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Marvel's Falling Sales
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Started by romanheart,

1,203 posts in this topic

ComicConnoisseur

ComicConnoisseur

Posted
Posted
35 minutes ago, drotto said:

For the top level creators, it would also serve them well to go to a profit sharing model, where the creators are encouraged to crate new characters, by insuring that the will retain some of the royalties on those characters moving forward.  Similar to where musicians get residuals each time a record is sold or a song is played, even years later, or actors get royalties for when shows are seen in reruns.

 

This could help keeping top talent, and keeping more stable creative teams on books for longer runs.  The companies need to remember that most of the creators today got interested in comics because of DC and Marvel, and the are living a childhood dream to get the work and create for that big sandbox. So the publishers have that advantage, but once that novelty runs out they need something else to keep them there.

Good idea.

Marvel/DC pay these writers/artists of their iconic billion dollar characters peanuts. Seriously, the bench players on the Boston Celtics and Red Sox get paid more in a year than someone writing the latest adventures of Spider-Man and Superman.

They should make it worthwhile so these creators don't jump ship to Image.

 

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kav

kav

Posted
Posted
3 minutes ago, ComicConnoisseur said:

Good idea.

Marvel/DC pay these writers/artists of their iconic billion dollar characters peanuts. Seriously, the bench players on the Boston Celtics and Red Sox get paid more in a year than someone writing the latest adventures of Spider-Man and Superman.

They should make it worthwhile so these creators don't jump ship to Image.

 

they should be paid in percentage only-that way theyre motivated not to produce carp.

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Logan510

Logan510

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1 minute ago, Chuck Gower said:

After D.C. did it, and they'd already lost creators to them. 

Are you talking about DC's pathetic ( at the time ) royalty program? I was not aware of their character creation incentive program in the early 80's. Can you point me to anything about that?

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Prince Namor

Prince Namor

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46 minutes ago, Logan510 said:

Are you talking about DC's pathetic ( at the time ) royalty program? I was not aware of their character creation incentive program in the early 80's. Can you point me to anything about that?

If your talking about Marvel's Epic line, Archie Goodwin is the one who spearheaded that program for creators. Shooter has always tried to take credit for it. 

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Logan510

Logan510

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4 minutes ago, Chuck Gower said:

If your talking about Marvel's Epic line, Archie Goodwin is the one who spearheaded that program for creators. Shooter has always tried to take credit for it. 

I'm not talking about creator owned, I'm talking about character creation incentive.

When John Byrne was prepping to do Alpha Flight, Shooter asked him if he had any new characters to add to the group ( those ended up being Puck and Marrina ) so he could take advantage of their new policy / incentive. Byrne basically got a bonus for creating the new characters and then a small % of any money that might come in down the road for the use of those characters in other media.

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ChiSoxFan

ChiSoxFan

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3 hours ago, ComicConnoisseur said:

All I know is Marvel and Alonso better do something soon to turn around their sales.

Disney who owns Marvel also owns ESPN. 

ESPN who has a drop in many long-time viewers had a massive firing yesterday by Disney.

http://www.dailynews.com/sports/20170426/espn-lays-off-some-100-employees-in-latest-purge

If Disney would fire the ESPN guys for bad performance,than I could see them doing the same thing to Marvel staffers.

 

 

If what Disney did at ESPN is any indication, it won't help -- it will only make the problem worse by ignoring what's really causing the issues.

ESPN's problem is that they're shedding subscribers left and right -- I've read numbers that are in the ballpark of 10 million or so in the last 3 years.  Revenues are down, and they have huge rights fees that they pay to broadcast live events in the major sports (MLB, NFL, NBA).  With cable and satellite television slowly headed to the way of the dinosaur (why pay your local cable company or DirecTv well over $100 a month for a lineup of dozens of channels you don't ever watch?), ESPN is headed into a downward spiral unless they can cut the real cost overheads -- those rights fees -- and regain some of their lost viewers (I don't watch ESPN anymore for the most part, when once the nightly SportsCenter was must-see for me -- as a sports fan, I want scores, highlights, and actual analysis of why teams/players are doing well/poorly -- instead, for the last several years, it feels like ESPN turned into a sports-version of TMZ at times).

When ESPN gets rid of people like Jayson Stark -- who is as knowledgeable and passionate about baseball as anyone they have on staff, save for Buster Olney -- to save whatever salary he made, which is peanuts compared to the money they spend to broadcast the major sport events, it shows that they're still looking at the short-term picture and trying to satisfy their shareholders in some way, rather than address the long-term picture, which won't change a bit with the firings yesterday.  ESPN is still headed towards hemorrhaging money in the future, and nothing they did yesterday is going to reverse that trend.

In that case, Marvel has already done that.  Long term Marvel readers like myself have long since abandoned the lines, worn down by endless reboots, tired storylines, event fatigue, countless renumbering, and change/shake-ups that aren't story-driven, but done for shock value to temporarily boost sales -- "Death of [insert legendary character here]" storylines, as just one example.  Meanwhile, they've done nothing to capitalize on the huge success of their movies (which, at some point, that train will slow eventually) to bring in new blood to their printed material, and they've done nothing to put reading material into the hands of younger generations, and haven't since the introduction of the Direct Market.  (And for anyone who says that kids won't read comics, my friend -- a schoolteacher -- brought kid friendly comic books into his classroom -- Bone TPB's, and some Marvel Essentials -- and gave opportunities for his students to borrow them and read them if they wanted.  Not only did he have constant demand for what he brought, but his students wanted to get their hands on more, so kids will still read if given a chance to, but the marketplace is structured to ignore them entirely, for the most part).  Marvel publishing, like seemingly most businesses, is and has been looking solely at short-term gains versus long-term sustainability in their decision making, and has been doing so for a very long time now.  The chickens are just finally coming home to roost.

