comics never had a "mutual fund" either...

 

(in reference to the laughable Merrill Lynch Athena Fund)

[originalisbest]

Heh! Timulty, if you think comics won't go the way of coins, you'd better hope for the opposite - coins have been on FIRE since 2000, vast increases - for the "right" coins. Common drek, that was common drek 20 years ago and continues to be today, remains fun to collect for fun, but not too exciting price-wise. An experienced collector knows the difference, and "expects" different things from different items.

[comicworm]

First, if you think I'm a shill-you better go back many months ago and read some of my other posts! I am the most HATED man on the CGC forums! One: I don't think pressing is a big deal. Second: I do not like PGX. and I could go on, but lets stick to the subject....

 

 

You again dodged my initial inquiry. Again-comics were alwyas printed in the thousands-coins were made in the millions (most) comparing the wonderful world of graded coincs to graded comics is apples to oranges. Now if we ever get a mutual fund (much like the Merril Lynch Athena fund), then you can start comparing the two! Did I say that comics will never go the way of the graded coin-absolutely not! Even the most common graded coin (i.e. Morgan dollar) in average to good grade (i.e. MS-64 or better) sells for $50 still to this day!

[originalisbest]

Not quite sure what your point is, but, I haven't read the whole thread (or really care to) - but as to the Morgan, it depends on the date as to how desirable it is.

 

I can say one thing with certainty: you will NEVER "retire" on the ownership of a single, gem 1881-S prooflike Morgan. BUT if you are adept at wheeling and dealing in many of them, over a period of years, yep, you could become a rich sucka. All dependent on your trading skills.

[Aman619]

hey, did you guys slip over the fence or something? What the hellls a Morgan?? Youre like 2 refugees from the Coinworld in here.

[Norrin_Radd]

hey, did you guys slip over the fence or something? What the hellls a Morgan?? Youre like 2 refugees from the Coinworld in here.

 

There are dual-collectors on this board. I still have a few Morgans. Not as nice as this, but here's a sample pic...

 

[Alex DeLarge-migration]

hey, did you guys slip over the fence or something? What the hellls a Morgan?? Youre like 2 refugees from the Coinworld in here.

 

There are dual-collectors on this board. I still have a few Morgans. Not as nice as this, but here's a sample pic...

 

 

Hey NR... that looks nice, I know diddley-squat about coins, but I'd buy that for a Dollar!...to coin a phrase!

[joe_collector]

hey, did you guys slip over the fence or something? What the hellls a Morgan?? Youre like 2 refugees from the Coinworld in here.

 

Call out the dogs! Get yer guns!

[Aman619]

hey, did you guys slip over the fence or something? What the hellls a Morgan?? Youre like 2 refugees from the Coinworld in here.

 

There are dual-collectors on this board. I still have a few Morgans. Not as nice as this, but here's a sample pic...

 

 

So a Morgan is a 124 year old coin?

and they're common as dirt?

boy THATs depressing isnt it? How long does it take for a coin to get old AND rare?? Or is it simply because, unlike all other collectibles, coins have always been worth something in their own right, and nobody's mother ever threw them out??

[trevorlsmith]

So a Morgan is a 124 year old coin?

and they're common as dirt?

boy THATs depressing isnt it? How long does it take for a coin to get old AND rare?? Or is it simply because, unlike all other collectibles, coins have always been worth something in their own right, and nobody's mother ever threw them out??

 

Just speculating here, not a coin collector, but I would have to think that the intrinsic value of coins ensures that they will survive in large quantities.

 

I would also think that coins survive in pretty good condition. Compared to comics, they are pretty hard to damage.

[joe_collector]

Or is it simply because, unlike all other collectibles, coins have always been worth something in their own right, and nobody's mother ever threw them out??

 

It's at least partially due to coin grading being around the longest and therefore, provides the longest time for the Census to fill up.

 

Just wait til 2020 and see what the CGC Census looks like.

[Norrin_Radd]

Or is it simply because, unlike all other collectibles, coins have always been worth something in their own right, and nobody's mother ever threw them out??

 

It's at least partially due to coin grading being around the longest and therefore, provides the longest time for the Census to fill up.

 

Just wait til 2020 and see what the CGC Census looks like.

 

Sarcasm deleted by Norinn Radd

[joe_collector]

Yes. I'm sure it will be just chokefull of HG copies of rare GA/SA comics.

 

I think there will be more than today, especially all those "rare" Silver Age books.

 

Plus, the really common key issues like Hulk 181 or ASM 129 will absolutely mushroom given another 15 years of constant submitting.

[originalisbest]

Yah, I'm sorry, I'm one of those bi-collectors, but I'm tryin' to earn my comic-stripes by posting more in the GA horror thread. Hey, I don't do much SA but at least I can tell Galactus from the Watcher!

 

Anyhoo, in general the notion that coins (made of metal) are longer lasting than comics, absolutely true - but coins get worn down and lost in commerce, so there is attrition - also it seems like about 98.9% of the public thinks it's a great idea to scrub the heck out of them (including me, as a kid!) so a lot of value is lost that way - imagine collectors thinking it "fine" to xacto the heck out of their comics, cutting off all the covers so they could be kept flat and in good shape.

