Do Local Comicbook Stores need a new business model?

[the blob]

For anyone who doesn't think the digital age can very quickly take over our little world of comics, you might want to ask the recording industry what THEY think.

 

The astounding thing there was the speed with which the music retailers all folded!

 

Now sometimes I can be a bit on the pessimistic side (none of you could probably notice)... But even I thought the e-readers wouldn't reach the popularity they already have for another 5-10 years!

 

 

they got killed because they can no longer force you/us to buy a whole $13 album when all you want is one 99 cent downloadable song off that album.

 

which is sad because often some of my favorite songs off an album are not the "hits" that you would hear on the radio and decide you want to download.

 

the artists are going to (already do) feel the pinch too, although i guess they can make up for some it by performing live more. there are a lot less royalties from 2 downloads of your most popular song than selling the whole album.

[InvstmntComcSuply]

I agree though....if the print medium for comics is to remain viable, it will be because of specialty stores like LCS.

 

However, and I used to think it wouldn't happen in my lifetime, I can see a time in the next 10 years, where the technology/hardware (Ipads, Nooks, Kindles) will be cheap and readily available, and the owners of the content (Marvel, DC) will HAVE to go exlusively digital as the the print runs will no longer justify the expense of publishing on paper. The real danger of having mega-corporations hold all the licensing and intellectual property rights is that they maneuver as nimbly as a tank in a china shop. Where small publishing companies can survive on modest print runs under 10k and can adapt better to the changing environment, the Marvels and Disneys of the world can't.

 

How much revenue does Disney/Marvel generate from their comic publications anyway? (and I'm excluding TPBs here) I have to think its a drop in the bucket compared to all the licensing for video games, merchandising, movies, theme parks, etc., etc. That piece of the pie will likely continue to shrink until its no longer viable enough to eat.

 

 

 

It is interesting how a lot of the thread was about how LCS needed to be able to adapt in order to find the proper mix of product and services to maintain profitability. However, once Marvel or DC decide to pull the plug on print media (and I agree it will probably happen within the next ten years and it will likely come with little advance notice) I would hope that the LCS will have already diversified into other areas, otherwise it will be too little, too late.

[JiveTurkeyMoFo]

I agree as well, but which stores are you talking about. They are at Wal Mart, where basically everyone I know shops.

 

You must go to different Walmarts than I do, as other than Archie Digests, I have never seen a funny book prominently displayed there. They might have some hidden in a back alley, but I have yet to see one.

 

But Dale is partially right - the world has passed print media by.

 

I'm part of the world and it hasn't passed me by, and I hope to never own a kindle or shnook, or whatever they call those goofy things. When I want to read a book, it is a book, not a device.

 

But for the purposes of this discussion, which in a general sense hinges on how well LCS survive and adapt in the ever changing world, its not about us 30, 40, and 50 something guys. Rather, how is the next generation learning and utilizing technology around them. and how will that impact print medium into the future?

 

As someone that works in the school system, with every grade level from K-12, I can tell you the push to digitize EVERYTHING is well underway. (Anyone remember the scene in the last Star Trek movie, where young Spock is learning from mulitple holographic images being pushed out by a computer? Its not as far-fetched as you may think). Assessments and Instruction are going Digital....while textbooks are struggling to remain relevant. The average shelf-life of a textbook has been cut by 80% since I was in school (the 80s), as publishers have to update the content almost yearly. Struggling School Boards, already dealing with budgetary shortfalls, are looking for digital content as an alternative to the expense of textbooks.

 

So, beyond the novelty factor, what value will a print item be to someone 25 years from now who has spent their entire life learning, reading, responding, texting, in digital format? Its of the great seachanges in human history, and we're smack dab in the middle of it.

 

 

Do you happen to know the name of the company that makes the best educational software???

 

Sadly, it might not be the companies with the best product that ultimately monopolize the industry.

 

Pearson is the company that comes to mind with that statement.

