Celebrate Dell'Otto! 15 15

[ygogolak]

36 minutes ago, Jaydogrules said:

As much as I know a couple of people posting in here love a good pile on, what Polirer is stating is, in reality, factually plausible, so in the absence of firsthand knowledge of actual fraud, maybe people should back off a little.  Some of us do appreciate the first hand looks and previews that he provides of the upcoming covers, and I for one would like it to continue.  

And just to clear up things a little, here's what I believe Polirer is saying, based on my own knowledge of how it works:

Bulletproof purchases or commissions a piece from Dell'otto, and the image is sent to DC for approval.  

Upon approval Bulletproof orders the minimum amount of copies, say four case packs of 250 from DC.

From those 1000, Bulletproof scraps all un-sellable damaged copies, anything that appears less than a guaranteed grade, and earmarks how ever many others for the creators, courtesy copies, copies for their own PC's, etc.  

If, after that, there is a shortfall, Bulletproof needs to go back to the publisher and order another case pack of 250.  HOWEVER.... there is no guarantee the publisher will provide this.  I have seen occasions where the publisher has told stores that whatever they first order is all they will ever get, regardless of damages, etc.  

The only real question someone could reasonably have is what happens if they get four case packs of pristine books that exceed the promised amount of availability.  

But we have seen what sometimes happens in that scenario- a second offering is provided.  That usually upsets the first round of buyers.  So stores stopped doing that.   Now we here that they destroy them.  We obviously don't know whether or not that is true for sure, but until someone releases an undercover hidden camera exposé, or we suddenly see a ridiculous glut of a supposedly print limited book somewhere, it is unreasonable and unfair to either directly or indirectly accuse them of lying.  

At the end of the day, the truth is probably somewhere in the middle. I don't know about destroying comics but even if there are some left overs, by the way these stores work, and how much spoilage there is in a typical shipment, I highly doubt there are many, if any 9.8 candidates either getting thrown down a sewer, or being stored under somebody's desk for secret sales after the fact on eBay.    

So please, keep the great covers and the insider info coming Polirer.

-J.

 

 

Agreed, that's the best explanation I have seen for this scenario. But that's not what the poster is saying.

[SquareChaos]

If you are buying these books for the cover art then who cares if there are 800 or 1000?

 

If your primary concern is that some esoteric formula of rarity + cover art + ? = a valuable book, then I can see why people might want some level of assurance that they're buying what they think they're buying. If I were to go into the business of selling low print store variants I'd have a boilerplate statement on my site explaining exactly how the process worked. In addition, I'd also be a showman about it if there are any excess copies - a monthly YouTube video would go up of me tossing the extras one by one into a raging fire. The ashes to ashes rarity guarantee.

[Polirer]

1 hour ago, Jaydogrules said:

As much as I know a couple of people posting in here love a good pile on, what Polirer is stating is, in reality, factually plausible, so in the absence of firsthand knowledge of actual fraud, maybe people should back off a little.  Some of us do appreciate the first hand looks and previews that he provides of the upcoming covers, and I for one would like it to continue.  

And just to clear up things a little, here's what I believe Polirer is saying, based on my own knowledge of how it works:

Bulletproof purchases or commissions a piece from Dell'otto, and the image is sent to DC for approval.  

Upon approval Bulletproof orders the minimum amount of copies, say four case packs of 250 from DC.

From those 1000, Bulletproof scraps all un-sellable damaged copies, anything that appears less than a guaranteed grade, and earmarks how ever many others for the creators, courtesy copies, copies for their own PC's, etc.  

If, after that, there is a shortfall, Bulletproof needs to go back to the publisher and order another case pack of 250.  HOWEVER.... there is no guarantee the publisher will provide this.  I have seen occasions where the publisher has told stores that whatever they first order is all they will ever get, regardless of damages, etc.  

The only real question someone could reasonably have is what happens if they get four case packs of pristine books that exceed the promised amount of availability.  

But we have seen what sometimes happens in that scenario- a second offering is provided.  That usually upsets the first round of buyers.  So stores stopped doing that.   Now we here that they destroy them.  We obviously don't know whether or not that is true for sure, but until someone releases an undercover hidden camera exposé, or we suddenly see a ridiculous glut of a supposedly print limited book somewhere, it is unreasonable and unfair to either directly or indirectly accuse them of lying.  

