Marvel UK Price Variants 16 16

[Kevin.J]

[Get Marwood & I]

On 10/23/2021 at 12:08 AM, Malacoda said:

(I may be flogging this to death here)

Hey, I set that precedent long ago, Rich. Blather away mate  

What do you think of these two - my old copies:

Do we see the reverse there do you think?

[Kevin.J]

[Pantodude]

Well, so much for avoiding confusion among casual visitors about what the U.K. price variants (and just those) look like, despite the thread title!   So much variety.  Somehow, I only managed to obtain one or two books with the manually applied T&P circle stamp.  I will check if mine present well, and if not, I will need to hunt down decent samples.    

Update:  And here it is!  My sole book with the Thorpe & Porter stamp on the cover.  Decent example!

 

While I prefer the actual UK price variants (like below, printed with pence price circles/boxes), I wish that my collection had more of the T&P stamped versions, especially where I already have the regular cents version and the UK price variant.  It would have been cool to have the full set of three versions for some of my keys.   Too expensive to do that now, sadly.  

Edited October 23, 2021 by Pantodude

[Tghutcn]

On 10/23/2021 at 12:50 PM, Pantodude said:

Well, so much for avoiding confusion among casual visitors about what the U.K. price variants (and just those) look like, despite the thread title!   So much variety.  Somehow, I only managed to obtain one or two books with the manually applied T&P circle stamp.  I will check if mine present well, and if not, I will need to hunt down decent samples.    

Update:  And here it is!  My sole book with the Thorpe & Porter stamp on the cover.  Decent example!

 

While I prefer the actual UK price variants (like below, printed with pence price circles/boxes), I wish that my collection had more of the T&P stamped versions, especially where I already have the regular cents version and the UK price variant.  It would have been cool to have the full set of three versions for some of my keys.   Too expensive to do that now, sadly.  

I have a fair few comics with the Thorpe and Porter they either can look alright and non disruptive or really annoying I’m trading for a Batman 227 at the moment with one on and it’s be placed on the title what’s okay but I’ve had some where they where put on a character’s face 

[Malacoda]

On 10/23/2021 at 10:52 AM, Get Marwood & I said:

Hey, I set that precedent long ago, Rich. Blather away mate  

What do you think of these two - my old copies:

Do we see the reverse there do you think?

Quite possibly correct, although these wouldn't be the proof of it.* I checked those DD examples I used against my own collection and my 37 is knackered while my 36 is pristine, so I can't substantiate my point even with my own comics, but I'm sure we agree that we could never substantiate this with a handful of examples anyway, we'd have to look at a ton of them, and not just around this changeover period.  Even if my point has merit, how much of the chipping was a result of the paper and how much was a result of bad guillotining? I think both improved at Sparta. 

I think the point still stands though for 3 reasons: (1) we've all seen it that way over many years & many examples (2) when Silver Marvels are knackered they very often feature chipping as part of the damage, but when Bronze ones are battered, they seldom do, to anything like the same extent (3) I know you can find this kind of chipping on other publisher's comics, but we don't talk about 'DC chipping' really do we? 

*if you check the indicas, I think you'll find that ASM 57 is one of the last ones from  ECP (right cover date, wrong release date).  If you check your copy of 58 (which, like Avengers 49 happens to be a black cover, so a good test subject), you might find it's less ragged. 

 

[Get Marwood & I]

On 10/23/2021 at 12:50 PM, Pantodude said:

Well, so much for avoiding confusion among casual visitors about what the U.K. price variants (and just those) look like, despite the thread title!   So much variety. 

Oh, leave off Panto, I've just had Robot having a moan about finding an up to date issue list and now you're at it. I've done more than anyone alive to establish what UK Price Variants are and how to differentiate them from US copies. This is a discussion thread and we sometimes veer off into other directions. I can't be expected to restate what a UKPV is every couple of posts here just incase someone new arrives who can't be bothered to read a bit. If people are genuinely interested, they'll pick it up soon enough - especially if they visit my journal pages which were purposely created to act as one stop, stand alone summaries of UKPV salient points. 

[Get Marwood & I]

On 10/23/2021 at 2:57 PM, Malacoda said:

*if you check the indicas, I think you'll find that ASM 57 is one of the last ones from  ECP (right cover date, wrong release date).  If you check your copy of 58 (which, like Avengers 49 happens to be a black cover, so a good test subject), you might find it's less ragged. 

I haven't got them anymore, alas. Sure they're online somewhere though Rich. Report back when you've found them 

[Malacoda]

On 10/23/2021 at 3:28 PM, Get Marwood & I said:

I haven't got them anymore, alas. Sure they're online somewhere though Rich. Report back when you've found them 

Actually, I have copies of those myself somewhere, but I've lost track of my ASM collection. Not. Even. Joking. 

I think we can park the chipping conversation. Or at least wait and see what Albert says. 

