Are key comics good investments?

[lou_fine]

 

When you pay 20 times guide for the "highest " graded copy...you are a speculator...and we all know were that ends up...

 

 

So if you collect as a true collector, and don't care about "value" and pay reasonable prices not speculator jacked up money....enjoy

 

+1

 

I am absolutely surprised that history has not yet shown speculators time and time again that they should not be paying irrationally exuberant prices for CGC labels.

[lou_fine]

New fans will continue to be made not tons that get into collectinf but the appreciation for them will also be there to a degree. They'll never be worthless like sports cards.

 

I'm sure that's what sports card collectors said too about other hobbies.

 

Anyone with a 1st grade education saw the sports card collapse coming same as the housing bubble.

 

 

 

Are we not still in the middle of a housing bubble right now which has pretty well gone unabated so far this century, save for a very short-lived and temporary lull in 2008 & 2009?

 

Just look at the prices in the San Francisco area right now with final prices going well over their asking price in many cases. Actually, I guess it really depends on location when it comes to housing.

[kimik]

New fans will continue to be made not tons that get into collectinf but the appreciation for them will also be there to a degree. They'll never be worthless like sports cards.

 

I'm sure that's what sports card collectors said too about other hobbies.

 

Anyone with a 1st grade education saw the sports card collapse coming same as the housing bubble.

 

 

 

Are we not still in the middle of a housing bubble right now which has pretty well gone unabated so far this century, save for a very short-lived and temporary lull in 2008 & 2009?

 

Just look at the prices in the San Francisco area right now with final prices going well over their asking price in many cases. Actually, I guess it really depends on location when it comes to housing.

 

Hence the liquidity discussion re: RE. When markets are going up all is well, but when it turns it is much more difficult to sell.

 

Personally, I would rather own equities that pay a dividend (even using leverage to purchase them similar to a mortgage on a property) than RE for two main reasons: more liquid and lack of dealing with renters. However, I have friends that have done well with RE and can see that working if it is your thing.

[rjrjr]

Listen if any of us bought for the most part all grade ranges of Af 15's or Hulk 181's from the day CGC opened its doors till this very date we all would have made a massive profit or ROI.

 

So for me to say these books have hit the ceiling or maxed out is something I don't personally believe.

 

Will a book such as AF 15 or Hulk 1 level out and hit a wall, sure. However IMO they will continue to go up as a blue chip 5-10% per year for the rest of my life.

 

As with stocks there are some comic books that I think are good investments and some that are not so good.

 

As SOT said back in 2007...."Comics books are a commodity thank god."

 

5-10% per year for the rest of your life? Are you dying in the next 10 years? Seriously, that is such an outrageous statement it is hard to believe someone wrote it.

 

There is no such thing as a sure thing when it comes to investments or in this case, collectibles.

[wombat]

I would like for them to at least hold their value,wouldn't you?

 

Sure, except that my wanting the stuff I own to hold its value or, preferably, appreciate wildly in value, has no bearing on what the market will actually do. As such, I try to look at this stuff as dispassionately and objectively as I possibly can. Doesn't mean I don't love the hobby - if anything, the fact that I'm dour about its longer-term prospects and collect anyway probably means I love it more than many people who wouldn't stick around if it were no longer financially advantageous to them.

 

See things for what they really are, not just what you would like them to be.

 

Touche' I'm sure that will be your speech after the comics crash.

Me I would rather encourage new collectors,help them grow in our hobby.Helping them helps the hobby grow as a whole.

Maybe I do see things for what they are,but maybe I see things for what they can be.

 

Its like you are saying anyone who has the opinion that comics are going to decrease in value long term hates comic collecting and only wants to discourage collecting. That really isn't fair.

[greenhoody]

I would like for them to at least hold their value,wouldn't you?

 

Sure, except that my wanting the stuff I own to hold its value or, preferably, appreciate wildly in value, has no bearing on what the market will actually do. As such, I try to look at this stuff as dispassionately and objectively as I possibly can. Doesn't mean I don't love the hobby - if anything, the fact that I'm dour about its longer-term prospects and collect anyway probably means I love it more than many people who wouldn't stick around if it were no longer financially advantageous to them.

 

See things for what they really are, not just what you would like them to be.

 

 

 

Touche' I'm sure that will be your speech after the comics crash.

Me I would rather encourage new collectors,help them grow in our hobby.Helping them helps the hobby grow as a whole.