 

As far as desirability of the sample pic 1881 Morgan - very nice coin, and usually when they look that nice, it's an 1881-S. So many of these never saw circulation, but sat in government vaults, largely up until we went off the silver standard in 1964. At that time, they were snapped up at a modest premium by collectors, so the vast majority stayed in NICE shape. Nowadays a super gemmy 1881-S might go to a couple 200-250 bucks, most of the uncs are more like 30-60 coins, a few even nicer than that might be worth more, but frankly they're all darned easy to find, due to the vast supplies that survived. The fact that so many Morgans (of certain dates) in attractive shape survived resulted in a "perfect storm" of pretty coins, ample supply and marketing savvy dealers, that they absolutely grew in popularity as collector favorites from the '60's on. Previously, '30's-50's, few wanted to try and collect dollars by date and mintmark - too expensive; wheat cent boards and Buffalo nickels offered collecting fun for a lot less (of course, these are still popular to collect.)

 

However, it's all luck as to which dates survived. If not for all the bags of '81-S Morgans left untouched, today it might be an acclaimed rarity in nice uncirculated shape. Make the coin pictured an 1883-S instead of an 1881-S, and watch the asking price go from $250 to $30,000. As you might surmise, no bags of '83-S dollars were saved, and most all slipped into circulation. But that sticker-shock figure is for a coin theoretically struck, caught in a velvet glove when ejected from the hopper and placed in a air-free evironment on a velvet pillow and not messed with until the present day. In reality, most are worth about $15-20 worn, a nice one with only a hint of wear, about $175. So condition, supply and demand are everything with coins - not absolute age. Current price trends bear this out:

 

1881-S in gem, $250.

1883-S in gem, $30,000.

1884-S in gem, $275,000.

1885-S in gem, $2,000.

1893-S in gem (the king), about $400,000.

 

- and that's not even getting into the intracacies of prooflikes. But the vast, vast majority of Morgans held by average guy who "found 'em in Granpas drawer" are nuthin' special - including what I had as a kid, a couple of '81-S in circ worth $6-10 each, same with the handful of '22's (another severely common coin.) Of course it was common sense to me that my coins were valuable treasures - until I saw what identical (but better shape) ones were selling for!

 

At the same time, you never know what someone will have. My dad told the classic "little old lady" (who was a friend of a friend) that I could tell her what her handful of coins were worth - and so I could, practically without seeing them: a handful of wheat cents and an "old silver dollar." Well, I was right on the wheat cents - all 1940's worth perhaps 2-3 cents each. And so I pluck out the dollar from her change purse - nice, old and dirty grey (well, at least it wasn't cleaned, a big plus!) but before I could try and tell her that this is worth about $6, I noticed the date was 1893. Well, the coin's already a winner no matter what, but slowly I flipped it over (c'mon "S", 1893-S and this coin's worth about $3,000 (at the time, now it would be more) - but it wasn't an "S". Bummer. It was, however, an 1893-CC, in a NICE original VF, worth about $250-300 (at the time.) What a find for having ONE Morgan - by rights it should've been yet another '81-S.

 

I put it in a proper holder for her and told her to keep doing what she had been - leave it alone! She was pleased, and I imagine, still has it. Not having a lotta $$$ on me at the time (high school), were that to happen today, I'd buy it off her. Have to ask dad if he recalls her name.

 

Now aren't you sorry you got me started?

[delekkerste]

You again dodged my initial inquiry. Again-comics were alwyas printed in the thousands-coins were made in the millions (most) comparing the wonderful world of graded coincs to graded comics is apples to oranges.

 

At the risk of stating the obvious, just about everyone on the planet owns and/or has used a coin. Money is universally coveted; comics are not. Money is essential; comics are not. Almost all people will be interested in money the rest of their lives; relatively very few people in the world are interested in comics at any point in their lives. People who make a lot of money may want to buy historical money with some of their fortune - not a big leap of imagination required there. Most of these people would have no reason to shell out $2.99 for a new comic, let alone $50K for a highest graded back issue. There is a much larger potential market for coins, even though there were more of them created.

 

That's not to say that I think coins are a particularly good investment here either. Certain conditions foster a positive climate for investing in collectibles and I think that, on balance, these conditions are no longer present (or are fading) after a long secular bull market. Can I imagine some scenarios where they would continue to increase in value? Sure, but I think these are of much lower probability. Furthermore, in those particular scenarios, I'm pretty sure there will be other asset classes that will greatly outperform collectibles (and, I don't see much reason why comics would stack up very well against other collectible asset classes, including coins, with more broad-based appeal and a better track record and historical usage of storing value). It's funny that, just when people were (again) touting comics as an investment following the beating the stock market took in the early part of this decade, they started vastly underperforming the stock market, real estate, many commodities and other asset classes.

[originalisbest]

Hey Gene! In my view, collectibles are fun to collect, but as an investment vehicle compared to other ways - they suck. While fun to collect, it should absolutely be done with discretionary income, such that "come the day" that they should be declared "worthless" (or let's say you cannot get close to what you paid for them) - if this DOESN'T cause you to sweat bullets, but rather say, "Well, I can afford to keep 'em, and I still like 'em anyway" - then you did collectibles right. No matter what they are.