Sweetness and Sadness from Sarasota

[jimm94]

CGC already includes QP and PQ into the numerical grade...they just don't downgrade much for it below the 9.8 level unless it's very bad (i.e. brittle or has horrible production defects).

 

While that may be true, it is in fact pretty irrelevant for 99.999999% of comic books. It like saying that CGC downgrades for a date stamp. To me, unless something would cause a 9.4 to go to a 9.2 or lower, than it REALLY DOESN'T effect the grade.

 

Said a different way, if two books were exactly identical and both were graded CGC 9.4's, would the inclusion of a mis-cut or off-white pages (instead of white) downgrade the book. If not, then I don't consider it a downgradable defect.

 

I agree with this. The concept behind the formation of CGC was to bring impartiality to the recognized, most commonly accepted comic grading standards within the hobby, not to create an entirely new grading paradigm. Obviously, there are a few important deviations between CGC and OS standards, but most of the ones I can think of have a high level of acceptance within the marketplace.

 

That's certainly not to say that CGC can't or won't modify their grading system in the future, but I think their success is due, in part, to working within a grading framework that most dealers and collectors are (or should be) familiar with.

 

-Jim

[qualitycomix]

The only problem I see is that I can hold 5 books that are identical grades STRUCTURALLY, but otherwise, there are 1 or 2 "GEMS" that stand out from the rest with their QP and the vivid colors etc. and the page quality may be INFERIOR to the other copies.

 

The problem is that CGC is making a subjective call as to the grade and to ask them to do this as well is probably going to create only more problems.

[THE_BEYONDER]

I DO NOT, want CGC to incorporate QP or PQ into the numerical grade.

 

Neither do I. PQ & QP must remain seperate...otherwise the structural grade becomes undefinable.

 

If CGC were smart...they would come out with the CGC PLATINUM SERIES ...whereas only books with near-perfect QP(9.8+) would be eligible.

 

This would not only create a surplus of re-subs...it would give books that are free of production defects the recognition they deserve.

 

Of course...to do this...they would be required to appoint me PRIMARY QP GRADER and give me a commission.

[tth2]

The only problem I see is that I can hold 5 books that are identical grades STRUCTURALLY, but otherwise, there are 1 or 2 "GEMS" that stand out from the rest with their QP and the vivid colors etc. and the page quality may be INFERIOR to the other copies.

 

The problem is that CGC is making a subjective call as to the grade and to ask them to do this as well is probably going to create only more problems.

 

[tth2]

I DO NOT, want CGC to incorporate QP or PQ into the numerical grade.

 

Neither do I. PQ & QP must remain seperate...otherwise the structural grade becomes undefinable.

 

[FFB]

I DO NOT, want CGC to incorporate QP or PQ into the numerical grade.

 

Neither do I. PQ & QP must remain seperate...otherwise the structural grade becomes undefinable.

 

 

Yep.

[colmoreman]

If I could work out how to add a scan to this post ( help please!) I would add a scan of my biggest heartbreak and share my pain with you all.

 

In the meantime, this subject has raised some interesting questions about spine stress and what to me is the related subject of 'NO RETURNS ON CGC BOOKS'!

 

Like everyone else, my experience has also taught me that CGC will downgrade a book for spine stress which does not break the color and in the pre-CGC days dealers generally did not do so. I believe that CGC are right to to do so for the simple reason that a flat book without stress is much more nicer looking than one without. There should therefore be a distinction in the grading to reflect this.

 

I also agree with namisgr that scans of CGC books won't show up certain flaws such as spine stress that doesn't break the color, loss of brightness/reflectivity, ink transfers and so on, in the same way as holding a book in your hands would. As well, collectors always have different criteria on what defects or flaws are or are not acceptable to them. I've bought slabbed items through mail order and been disappointed, thinking that the good guys at CGC have been rather generous!

 

This then brings me on to one of my soapbox subjects, which is why do dealers not permit the return of CGC-graded items? The whole point, to my mind, of allowing returns from mail order purchases was to create, as far as possible, an equal situation with a purchase in person - so that the purchaser could have a look at an item in the flesh to see if he or she liked it before deciding whether or not to go ahead. Saying no returns on CGC items is like saying that returns are only permitted if the reason is that the purchaser disagrees with the dealer's allocated grade (on non-CGC books) and not, for example because the purchaser does not like the item for whatever his or her reason may be.

