TOP SECRET restoration techniques

[Mike's Rack]

Why are comic book restoration techniques TOP SECRET? I think it is not just about the $$$'s. Those who make their living restoring comics, I can understand being proprietary. But, I am curious as to why comic restoration techniques are top secret while restoration techniques in other areas such as antique books are openly discussed. Is it because of the stigma attached to restoration in the comic book community? or Is it the nature of the medium being color and pulp that makes the experimentation process more difficult and costly? I believe that if discussion of restoration techniques was more open, you would see fewer hack jobs and perhaps remove some of the stigma of restoration. Just my $.02.

[BlowUpTheMoon]

Welcome to the Boards.

[Calamerica]

Why are comic book restoration techniques TOP SECRET? I think it is not just about the $$$'s. Those who make their living restoring comics, I can understand being proprietary. But, I am curious as to why comic restoration techniques are top secret while restoration techniques in other areas such as antique books are openly discussed. Is it because of the stigma attached to restoration in the comic book community? or Is it the nature of the medium being color and pulp that makes the experimentation process more difficult and costly? I believe that if discussion of restoration techniques was more open, you would see fewer hack jobs and perhaps remove some of the stigma of restoration. Just my $.02.

 

Just don't spend $$$ like I did - never again

 

CAL not happy with restorers

[JazzMan]

For the same reason Coke and KFC don't release their recipes.

[FFB]

Comic book restoration techniques are not top secret. It just takes a little reading or asking questions. Solvent baths, tear seals, color touch, dry cleaning, pressing, and other techniques are straightforward. They've been described and even shown step by step at various times on these boards over the years. The nuts and bolts of leaf casting can be learned with a Google search. Perfecting the leaf casting technique on comic books takes more than just a Google search, but the basic technique is straightforward. You can even find videos of it on the internet.

 

Some aspects of leaf casting on comics are trade secrets, but I don't see a problem with that and it sounds like you don't either. Most of the secrecy surrounding comic book restoration comes from people who just aren't that interested in taking the time to look for the information. But that is gradually changing, especially on these boards where so many people have tried to educate the general collecting community on the topic of restoration.

 

Why are comic book restoration techniques TOP SECRET? I think it is not just about the $$$'s. Those who make their living restoring comics, I can understand being proprietary. But, I am curious as to why comic restoration techniques are top secret while restoration techniques in other areas such as antique books are openly discussed. Is it because of the stigma attached to restoration in the comic book community? or Is it the nature of the medium being color and pulp that makes the experimentation process more difficult and costly? I believe that if discussion of restoration techniques was more open, you would see fewer hack jobs and perhaps remove some of the stigma of restoration. Just my $.02.

[rodan57]

I also believe, when done well, that it is a true craft and at times an artform.

 

Maybe this is a flamboyant analogy, but Gil Kane used paper and pencil to draw. I use paper and pencil to draw. I am not worthy to have picked up his pencil shavings.

 

He had TOP SECRET drawing techniques.

[FFB]

I also believe, when done well, that it is a true craft and at times an artform.

 

Maybe this is a flamboyant analogy, but Gil Kane used paper and pencil to draw. I use paper and pencil to draw. I am not worthy to have picked up his pencil shavings.

 

He had TOP SECRET drawing techniques.

 

Good point. We should start a thread to complain about him.

[PovertyRow]

Comic book restoration techniques are not top secret. It just takes a little reading or asking questions. Solvent baths, tear seals, color touch, dry cleaning, pressing, and other techniques are straightforward. They've been described and even shown step by step at various times on these boards over the years. The nuts and bolts of leaf casting can be learned with a Google search. Perfecting the leaf casting technique on comic books takes more than just a Google search, but the basic technique is straightforward. You can even find videos of it on the internet.

 

Quite so! The information is available, to quote Wertham, "for those who know how to look."

 

I think the perception of secrecy is in the way these techniques have been personally modified and applied by indvidual restorers. The basics are there, as Scott says, but the individually developed application methods tend to be guarded.

 

It is not unlike cooking, where recipes abound but some chefs have made their own ingredient and technique changes, which they keep secret,

[Thanos71]

Education is reserved for those who want to be educated - that is, for those willing to do the work, put in the time researching, reading, learning the book knowledge, and then applying it to the actual work.