[the blob]

This place reminded me of an old shop in Brooklyn called Pinocchio Discounts back in the early 80's. It was huge and packed with back issues. A woman named Bell used to own it and a friend of hers, older man, would be sitting hanging out. It was nostalgic to visit this place.

---------------

It's still there. And I'm pretty sure she is too (along with her husband, who looks older than her). Funny thing is, she's Russian and I seriously doubt she's ever read a comic, but she's been selling them for like 30 years. Her prices...some of them are o.k., but she's a bit optimistic about other stuff like VG SA Spideys and what not.

 

 

I wish I could get down there just to spend a little time poking around. You're right, it has been about 30 years! The idea that she has been around that long does show that someone can make a living doing this. She's not in the best location either. I had to walk 12 blocks in each direction twice a week. She would have everything ready, in 9.8 condition or better waiting for me in a bag with my name on it. It's good to know she's still around!

 

Judging from the # of paper bags with comics in them, I suspect she still has a lot of file customers. Also, I suspect she pays nothing for rent (due to the location), though you wonder what will happen when her lease eventually wraps up. Also, I'm not sure there's even another comic shop in Brooklyn on that side of Ocean Parkway (though there must be something in Bensonhurst or Bay Ridge I don't know about), an area that probably has a population of close to 1 million +/-. Granted, I suspect the orthodox in borough park aren't big comic collectors (though surprisingly there is a sports card collecting element in there). With that said, she's in her 60's and it's not like her kids are going to take over the shop. When she retires, that's it.

[Dale Roberts]

basically, what this thread comes down to is this....

 

Support your local comic store. Tell them how they could serve you better and maybe they will. If they don't, then they deserve to go out of business. Buy books from them. Seriously, don't sell your soul to midtown or whoever for a small percentage discount. Do you realize how little money it actually is in the overall scheme of things?

 

Seems to me I started a thread along these lines about 2 years ago....

[JiveTurkeyMoFo]

I agree as well, but which stores are you talking about. They are at Wal Mart, where basically everyone I know shops.

 

You must go to different Walmarts than I do, as other than Archie Digests, I have never seen a funny book prominently displayed there. They might have some hidden in a back alley, but I have yet to see one.

 

But Dale is partially right - the world has passed print media by.

 

I'm part of the world and it hasn't passed me by, and I hope to never own a kindle or shnook, or whatever they call those goofy things. When I want to read a book, it is a book, not a device.

 

But for the purposes of this discussion, which in a general sense hinges on how well LCS survive and adapt in the ever changing world, its not about us 30, 40, and 50 something guys. Rather, how is the next generation learning and utilizing technology around them. and how will that impact print medium into the future?

 

As someone that works in the school system, with every grade level from K-12, I can tell you the push to digitize EVERYTHING is well underway. (Anyone remember the scene in the last Star Trek movie, where young Spock is learning from mulitple holographic images being pushed out by a computer? Its not as far-fetched as you may think). Assessments and Instruction are going Digital....while textbooks are struggling to remain relevant. The average shelf-life of a textbook has been cut by 80% since I was in school (the 80s), as publishers have to update the content almost yearly. Struggling School Boards, already dealing with budgetary shortfalls, are looking for digital content as an alternative to the expense of textbooks.

 

So, beyond the novelty factor, what value will a print item be to someone 25 years from now who has spent their entire life learning, reading, responding, texting, in digital format? Its of the great seachanges in human history, and we're smack dab in the middle of it.

 

The instruction my 5 year old is getting in the NYC Public School system is rather paper intensive. I'm supposed to read a book a night to him. As far as I know, none of the kids are doing that reading on kindles or ipads just yet.

 

Why do Math and Science textbooks need to be updated so much other than to line the pockets of publishers? Why would anything other than a "current" history textbook need to be revised so often? Honestly, in jr. and high school in the mid-80's I'd sometimes be using testbooks from the 60's/early 70's.