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ComicConnoisseur

ComicConnoisseur

Posted
Posted (edited)
27 minutes ago, ChiSoxFan said:

If what Disney did at ESPN is any indication, it won't help -- it will only make the problem worse by ignoring what's really causing the issues.

ESPN's problem is that they're shedding subscribers left and right -- I've read numbers that are in the ballpark of 10 million or so in the last 3 years.  Revenues are down, and they have huge rights fees that they pay to broadcast live events in the major sports (MLB, NFL, NBA).  With cable and satellite television slowly headed to the way of the dinosaur (why pay your local cable company or DirecTv well over $100 a month for a lineup of dozens of channels you don't ever watch?), ESPN is headed into a downward spiral unless they can cut the real cost overheads -- those rights fees -- and regain some of their lost viewers (I don't watch ESPN anymore for the most part, when once the nightly SportsCenter was must-see for me -- as a sports fan, I want scores, highlights, and actual analysis of why teams/players are doing well/poorly -- instead, for the last several years, it feels like ESPN turned into a sports-version of TMZ at times).

When ESPN gets rid of people like Jayson Stark -- who is as knowledgeable and passionate about baseball as anyone they have on staff, save for Buster Olney -- to save whatever salary he made, which is peanuts compared to the money they spend to broadcast the major sport events, it shows that they're still looking at the short-term picture and trying to satisfy their shareholders in some way, rather than address the long-term picture, which won't change a bit with the firings yesterday.  ESPN is still headed towards hemorrhaging money in the future, and nothing they did yesterday is going to reverse that trend.

In that case, Marvel has already done that.  Long term Marvel readers like myself have long since abandoned the lines, worn down by endless reboots, tired storylines, event fatigue, countless renumbering, and change/shake-ups that aren't story-driven, but done for shock value to temporarily boost sales -- "Death of [insert legendary character here]" storylines, as just one example.  Meanwhile, they've done nothing to capitalize on the huge success of their movies (which, at some point, that train will slow eventually) to bring in new blood to their printed material, and they've done nothing to put reading material into the hands of younger generations, and haven't since the introduction of the Direct Market.  (And for anyone who says that kids won't read comics, my friend -- a schoolteacher -- brought kid friendly comic books into his classroom -- Bone TPB's, and some Marvel Essentials -- and gave opportunities for his students to borrow them and read them if they wanted.  Not only did he have constant demand for what he brought, but his students wanted to get their hands on more, so kids will still read if given a chance to, but the marketplace is structured to ignore them entirely, for the most part).  Marvel publishing, like seemingly most businesses, is and has been looking solely at short-term gains versus long-term sustainability in their decision making, and has been doing so for a very long time now.  The chickens are just finally coming home to roost.

I see similarities to ESPN and Marvel. Both were really cool,than they got all preachy, and they turned off their loyal long-time customers/readers.

I remember ESPN Sports-Center was the place to go for sports in the 1990s,while today it has got so preachy with social issues I tuned them out.

I want to know the scores, and what happened on the field. I could care less what their sportscasters beliefs are off the field.

 

 

Edited by ComicConnoisseur
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1950's war comics

1950's war comics

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I feel the same way CC

i used to watch ESPN religiously, and i hardly ever watch it anymore... it's is because ESPN has become political , the first time i became aware of their change was about 15 years ago when they had a special on Jack Nicklaus....

i can't remember exactly what kind of special it was, but at the end of the episode they actually had the audacity to mention something that Jack had supposedly said at one time that was not politically correct and i'm thinking your kidding me right ?? this is Jack Nicklaus we are talking about ,, great man, great family man, great winner and even more gracious when he lost, and he along with Arnold Palmer a couple of the nicest persons ever in sports history and you ESPN are going to make a the only negative comment i have ever heard about him in my  entire life before or since ??

It's been downhill for ESPN ever since as it has become even more politically correct as each year has gone by....

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Ken Aldred

Ken Aldred

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Posted

Nothing much seems to have been learned from the asset-stripping Perelman years at Marvel.

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kav

kav

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If people want sermons about politics they know where they can go for that.  If they want entertainment there should be a place to go for that.  

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Ken Aldred

Ken Aldred

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Posted (edited)
20 minutes ago, 1950's war comics said:

Who would want to watch a game on their phone ?

I've always thought that, and why I've never bothered with larger smartphones. More one for watching on a large widescreen TV paired with a Yamaha soundbar. Same for films, of course.

Edited by Ken Aldred
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Prince Namor

Prince Namor

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Posted
5 minutes ago, Ken Aldred said:

I've always thought that, and why I've never bothered with larger smartphones. More one for watching on a large widescreen TV paired with a Yamaha soundbar.

I would MUCH prefer to watch it like that. Just watched the Manchester United game this afternoon here on a big 50 inch TV.

But as someone who works 7 days a week, travels between St. Louis and Indiana twice a week, and has flown to Southeast Asia a couple of times this year already...I'm not always around a TV. SO I do like to have the option of seeing a game I want to see it, when I'm in the hustle and bustle.

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World Devourer

World Devourer

Posted
Posted
7 hours ago, Ken Aldred said:

I've always thought that, and why I've never bothered with larger smartphones. More one for watching on a large widescreen TV paired with a Yamaha soundbar. Same for films, of course.

Larger smartphones have their place - it's all in the application. I will never understand why people go to a concert and watch the whole thing through their phone. "Best concert I ever filmed!"

 

Go figure.

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