[Get Marwood & I]

On 10/23/2021 at 3:48 PM, Malacoda said:

Actually, I have copies of those myself somewhere, but I've lost track of my ASM collection. Not. Even. Joking. 

I think we can park the chipping conversation. Or at least wait and see what Albert says. 

I think he's on holiday in Chipping Norton. 

[Pantodude]

On 10/23/2021 at 10:24 AM, Get Marwood & I said:

Oh, leave off Panto, I've just had Robot having a moan about finding an up to date issue list and now you're at it. I've done more than anyone alive to establish what UK Price Variants are and how to differentiate them from US copies. This is a discussion thread and we sometimes veer off into other directions. I can't be expected to restate what a UKPV is every couple of posts here just incase someone new arrives who can't be bothered to read a bit. If people are genuinely interested, they'll pick it up soon enough - especially if they visit my journal pages which were purposely created to act as one stop, stand alone summaries of UKPV salient points. 

Fair enough. That's why I tried to reign it in a bit, w/ pix to boot!     At least some good came out of it--I found my sole T&P-stamped book.    

[Get Marwood & I]

On 10/23/2021 at 5:52 PM, Pantodude said:

Fair enough. That's why I tried to reign it in a bit, w/ pix to boot!     At least some good came out of it--I found my sole T&P-stamped book.    

Twas a 9 too 

[Get Marwood & I]

HOW TO TELL A

"MARVEL UK PRICE VARIANT"

(that you're in love with her)

Once upon a time, there was a comic made in America (the US) called "The Incredible Hulk".

Number 139, priced at 15 cents, looked like this:

It was a 'US Cents Copy'.

At the same time, in the same location, and on the same printing presses, a copy was made for the people of Englaterre (the UK).

Priced at one shilling, the currency of the Englaterrians, it looked like this:

It was 'UK Pence Copy'.

It was exactly the same as the cents copy, but had a different price. That meant it varied from the cents copy, visually. So we called it a variant. The nature of the variance was the price. A UK price, of one shilling, instead of 15 cents. So it became known as a "UK Price Variant"

Because the denizens of Englaterre (the UK) liked the Hulk so much, some bright spark in Blighty (also the UK) decided to import a load of extra cents priced copies so he could make a buck. Pound, sorry. Now obviously, they had a US price on them and that would have confused the Hell out of the people of Englaterre. So they stuck a stamp on it, with a UK price of 5p just to confuse everyone who had just bought a pre-decimal UK Price Variant copy. The UK went from old money (shillings and stuff) to new pence money in 1971.

Anyway, it looked like this, the 'UK distributed Cents Copy':

Now be clear, that book above is NOT a UK Price Variant because it doesn't vary in any printed way from a normal 15 Cents copy. It was just distributed in Englaterre with that 5p stamp to tell them how much it was. It was just a cents copy, distributed in the UK.

So, although you have just seen three copies of the same comic issue, there are really on two types of copy that were originally printed as part of the first run. Both are called 'first printings' therefore, and they are:

1. The US Cents Copy - for readers in the US
2. The UK Price Variant - for readers in the UK

The third 'UK Distributed' copy is just a cents copy in disguise.

Now it doesn't end there I'm afraid, because some other bright spark in Englaterrre one day decided to obtain the rights to reprint the Hulk #139 and others like him. They did that in the UK, under license, on local printing presses, and long after the original Hulk #139s were printed in the US. They decided to call their comic "The Mighty World of Marvel" because that sounded proper punchy and besides, the Hulk liked to punch things a lot.

Here is what it looked like:

It has nothing to do with the original Hulk #139 and should never, ever be called a "UK Edition" or the "UK Version" of Hulk #139.

It is entirely it's own thing (unless you are CGC, who really should know better).

So to recap those examples:

US Cents Copy (first printing):  

UK Price Variant (first printing): 

US Cents Copy (first printing, with UK distribution stamp): 

UK Publication (which reprints the first printing original book under license): 

 

 

 

[Albert Tatlock]

On 10/23/2021 at 4:35 PM, Get Marwood & I said:

I think he's on holiday in Chipping Norton. 

It's always Chipping Sodbury for me, more upmarket.

The local derbies there are full of thud and blunder, but you've got to fancy the chances of the Sodburyites when the Chips are down.

[Get Marwood & I]

On 10/23/2021 at 7:15 PM, Albert Tatlock said:

It's always Chipping Sodbury for me, more upmarket.

The local derbies there are full of thud and blunder, but you've got to fancy the chances of the Sodburyites when the Chips are down.

Have the Chips ever been up? Miserable lot aren't they.

I still prefer Chipping Norton as a destination myself, as they take the virus more seriously.  

[Pantodude]

On 10/23/2021 at 1:37 PM, Get Marwood & I said:

HOW TO TELL A

"MARVEL UK PRICE VARIANT"

(that you're in love with her)

Once upon a time, there was a comic made in America (the US) called "The Incredible Hulk".

Number 139, priced at 15 cents, looked like this:

It was a 'US Cents Copy'.