 

Because 20-30 years ago, the objective was for students to learn. Today, the objective is to prepare students to take assessments and standardized tests like the FCAT. Everything in the Florida public education domain revolves around the FCAT (teacher and administrator salaries and bonuses, bonus monies to the schools that score high, etc.). The pressure to succeed is immense, and most administrators are buying in to what the sales reps are pushing (namely, that their software package, which is frequently updated, is much better able to prep students for the FCAT than an otherwise perfectly good, if somewhat dated, textbook from 2004).

 

 

[Bookery]

Seems to me I started a thread along these lines about 2 years ago....

 

Yeah... but we pay more attention to you now that you've got the whole nifty Col. Sanders thing going.

 

 

[Dale Roberts]

Seems to me I started a thread along these lines about 2 years ago....

 

Yeah... but we pay more attention to you now that you've got the whole nifty Col. Sanders thing going.

 

 

 

 

wait til you see my new white suit...

[500Club]

How much revenue does Disney/Marvel generate from their comic publications anyway? (and I'm excluding TPBs here) I have to think its a drop in the bucket compared to all the licensing for video games, merchandising, movies, theme parks, etc., etc. That piece of the pie will likely continue to shrink until its no longer viable enough to eat.

It may be more a question of how long Disney and TW want to continue to publish comics as loss leaders....

[VintageComics]

basically, what this thread comes down to is this....

 

Support your local comic store. Tell them how they could serve you better and maybe they will. If they don't, then they deserve to go out of business. Buy books from them. Seriously, don't sell your soul to midtown or whoever for a small percentage discount. Do you realize how little money it actually is in the overall scheme of things?

 

Seems to me I started a thread along these lines about 2 years ago....

 

The problem is that people want what they want but they want it as cheap as possible.

 

I'll personally pay more for atmosphere, quality and good service rather than save a few bucks. I think that I'm on the losing side though.

 

 

[passion4comics]

1- I will never buy a digital comic. Half of the joy of it is holding it and keeping it. The same reason why I will never buy a digital book.

 

2- The music industry failed (failing) for many reasons. A major reason was the RIAA and learning that you don't sue your own customer base.

 

Another reason that is often overlooked is that older bands would produce an LP (CD) with 13 songs. Of those 13 songs at least 10 were made by the band and was an art. Now you buy a CD with one hit that a professional writer wrote and a composer put to music the rest is 12 filler songs.

 

Examples: The Doors, Zep, Aerosmith, etc compared to The Black Eyed Peas. Which would you lay down your money for?

[mikephoen]

I think the print medium will survive, at least for another generation or two. We sell fairly decent numbers of the online strip reprint books, like XKCD and Penny Arcade. These are reprints of comics which are available for free online and have been for years. I can definitely see a time in this industry when the LCS is more of a place to get the deluxe print version of your favorite online content, as well as related t-shirts, posters, mugs etc.

 

Does anyone know how Japan's print comic industry is doing since the rise of the digital reader? Their comic industry is infinitely bigger than ours, and the culture tends to jump on new tech a little quicker than North America as well. It might give some indications for our short term future.

[Prince Namor]

1- I will never buy a digital comic. Half of the joy of it is holding it and keeping it. The same reason why I will never buy a digital book.

 

2- The music industry failed (failing) for many reasons. A major reason was the RIAA and learning that you don't sue your own customer base.

 

Another reason that is often overlooked is that older bands would produce an LP (CD) with 13 songs. Of those 13 songs at least 10 were made by the band and was an art. Now you buy a CD with one hit that a professional writer wrote and a composer put to music the rest is 12 filler songs.

 

Examples: The Doors, Zep, Aerosmith, etc compared to The Black Eyed Peas. Which would you lay down your money for?

 

And modern comics aren't putting out great looking covers with lame interior art and story?

Besides just the rise of digital comics, we also have to remember the increased popularity of trades, and the lack of new comic readers. It's scary.