At the end of the day, the truth is probably somewhere in the middle. I don't know about destroying comics but even if there are some left overs, by the way these stores work, and how much spoilage there is in a typical shipment, I highly doubt there are many, if any 9.8 candidates either getting thrown down a sewer, or being stored under somebody's desk for secret sales after the fact on eBay.    

So please, keep the great covers and the insider info coming Polirer.

-J.

 

 

Jay you know you have the most respect from me out of everyone here. But it’s hard, when your passionate about something and people want to put false info and bash it. I love Dell’Ottos work, my original painted blank is being done now as we speak. I’ve decided not to sell my 667 rather sell off other books. You know as does Pete, Kev, and Max that I’m affiliated with Bulletproof and my info is legit, I see the Dell’Otto sketches before the final covers, I’ve had a say if sketches don’t look right and what Dell’Otto should fix. I explained how the process works but these guys don’t listen/read correctly. So I’ll think about it. But I rather not hear the noise. Rather just message you four directly.

[kevhtx]

I usually think 800 or less print run for a popular cover, book and/or character is a decent number. This one is slightly higher, but Im not really worried about it. I think this is going to be a sought after book so the print run will be ok.

I trust Polirer and he has always given good info. I appreciate it. 

[IntoAnother]

Where is the pile on?

A few of us asked questions to someone who works for Bulletproof and that’s somehow an issue? 

[Polirer]

One more post of info, out of respect for Jay, Kev, Max, and Pete.

we’re 98% certain that Metal 5 cgc 9.8 ss virgins will be NUMBERED BY HAND by Dell’Otto in addition to being signed.

[Polirer]

13 minutes ago, IntoAnother said:

Where is the pile on?

A few of us asked questions to someone who works for Bulletproof and that’s somehow an issue? 

By the way I don’t work for Bulletproof.

[IntoAnother]

2 minutes ago, Polirer said:

By the way I don’t work for Bulletproof.

My apologies for the assumption, I saw you write “we” when referring to Bulletproof so I made a guess, my mistake. 

So what is your role with Bulletproof and Dell’Otto?

By the way I’m not on any witch hunt here. I saw “insider info” and figured it couldn’t hurt to ask for proof of a print run because I’ve never seen any for a variant.

It isn’t about you or Bulletproof. Print run numbers are just one of those things that’s repeatedly stated yet I’ve never actually seen any proof. That’s all, no reason to ignore my follow up questions or to be defensive. 

For the numbers on comp and replacement copies it was again just for me and my own curiosity. No big deal. 

[ygogolak]

1 hour ago, Polirer said:

Jay you know you have the most respect from me out of everyone here. But it’s hard, when your passionate about something and people want to put false info and bash it. I love Dell’Ottos work, my original painted blank is being done now as we speak. I’ve decided not to sell my 667 rather sell off other books. You know as does Pete, Kev, and Max that I’m affiliated with Bulletproof and my info is legit, I see the Dell’Otto sketches before the final covers, I’ve had a say if sketches don’t look right and what Dell’Otto should fix. I explained how the process works but these guys don’t listen/read correctly. So I’ll think about it. But I rather not hear the noise. Rather just message you four directly.

Come on, he's directly disagreeing with what you said.

1 hour ago, SquareChaos said:

If you are buying these books for the cover art then who cares if there are 800 or 1000?

 

If your primary concern is that some esoteric formula of rarity + cover art + ? = a valuable book, then I can see why people might want some level of assurance that they're buying what they think they're buying. If I were to go into the business of selling low print store variants I'd have a boilerplate statement on my site explaining exactly how the process worked. In addition, I'd also be a showman about it if there are any excess copies - a monthly YouTube video would go up of me tossing the extras one by one into a raging fire. The ashes to ashes rarity guarantee.

What do you do with the extras at the printer?

[SquareChaos]

4 minutes ago, ygogolak said:

What do you do with the extras at the printer?

Can't tell you - shop secret.

[Polirer]

2 minutes ago, ygogolak said:

Come on, he's directly disagreeing with what you said.

What do you do with the extras at the printer?

There are no extras at the printer we order a 1000 and 1000 are printed.

Ill admit the comps for the writers and artists are not part of the 1000 and I don’t know how many extra are printed for those folks.

Squarechaos is not Jay. And I’m not going to get dragged into an argument by you.

[darkstar]

2 hours ago, SquareChaos said:

If you are buying these books for the cover art then who cares if there are 800 or 1000?