At the same time, in the same location, and on the same printing presses, a copy was made for the people of Englaterre (the UK).

Priced at one shilling, the currency of the Englaterrians, it looked like this:

It was 'UK Pence Copy'.

It was exactly the same as the cents copy, but had a different price. That meant it varied from the cents copy, visually. So we called it a variant. The nature of the variance was the price. A UK price, of one shilling, instead of 15 cents. So it became known as a "UK Price Variant"

Because the denizens of Englaterre (the UK) liked the Hulk so much, some bright spark in Blighty (also the UK) decided to import a load of extra cents priced copies so he could make a buck. Pound, sorry. Now obviously, they had a US price on them and that would have confused the Hell out of the people of Englaterre. So they stuck a stamp on it, with a UK price of 5p just to confuse everyone who had just bought a pre-decimal UK Price Variant copy. The UK went from old money (shillings and stuff) to new pence money in 1971.

Anyway, it looked like this, the 'UK distributed Cents Copy':

Now be clear, that book above is NOT a UK Price Variant because it doesn't vary in any printed way from a normal 15 Cents copy. It was just distributed in Englaterre with that 5p stamp to tell them much it was. It was just a cents copy, distributed in the UK.

So, although you have just seen three copies of the same comic issue, there are really on two types of copy that were originally printed as part of the first run. Both are called 'first printings' therefore, and they are:

1. The US Cents Copy - for readers in the US
2. The UK Price Variant - for readers in the UK

The third 'UK Distributed' copy is just a cents copy in disguise.

Now it doesn't end there I'm afraid, because some other bright spark in Englaterrre one day decided to obtain the rights to reprint the Hulk #139 and others like him. They did that in the UK, under license, on local printing presses, and long after the original Hulk #139s were printed in the US. They decided to call their comic "The Mighty World of Marvel" because that sounded proper punchy and besides, the Hulk liked to punch things a lot.

Here is what it looked like:

It has nothing to do with the original Hulk #139 and should never, ever be called a "UK Edition" or the "UK Version" of Hulk #139.

It is entirely it's own thing (unless you are CGC, who really should know better).

So to recap those examples:

US Cents Copy (first printing):  

UK Price Variant (first printing): 

US Cents Copy (first printing, with UK distribution stamp): 

UK Publication (which reprints the first printing original book under license): 

 

 

 

This is so elegantly clear and thorough that I almost want to cry.  I think I will (but you'll never know for sure!).  Thank you.  

Edited October 23, 2021 by Pantodude

[Get Marwood & I]

On 10/23/2021 at 9:00 PM, Pantodude said:

This is so elegant and thorough that I almost want to cry.  I think I will (but you'll never know for sure!).  Thank you.  

Cheers  

You don't actually need the 'cents' in the 'US Cents Copy' captions - being for the US, they're cents by definition - but I included it just to ram home the currency differences. 

Overall, about 0.0000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000001% of collectors care, I think.

Well, maybe not that many.

[Albert Tatlock]

Finest team in all the land, the Pride of Chipping and District.

The roars from the terrace of 'Come On You Sods' will bring a lump in your eye and a tear to your throat.

Edited October 24, 2021 by Albert Tatlock
add 1 word

[Albert Tatlock]

On 10/23/2021 at 3:48 PM, Malacoda said:

I think we can park the chipping conversation. Or at least wait and see what Albert says. 

Out of the 24 possible UKPV pre-heroes in JIM, I have 22 (62 and 63 are cents). Only one of them (#70) has chipping, so only about 5% in this run.

#s 59, 60, 64, 65, 66, 67. 69, 70. 71, 72, 78, 79 and 80 previously graced the collection of JM Heal. Surely some of his collection has found its way into the hands of someone on these boards.

 

 

Edited October 26, 2021 by Albert Tatlock
scan added.

[Malacoda]

On 10/26/2021 at 10:18 PM, Albert Tatlock said:

Out of the 24 possible UKPV pre-heroes in JIM, I have 22 (62 and 63 are cents). Only one of them (#70) has chipping, so only about 5% in this run.

#s 59, 60, 64, 65, 66, 67. 69, 70. 71, 72, 78, 79 and 80 previously graced the collection of JM Heal. Surely some of his collection has found its way into the hands of someone on these boards.

 

 

 

Well, first of all....phwoar!!!

Okay, I think if these were either knackered commensurate with their age, but with low levels of chipping, or otherwise-beautiful copies with a high level of chipping, they would have a lot to tell us about chipping. As it is,  they have little to no chipping I can see, but also lack creases, tears, spine roll, foxing, scuffing, fading, discolouration, soiling, folds, corner blunting, staining, tape, splits, rust, tanning, angst, existential despair, covid 19 or dropsy.  These have clearly led a very sheltered life and are all too virgo intacta to have anything to say about chipping. 

Still....phwoar ! 

(and if anyone says 'actually Phwoar started in #83', I will report them to the moderator. I'm looking at you, Marwood).