[Bruce1971]

I think the print medium will survive, at least for another generation or two. We sell fairly decent numbers of the online strip reprint books, like XKCD and Penny Arcade. These are reprints of comics which are available for free online and have been for years. I can definitely see a time in this industry when the LCS is more of a place to get the deluxe print version of your favorite online content, as well as related t-shirts, posters, mugs etc.

 

Does anyone know how Japan's print comic industry is doing since the rise of the digital reader? Their comic industry is infinitely bigger than ours, and the culture tends to jump on new tech a little quicker than North America as well. It might give some indications for our short term future.

 

I have not been in Japan long but there is manga everywhere. Probably half the people who are reading on the trains are reading manga, the rest are either sleeping, playing with cellphones, playing PSP/DS, some I think are doing a few while sleeping.

 

I think digital manga will be a hard sell due to a few reasons. Manga books are cheap. A manga book costs about 400 yen, I am guessing a digital download would be a minimum of 200 yen. Manga is readily available, every bookstore probably has at 1000 manga books on the shelves. Digital readers may be too big to use comfortably on the trains. Trains are very busy during rush hour, I don't even see people reading newspapers and I'm not even in Tokyo. Also Japanese people are very polite, most people try to stay in their own space and will try not use something on the train if they have to stick in someone else's face.

 

North America will probably face a lot more pressure on comics(trades)/manga from digital readers due to the high prices. Manga is about twice the price it is in the Japan and trades in North America are pretty pricey so there is a lot more room for profit.

 

 

 

 

 

 

[HouseofComics.Com]

However, once Marvel or DC decide to pull the plug on print media (and I agree it will probably happen within the next ten years and it will likely come with little advance notice)

 

That's for sure! (the little to no notice part)

[500Club]

However, once Marvel or DC decide to pull the plug on print media (and I agree it will probably happen within the next ten years and it will likely come with little advance notice)

 

That's for sure! (the little to no notice part)

Yep. Reference the demise of Wizard.

[Lazyboy]

Another reason that is often overlooked is that older bands would produce an LP (CD) with 13 songs. Of those 13 songs at least 10 were made by the band and was an art. Now you buy a CD with one hit that a professional writer wrote and a composer put to music the rest is 12 filler songs.

Really?

Here's some advice: Stop listening to mess!

[HouseofComics.Com]

I like how my local store does back issues. They have about 100 magazine boxes full of $15 to $1500 books (the best stuff is consigned to them) and it's all on shelves behind a counter. So it really doesn't take up that much store space. (Berkeley is about $2 a sq ft. per month, similar to what Mike was talking about when he said $25 per year.) They get the occasional nice in-store sale but also get a strong ebay store business out of it, while only taking up a corner of the store. I think that's a good way to do it.

 

The money left on the table is that they aren't really able to sell much cheap sub-$15 1965-1980 silver and bronze.

 

Thoughts?

[ciorac]

I like how my local store does back issues. They have about 100 magazine boxes full of $15 to $1500 books (the best stuff is consigned to them) and it's all on shelves behind a counter. So it really doesn't take up that much store space. (Berkeley is about $2 a sq ft. per month, similar to what Mike was talking about when he said $25 per year.) They get the occasional nice in-store sale but also get a strong ebay store business out of it, while only taking up a corner of the store. I think that's a good way to do it.

 

The money left on the table is that they aren't really able to sell much cheap sub-$15 1965-1980 silver and bronze.

 

Thoughts?

 

Sounds marvelous to me. As long as they have signage indicating that back issues are available, it should work very well

[troydivision1]

As I write this I can say I have only read about 15 comics on my iPad.

The experience just isn't there, but for the next generation it will be this way.

 

I think the way to get to the 'next' generation would be for the LCS to develop a relationship with a movie theater manager to arrange for cross promotion when a comic book summer movie comes out.

 

When 'Captain America' opens bring stock having to do with it and make sure to keep all prices between $5-$10 and be there Friday, Saturday and Sunday. Also, any .25 that are taking up space, give them away to younger fans and give your card to the parents.