 

If your primary concern is that some esoteric formula of rarity + cover art + ? = a valuable book, then I can see why people might want some level of assurance that they're buying what they think they're buying. If I were to go into the business of selling low print store variants I'd have a boilerplate statement on my site explaining exactly how the process worked. In addition, I'd also be a showman about it if there are any excess copies - a monthly YouTube video would go up of me tossing the extras one by one into a raging fire. The ashes to ashes rarity guarantee.

You understand these books only sell for what they do because of the advertised print numbers attached to them and the limited time they are available before being marked SOLD OUT, yes?

[SquareChaos]

3 minutes ago, darkstar said:

You understand these books only sell for what they do because of the advertised print numbers attached to them and the limited time they are available before being marked SOLD OUT, yes?

Of course. I think it's crazy personally, but that is the point of my post - I would bend over backwards to make sure my customers knew the numbers.

[ygogolak]

16 minutes ago, Polirer said:

There are no extras at the printer we order a 1000 and 1000 are printed.

Ill admit the comps for the writers and artists are not part of the 1000 and I don’t know how many extra are printed for those folks.

Squarechaos is not Jay. And I’m not going to get dragged into an argument by you.

"No extras at the printer."

You have "inside knowledge" and don't even know how the process works.

[ygogolak]

How many of the 3,000 did DC buy for this giveaway? They probably didn't just ask the printer to print extras of all the variants and send them to them.

 

Edited November 22, 2017 by ygogolak

[Jaydogrules]

6 minutes ago, ygogolak said:

How many of the 3,000 did DC buy for this giveaway? They probably didn't just ask the printer to print extras of all the variants and send them to them.

 

There are no "extras" printed.  You order what you think you need up to a case pack and allocate accordingly, or you get rid of your remaindered case pack(s) through some other means as is possibly what's going on in the advert above.  I understand Polier seems to be saying something different, or may seem uncertain in how he explains the point, but that's how it works.  There aren't loose copies of books taped to the tops of case packs for "damages and creator copies", that doesn't even make any sense.    You get what you get inside of your case packs and distribute them however you want.

And going back to press to print more ain't happenin'.   If you do it's called a "second printing". 

-J.

[ygogolak]

13 minutes ago, Jaydogrules said:

There are no "extras" printed.  You order what you think you need up to a case pack and allocate accordingly, or you get rid of your remaindered case pack(s) through some other means as is possibly what's going on in the advert above.  I understand Polier seems to be saying something different, or may seem uncertain in how he explains the point, but that's how it works.  There aren't loose copies of books taped to the tops of case packs for "damages and creator copies", that doesn't even make any sense.    You get what you get inside of your case packs and distribute them however you want.

And going back to press to print more ain't happenin'.   If you do it's called a "second printing". 

-J.

Yes, I said that regarding "going back for replacements". But once again, that's not what he said.

So, you're saying DC bought the Dell Otto back from them for this giveaway?

Edited November 22, 2017 by ygogolak

[Shoomanfoo]

6 hours ago, ygogolak said:

Egotistical...ok. I already apologized on the previous print runs a page back.

So, as you explained it. Bullet will get 1,000 copies and is selling 1,000 copies as 9.6 or better.

 

You're saying right there more than 1,000 will be printed.

Will replacements be printed at a later date? (2nd prints)

But then you also said quantities of 200 can't be printed. Which I agree they print to a certain number whether they need them or not (case?). So how are exact numbers of replacements going to be met?

Clear as mud.

 

 

 

I think it's funny that they added "200 to be damaged" to paint a picture of it being even rarer than it actually is.

Like that's total speculation. Am I the only one that laughs to myself when I see an advertisement with all the extra sazamafraz of a used car salesman

[Jaydogrules]

10 minutes ago, ygogolak said:

Yes, I said that regarding "going back for replacements". But once again, that's not what he said.

So, you're saying DC bought the Dell Otto back from them for this giveaway?

That I have no idea. There's a lot of scenarios that could have lead to that I would only be speculating.

-J.

[SquareChaos]

Just now, Jaydogrules said:

That I have no idea. There's a lot of scenarios that could have lead to that I would only be speculating.

-J.

Which is why, considering the numbers are - if we're being serious - likely more important than the image... the shops (not picking on anyone in particular here) should really try harder to make this system less opaque.