 

I've been working in Antiquarian Book Restoration for 5 years now, and I am always learning new concepts, tecniques, and better ways of applying my craft. There have been many books read specifically on bookbinding, and a long apprenticeship as well.

 

At the beginning, a lot of the work really is trial and error. You can read about the tecnique, or be told how to do something, but until you start doing it hands on, there's no guarantee you will be able to accomplish anything.

 

If you are really interested in Comic Book Restoration, there are ways to learn about, but expecting those who have studied and worked hard at it for many years to just start explaining all the details of their craft, is unrealistic.

 

The most basic place to start, might be paper repairs. For example: I have tons of old comic books that are basically just reading copies, except a bunch of them I can't even read because when you pick them up they start to fall apart. Japan paper and wheat paste are a good place to start. Learn about paper conservation and restoration. Last time I checked, that was no secret.

[Mike's Rack]

Interesting takes. I'm not looking to step on toes or critize anyone. I was just interested in other's views on this.

[VintageComics]

Why are comic book restoration techniques TOP SECRET? I think it is not just about the $$$'s. Those who make their living restoring comics, I can understand being proprietary. But, I am curious as to why comic restoration techniques are top secret while restoration techniques in other areas such as antique books are openly discussed. Is it because of the stigma attached to restoration in the comic book community? or Is it the nature of the medium being color and pulp that makes the experimentation process more difficult and costly? I believe that if discussion of restoration techniques was more open, you would see fewer hack jobs and perhaps remove some of the stigma of restoration. Just my $.02.

 

Because these are businesses that are vying to remain competitive, run by people who earn a living...not a charity organization set up to educate people who surf the internet.

 

There's a clear business advantage to be had if someone has a technique that others don't.

 

It's not dark science, it's just chemistry, physics, experience and hard work. Those that put in the time get great results.

[Mike's Rack]

"Those who make their living restoring comics, I can understand being proprietary."

 

I understand why businesses/professionals keep these things secrets. I was looking to go a little deeper. It sounds like my perception of secrecy may be incorrect. But it appears that restoration techniques are not discussed much out in the open, even among skilled amateurs.

 

I have searched and found some interesting stuff. If I were to have a book restored or purchase a restored book, I would want to know what had been done to it and what the possible side effects are.

 

I am wondering if the perception of restoration in the comic community has anything to do the apparent secrecy.

 

[VintageComics]

"Those who make their living restoring comics, I can understand being proprietary."

 

I understand why businesses/professionals keep these things secrets. I was looking to go a little deeper. It sounds like my perception of secrecy may be incorrect. But it appears that restoration techniques are not discussed much out in the open, even among skilled amateurs.

 

I have searched and found some interesting stuff. If I were to have a book restored or purchase a restored book, I would want to know what had been done to it and what the possible side effects are.

 

I am wondering if the perception of restoration in the comic community has anything to do the apparent secrecy.

 

Sorry, I missed that sentence (in bold above).

 

I think most professional restorers use materials that are considered archival (not bad for the book, so no side effects) and you will probably get some sort of restoration check list explaining what was done to the book...ie. pieces added, colour touch, etc.

 

I just don't expect them to go into detail as to how it was done.

 

[FFB]

"Those who make their living restoring comics, I can understand being proprietary."

 

I understand why businesses/professionals keep these things secrets. I was looking to go a little deeper. It sounds like my perception of secrecy may be incorrect. But it appears that restoration techniques are not discussed much out in the open, even among skilled amateurs.

 

I have searched and found some interesting stuff. If I were to have a book restored or purchase a restored book, I would want to know what had been done to it and what the possible side effects are.

 

I am wondering if the perception of restoration in the comic community has anything to do the apparent secrecy.

 

Most restoration professionals will answer questions you have about basic techniques involved and possible problems that may crop up. They won't give away trade secrets, but most of their trade secrets would be over your head anyway unless you were a paper conservator.

 

To answer your other question the stigma toward restoration has definitely been a massive barrier to educating collectors about what restoration is. The barrier is weakening though, as people like Kenny and Mike share their in-progress works so that run-of-the-mill collectors who have never had a book restored before can see what restoration can and cannot accomplish and what it looks like up close before and after.