Maybe I do see things for what they are,but maybe I see things for what they can be.

 

gloom and doom talk hurts the hobby. A few years ago I wad really needing money and all the gloom and doom got in my head and I sold all my good stuff and stayed away for a while. I guarantee i'm not the only person that got effected by talk like this.

 

I mean I don't encourage my friends to invest in comics but I wouldn't tell then to be afraid of it either.

[Hamlet]

 

Hence the liquidity discussion re: RE. When markets are going up all is well, but when it turns it is much more difficult to sell.

 

Personally, I would rather own equities that pay a dividend (even using leverage to purchase them similar to a mortgage on a property) than RE for two main reasons: more liquid and lack of dealing with renters. However, I have friends that have done well with RE and can see that working if it is your thing.

 

Danger!! Will Robinson Danger!!

 

[Erndog]

This thread depresses me

[delekkerste]

5-10% per year for the rest of your life? Are you dying in the next 10 years? Seriously, that is such an outrageous statement it is hard to believe someone wrote it.

 

 

Well, John's a healthy guy who works out a lot, so let's assume he lives 10 years beyond the U.S. male average life expectancy, which should give him another 51 years.

 

At a 5% CAGR (compound annual growth rate), an AF #15 with a value today of $25K (say, a 5.0) will be worth $301,019 in 51 years.

 

At a 10% CAGR, it will be worth $3.2 million (such is the power of that additional compounding).

 

Either we're all going to be very, very rich or, more likely, there will be a lot of disappointed comic owners who will struggle to earn even low-single digit CAGRs over the very long-term from here.

[F For Fake]

This thread depresses me

 

+1

 

I usually feel pretty good about my collection, but every time I check this thread I get that urge to sell everything off and go live in a bunker.

 

 

[Gotham Kid]

The end is not here just yet. Collect, invest, enjoy and sell it off in the next 15-20 years. Let it be someone else's problem then.

[kimik]

 

Hence the liquidity discussion re: RE. When markets are going up all is well, but when it turns it is much more difficult to sell.

 

Personally, I would rather own equities that pay a dividend (even using leverage to purchase them similar to a mortgage on a property) than RE for two main reasons: more liquid and lack of dealing with renters. However, I have friends that have done well with RE and can see that working if it is your thing.

 

Danger!! Will Robinson Danger!!

 

 

I exited my leveraged accounts in April (my wife dumped her's last year - she is more risk averse). It was a fun ride while the low rates lasted, and even though I do not see rates rising anytime soon here in Canada I am not willing to take that risk in the face of weak markets. However, from 2009 until this year it has worked out very nicely........ (thumbs u

[joe_collector]

Anyone with a 1st grade education saw the sports card collapse coming same as the housing bubble.

 

Really? I guess you haven't been around here long, as Del and I used to have arguments with other board members prior to the economic meltdown/mortgage crisis, warning that there would be a serious correction, and were outnumbered 100-1.

 

And I am not joking.

 

Obviously some of them knew it would happen, but they steadfastly refused to admit it in an open forum, same as on here. Bad for Business.

[delekkerste]

This thread depresses me

 

+1

 

I usually feel pretty good about my collection, but every time I check this thread I get that urge to sell everything off and go live in a bunker.

 

 

Don't let your happiness about your collection depend on its $ value or what other people are saying on the CGC Boards. That way lies madness.

[joe_collector]

[A few years ago I wad really needing money and all the gloom and doom got in my head and I sold all my good stuff and stayed away for a while. I guarantee i'm not the only person that got effected by talk like this.

 

Then you need to go use some of your comic funds to buy a backbone, and be more of a LEADER and less of a SHEEP FOLLOWER.

 

I fully believe that current demographic models are going to eat comics for breakfast, but that doesn't mean I'm running around selling all my comics off as quick as I can.

 

It's my hobby and I only spend what I feel comfortable with, and never "invest" or follow trends _ I buy what I like and that's it. I also don't listen to people screaming "you have to buy XXXXX currently-hot-flash-in-the-pan comic!!" either.

[Jaydogrules]

Comics have been around and collected for nearly 100 years.

 

They will be around in one form another for 100 more.

 

A few of the posters in this thread really need to go outside and take a walk in the sunshine for a few hours. Or have a picnic.

 

Maybe you'll feel better. (thumbs u

 

-J.