 

To me, this is and always has been wrong and tramples over what I believe is a purchaser's right to have a look at anything in 3-D before buying - whether from a shop or from mail order, particularly where scans do not nor can they ever tell the whole story. So far as I am aware, all other mail order goods are sent on an approval basis so why not slabbed comics?

 

What do you think? I've decided that when my website's launched (imminent now - www.colmorecomics.com) I will offer returns on everything whether CGC-graded or not (price only and not shipping refunded). I take the view that it is no big deal to me if someone wants to return a slabbed book and it is their right to do so - their reasons will be of no interest to me!

 

Will I be leading a one-man crusade here?

[sckao]

 

Nice looking site so far. I like the page design and look/style.

[sfilosa]

What do you think? I've decided that when my website's launched (imminent now - www.colmorecomics.com) I will offer returns on everything whether CGC-graded or not (price only and not shipping refunded). I take the view that it is no big deal to me if someone wants to return a slabbed book and it is their right to do so - their reasons will be of no interest to me!

 

Will I be leading a one-man crusade here?

 

Obviously, if you offer refunds on CGC book, that would give you a "one up" on other dealers.

 

But why don't more sellers give refunds on CGC books. As one board member said (paraprasing) "I paid for a third party review, and now I would still be held responsible for their decision".

 

And here would be the real issue. Assume everyone did take returns on CGC books. Don't you think there will be BUYERS, that would return EVERY book unless they felt it could be resubmittted for a higher grade. In other words, they buy a 9.4, think the books is a 9.4 and then return it because they don't think it could be a 9.6. Now wouldn't that stink.

[COI]

What do you think? I've decided that when my website's launched (imminent now - www.colmorecomics.com) I will offer returns on everything whether CGC-graded or not (price only and not shipping refunded). I take the view that it is no big deal to me if someone wants to return a slabbed book and it is their right to do so - their reasons will be of no interest to me!

 

Another issue is that considering how pricey CGC books get, dealers and sellers in general want to avoid those who would buy impulsively, and return a book because they regret the purchase. And if by some chance, other potential buyers catch on that the book was purchased and returned, the book in question may be unnecessarily "red flagged" in the minds of others.

[uclapeterg]

And here would be the real issue. Assume everyone did take returns on CGC books. Don't you think there will be BUYERS, that would return EVERY book unless they felt it could be resubmittted for a higher grade. In other words, they buy a 9.4, think the books is a 9.4 and then return it because they don't think it could be a 9.6. Now wouldn't that stink.

 

That never even occured to me.

[blazingbob]

I'm perplexed by "their reasons are of no concern to me"? Have a large number of grading arguments and "Why did CGC grade it this way" and this will definitely change. Spend an hour on the phone going over every possible defect while the book is still in the holder and I can assure you that you will be on this board asking "Why hasn't CGC published their grading standards" so I can end this endless Grading masturbation on why the person with the book in his hands knows more about grading than you do.

[uclapeterg]

Grading masturbation

 

[Aces]

Grading masturbation

 

 

[BradleyX2]

Grading masturbation

 

 

blazingbob, I give you an A+!

 

 

[uclapeterg]

Grading masturbation

 

 

blazingbob, I give you an A+!

 

 

 

Too much info!!!

[nearmint]

Grading masturbation

 

 

Yikes, we're being graded on that? What's the criteria? Frequency? Technique?

 

Is there a prize?

[Aces]

Grading masturbation

 

 

Yikes, we're being graded on that? What's the criteria? Frequency? Technique?

 

Is there a prize?

 

And is there a golden age curve for old guys?

[uclapeterg]

Grading masturbation

 

 

Yikes, we're being graded on that? What's the criteria? Frequency? Technique?

 

Is there a prize?

 

And is there a golden age curve for old guys?

 

Too much info!!!!!!!!!!!

[colmoreman]

Hi Bob

 

There are more things in life to me than muscle-flexing over who is the better grader - me or the other person on the end of a phone. If someone doesn't like something for whatever reason, whether justified, logical, kooky, irrational or just because the wife has found out how much they've spent, I'll give a refund and move onto more productive uses of my time.

 

Anyway, cheer up - I'll be giving you a free plug on my site as perhaps the only dealer I've never sent anything back to!