[Ze-man]

Why are comic book restoration techniques TOP SECRET? I think it is not just about the $$$'s. Those who make their living restoring comics, I can understand being proprietary. But, I am curious as to why comic restoration techniques are top secret while restoration techniques in other areas such as antique books are openly discussed. Is it because of the stigma attached to restoration in the comic book community? or Is it the nature of the medium being color and pulp that makes the experimentation process more difficult and costly? I believe that if discussion of restoration techniques was more open, you would see fewer hack jobs and perhaps remove some of the stigma of restoration. Just my $.02.

 

What?, I thought I was pretty open with you when you asked me a barrage of question about how, and what I used to leaf cast with.

 

But as others have already said. So much time is spent on perfecting certain processes, you will not find many(if any) willing to share a proprietary processes in detail. I would actually love to show videos of how I Leaf Cast. But that would only allows others to view our process, and not bother with all the legwork we put in. Kinda sucks though that I can't because the process is so neat to see.

 

I have found most Conservationist to be quite open about a myriad of basic topics. But once you start asking them to reveal detailed stain removal processes, pulp dying techniques, or solvent recopies they clam up!

 

Everything that one can learn about Resto/Conso is out there, if you look. And with a pretty basic skill set you can pretty much apply that to anything paper. It's when you take what most everyone knows, and do it better then someone else when you start seeing people become secretive about how they did it.

 

That said, what do you think most people are confused about when it comes to resto? I would think wet washing is among the biggest. So much of beneficial conservation is based on washing, on some level. But that is the ONE type of resto that can never be undone.

 

To me this goes against Professional work being defined as "materials used can be removed safely".

 

 

 

 

[Mike's Rack]

Yes Ze-man, you are "zee" man and were very open. I was not not addressing this at anyone in particular. As to what is most confusing: wet washing as you mentioned and color matching when doing color touch imediaely come to mind.

 

In general, it sounds like I need to get my butt in gear and get practicing so I can get some specific feedback. I have appreciated everyone's thoughts on this. I love the CGC forums and the weath of information they hold.

 

[Mark 1]

I think it would be helpful if there is a way to document who the professional restoration company is that did the work and have it be noted on the label from CGC or at least be almost like a pedigree or provenance that states who did the work. Such as if Susan Cicconi restored a comic it would be nice to have that noted either at the sale or in the label.

 

I can't recall a time i've seen a restored comic come up for sale and it say who did the resto.

[FFB]

That said, what do you think most people are confused about when it comes to resto? I would think wet washing is among the biggest. So much of beneficial conservation is based on washing, on some level. But that is the ONE type of resto that can never be undone.

 

To me this goes against Professional work being defined as "materials used can be removed safely".

 

 

I don't think that is a proper definition of what constitutes professional restoration. It may be appropriate to apply that requirement to foreign material added to a comic (i.e., what you add should be reversible), but I don't think it makes sense to be dogmatic about it.

 

I have seen professional conservators replace iron gall ink where it is missing from historical documents. That is not going to be safely reversible because any solvent that could remove it will remove the original ink as well. And yet it is a technique used by professional conservators when restoring some historical documents. (Leave aside the debate as to whether a particular area of loss on a given document *should* be recreated.)

 

It also obviously does not apply to stain removal with organic solvents or water, nor does it apply to resizing a comic book. None of these things are safely reversible. Yet, all of these techniques are universally considered to be acceptable restoration/conservation techniques used by professional paper conservators worldwide.

[Mike's Rack]

Interesting idea, perhaps like a logo or signature in an inconspicuous spot? Perhaps this could actually increase the value of a quality resto job.

[FFB]

I think it would be helpful if there is a way to document who the professional restoration company is that did the work and have it be noted on the label from CGC or at least be almost like a pedigree or provenance that states who did the work. Such as if Susan Cicconi restored a comic it would be nice to have that noted either at the sale or in the label.

 

I can't recall a time i've seen a restored comic come up for sale and it say who did the resto.

 

I've seen it a few times where books are sold with the disclosure sheet from the restoration professional or where the person who did the restoration is identified (the Sotheby's catalogs used to have this information sometimes), but it is the exception, not the rule.

 

It won't work with CGC though because they have no way of knowing who did the work and it isn't their job to try to figure that out. Their job is to assess the apparent grade and make a judgment about the extent and quality of the restoration.