[COI]

I don't think anyone has said people should stop collecting comics.

 

No of course not.

Collectors collect,because there is value to the collection Understand?

You tell someone who collects that their collection is going to be worthless in say 5 years,then what's the point collecting it?

So now you have little Bobby Brown coming on to read these very forums,and reads that comic books are going to be worthless in 5 years,then in his mind he's thinking why should I spend money on collecting comic books when they won't hold their value!

It's a collectors mindset,you could replace comics for toys or watches or just about anything collectors collect,And the thought process would be the same.

 

Collectors don't just collect because there is financial value tied to their collection. When I was in little Bobby Brown's shoes, I bought comics because I loved them, not because they were going to fund my retirement.

 

There are so many hobbies and forms of entertainment that you spend money on without any hope or expectation of return. I find it interesting that so many collectors seem to think that collecting and consuming have to be mutually exclusive, and I suspect it's that way because most collectors have to find the justification to spend more money than they probably should have or would have if they were collecting simply for the love of the items themselves. Also, as with most materialistic pursuits, people get their ego tied up in what they own, which further exacerbates this.

[Bropper]

Love this thread. Instead of arguing if the comic industry will be alive in 10-20yrs maybe we should be discussing if the world as we know it will be around.

 

I am not a dooms day prepper. Mostly because I don't want to survive in order to live in the zombie apocalypse. Prefer to be close to ground zero.

 

So, to me buying comics, Disney stock, gold etc... is pointless. Better to sell everything and enjoy life because there will not be any consequences due to world events. Instead buy guns, ammo, water purification and seeds. To believe the world (as we currently know it) will be here for the next 10-20yrs is foolish.

 

You won't be able to go down to a local store and buy goods with gold or silver let alone comics. Don't think anyone will be able to provide you with change.

 

Or is it?

[ComicConnoisseur]

I don't think anyone has said people should stop collecting comics.

 

No of course not.

Collectors collect,because there is value to the collection Understand?

You tell someone who collects that their collection is going to be worthless in say 5 years,then what's the point collecting it?

So now you have little Bobby Brown coming on to read these very forums,and reads that comic books are going to be worthless in 5 years,then in his mind he's thinking why should I spend money on collecting comic books when they won't hold their value!

It's a collectors mindset,you could replace comics for toys or watches or just about anything collectors collect,And the thought process would be the same.

 

Collectors don't just collect because there is financial value tied to their collection. When I was in little Bobby Brown's shoes, I bought comics because I loved them, not because they were going to fund my retirement.

 

There are so many hobbies and forms of entertainment that you spend money on without any hope or expectation of return. I find it interesting that so many collectors seem to think that collecting and consuming have to be mutually exclusive, and I suspect it's that way because most collectors have to find the justification to spend more money than they probably should have or would have if they were collecting simply for the love of the items themselves. Also, as with most materialistic pursuits, people get their ego tied up in what they own, which further exacerbates this.

Good post COI.

I had many acquaintances get into this hobby with their first words saying to me how much is it worth or will it go up in value?

Eventually these kind of fans moved on to something else like Lego or Magic when they find out they can make more money there quicker.

I rather have the new comic book fans ask me if it`s a good read or not, than how much is it worth.

 

[jimbo_707]

The end is not here just yet. Collect, invest, enjoy and sell it off in the next 15-20 years. Let it be someone else's problem then.

I agree that things will be relatively stable for that amount of time. I don't mean that nothing will drop in value—some books will—but I don't think there will be a total collapse in that time period. After that, it gets more difficult to say. I'm not certain comic collecting will still be common hobby 50 years from now.

 

When it comes to keys, I think high-grade copies are safe for a while. I do think the pool of collectors will shrink, however. Most people leave the hobby in their 60s. There are exceptions, but they're rare. Think of all the collectors you know who are 50 or older: most of them will have left them hobby by 2035. Are there enough younger collectors out there to replace them? I doubt it. As the pool of collectors shrinks over time, demand will be significantly affected, and books will become more affordable. The lower-grade copies will be impossible to sell. However, from that smaller pool of collectors, there will still be a few people competing fiercely for the nicest copies, so the highest-graded copies of mainstream books may not be as badly affected and should at least keep up with inflation.

 

When I talk about high-grade keys being safe, I'm talking GA. For SA and BA, I think there are still many, many OO collections out there that will drive prices down once most of them have been brought to market.