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X-Force #2 - What am I missing here?

Started by oldwhy,

148 posts in this topic

RockMyAmadeus

RockMyAmadeus

Posted
Posted
In fairness, yes, it was funny 10 years ago but it will be funny 10 years from now as well

 

Yes.

 

I get that DP is really, really hot.

 

And I get that Liefeld really impressed a lot of kids in the early 90's. I was there, it was real.

 

But...the guy is the most successful bad artist in the history of the medium.

 

It's tragic that talented and skilled artists like Jose Luis Garcia-Lopez, Tom Grummet, and Barry Kitson get short shrift, because they didn't draw 4,746 pouches on their covers.

 

Anyhoo, this has all been covered. It is one of the greatest crimes of the medium.

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Bronty

Bronty

Posted
Posted

lol

 

I wasn't going for anything nearly as nuanced as the interpretation you guys have given my statement. I was saying that the article which gloriously analyzes the absurdity if some of that art was funny in the day, funny now, funny later lol To me, that article does not get old because there is too much truth in it to stop being funny anytime soon. It just did such a perfect job of putting into words everything I disliked about his art even as a 15 year old.

 

Pouches, bent swords, 84 teeth, 342 lines around the eyes and mouth, no feet, ridiculous dialogue, "porno" expressions, bent spines, guns the size of a sofa, drawing around obvious mistakes instead of correcting them.... it's a rich mine of "Awesome".

 

And yes he gets a hard time but he deserves all of it for not having given one hot damn about the work that went out.

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theflashunc

theflashunc

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Posted

Two quotes seem apt.

 

First, from The Onion's AV Club:

 

Rob Liefeld is the punching bag of choice for many discerning comics fans. But he’s also the man who defined what the 1990s looked like in superhero books, so he’s crying all the way to the bank. For every detractor who thinks he’s the worst thing to happen to comic books since Fredric Wertham, there are a dozen ravenous fanboys ready to snatch up whatever he does next.

 

And from Rob himself in an interview with Brian Michael Bendis:

 

I'll be the first to tell you that we [the Image collective] were never the best artists. We were never the best at anything, but just like a song or a band or whatever, we caught on and we toured rigorously.
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alxjhnsn

alxjhnsn

Posted
Posted

I met Rob at Amazing! Houston Comic Con and I have to say that he's the hardest working man in comics when it comes to being a con guest. He was full of energy and seemed genuinely happy to be there. He worked hard to make all the fans happy and he was great with a child who had a mental disability.

 

He may not be much of an artist, but he seems to be a solid guy.

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Pete Marino

Pete Marino

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To get this thread back on track.

 

Given Liefeld's popularity and Deadpool's solid foothold on comic fandom at this point, I doubt we'll be seeing the price of quality RL / Deadpool pages going down in the mid-term future.

 

When you consider the supply of NM 98 and the demand there, and then the lack of quality DP OA I think it's a no brainier.

 

It's a good time to be holding on to those early pages. In a couple of years I think $3300 will be seen as a bargain.

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Phill the Governor

Phill the Governor

Posted
Posted
I met Rob at Amazing! Houston Comic Con and I have to say that he's the hardest working man in comics when it comes to being a con guest. He was full of energy and seemed genuinely happy to be there. He worked hard to make all the fans happy and he was great with a child who had a mental disability.

 

He may not be much of an artist, but he seems to be a solid guy.

 

I'm sure he can be. There's certainly no denying, however, that he's created a different persona for himself through his twitter and social media posts.

 

 

I think the page will be seen as a bargain in the future. But it's really about context here. Just like the Hulk 180 page. It didn't matter who drew Wolverine, it's Wolverine. People like Deadpool. I can't think of an artist that is more liked/disliked than Liefeld (maybe other than Kirby), but even then we're comparing apples to oranges. He was certainly prolific, but as others have mentioned, he's known for drawing anatomically incorrect art. I can't see people who don't like his style dropping thousands for something that is so bad it's good.

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Logan510

Logan510

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I think Rob Liefeld has a style, much like how many may pan Frank Miller, Jack Kirby and others who don't draw necessarily photo realistic. So, many people who grew up on Liefeld, love his work. I enjoy his work.

 

The difference is that artists like Miller, Kirby (as you mentioned), as well as artists like Toth, Adams, Ditko, etc.. developed a style from knowing how to draw. They knew anatomy, perspective, and shadowing. Liefeld's style developed from him NOT knowing how to draw.

 

If you're a big Deadpool fan, then I can understand appreciating this page. Liefeld was the artist, so that's who you're stuck with I guess. But the price that these pages go for is a reflection of the character, and not the artist.

--Mark

 

All subjective. If many of those guys had select panels picked apart the way Liefeld's work has been, they wouldn't hold up so well either.

 

It's not subjective. Taste in his work is subjective, his lack of skill is completely objective.

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Bronty

Bronty

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Good point, it seems pretty clear he had already drawn wolverine's body at scale to seem imposing and ran out of room for the claws. I've said my piece about him, but yes this is another example of Rob not correcting his work IMO.

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Koa

Koa

Posted
Posted

 

I think Rob Liefeld has a style, much like how many may pan Frank Miller, Jack Kirby and others who don't draw necessarily photo realistic. So, many people who grew up on Liefeld, love his work. I enjoy his work.

 

The difference is that artists like Miller, Kirby (as you mentioned), as well as artists like Toth, Adams, Ditko, etc.. developed a style from knowing how to draw. They knew anatomy, perspective, and shadowing. Liefeld's style developed from him NOT knowing how to draw.

 

If you're a big Deadpool fan, then I can understand appreciating this page. Liefeld was the artist, so that's who you're stuck with I guess. But the price that these pages go for is a reflection of the character, and not the artist.

--Mark

 

All subjective. If many of those guys had select panels picked apart the way Liefeld's work has been, they wouldn't hold up so well either.

 

It's not subjective. Taste in his work is subjective, his lack of skill is completely objective.

 

I read an interview with john buscema where he was asked about the drawing ability of several artists you mentioned and except Kirby none of them made his grade. So what? It's not what you have but what you do with it. history has been written and the Liefeld chapter is closed. He sold millions of comics was one of the most popular artists of his day and created one of the most popular marvel characters out there today. For whatever reason rob's work connected with many readers. His lack of skill may be a big part of the reason.

 

 

 

 

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Bronty

Bronty

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Yeah I don't really buy that "connecting with readers" bit. How long was he really hot? Couple years really. His popularity was a passing fad, a blip, a house of cards built on an inability to draw, apparently an inability to get on with his colleagues, and a total lack of substance. There's a big difference between being a quick fad and being a lasting success. 2c

 

I have a hard time giving him credit for moving units like its some sort of saving grace also. All those image guys moved units because image as a company was being speculated on massively. I wonder if 10% of his image books were read. Nothing to be super proud of except when you are cashing the check IMO.

 

Giving him credit for being speculated on is like saying the first appearance on squirrel girl is high art because it too is now being speculated on. Don't confuse greed with appreciation for the work 2c When a movie causes the first appearance of a character to inflate in price or move units, it isn't magically a better story

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