N e r V Posted December 26, 2019 Share Posted December 26, 2019 (edited) On that topic (toxic fans) I think this SNL clip still says it best. Just a movie/show guys, grow up and have a life... Edited December 26, 2019 by N e r V Larryw7, szucchini, bentbryan and 1 other 4 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
speedcake Posted December 26, 2019 Share Posted December 26, 2019 13 hours ago, Bosco685 said: When you immediately poison the well by declaring "toxic" any and all criticism of the character or plot or writing, there isn't much reason to continue reading whatever argument or point the author is trying to make. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
speedcake Posted December 26, 2019 Share Posted December 26, 2019 I left the theater disappointed. It had some very cool moments, and I think handled a couple of highly emotional beats very well, but for me it was the worst of the sequel trilogy. Character arcs went nowhere, the plot was incredibly contrived and repetitive, too much of the dialogue was just bad; where was the romance? Where was tension? I don't see any point in typing out a long rant, most of the main points for and against have been made, but I just felt sad when it was over. Sad that this story has ended, and sad that it just seemed like a massive missed (and therefore lost) opportunity. The sequel trilogy has a bunch of great stuff in it and some memorable moments, but as a story it isn't even up to the same level as the prequel trilogy. At least there was a coherent tale that ended with, IMO, one of the better films in the franchise with ROTS. What real purpose did characters like Finn and Poe (and Rose, and Snap, and on and on) ever really serve? Just feels empty after almost eight hours. I had fun at all three movies, I still love Star Wars, and I look forward to the franchise continuing on. And I'm glad that those who loved this one did so. I just left feeling that it was a bad film, from a critical viewpoint, and that isn't really excusable for an entity like Disney to have managed. Larryw7, Mr Sneeze and Black_Adam 3 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bosco685 Posted December 26, 2019 Share Posted December 26, 2019 10 minutes ago, speedcake said: When you immediately poison the well by declaring "toxic" any and all criticism of the character or plot or writing, there isn't much reason to continue reading whatever argument or point the author is trying to make. I think you may be reading into the situation. What the author is referring to is the toxic situation where some hardcore fans got so excited over her casting they attacked her online directly... Kelly Marie Tran Speaks Out About Online Harassment: ‘I Won’t Be Marginalized’ ...so it is just that situation referred to here. Unfortunately, any reasonable commentary on her performance can then turn into a sensitive situation because of THOSE toxic fans that made it such a sensitive situation. I wouldn't blame the actress for this. Larryw7 and Mr Sneeze 2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bosco685 Posted December 26, 2019 Share Posted December 26, 2019 Here are the attacks that led to Kelly Marie Tran abandoning social media. ‘Star Wars’ Actress Kelly Marie Tran Leaves Social Media After Months of Harassment Quote The actress, who was the first lead female character of color in the iconic series, had been criticized by “Star Wars” fans for her performance, looks and Asian ethnicity. Alt-right internet personality Paul Ray Ramsey took aim at her appearance publicly, and the “Wookieepedia” page for Tran’s character was altered by contributors with offensive, racist language. At the “Last Jedi” premiere in December, Tran told Variety that bringing diversity to the “Star Wars” world has “been both an honor and a responsibility. I feel so overwhelmed.” She added, “A lot of ‘Star Wars’ fans who are specifically Asian never had a character they could dress up like, or they would and people would always call them ‘Asian Rey’ or ‘Asian fill-in-the-blank.’ I get very emotional when I see people who are able to identify with this character. That means a lot to me and I don’t think it will ever get old.” If people had issues with her performance, then at least stick to that valid concern where it is appropriate. When they made it into a race attack or her weight, that's what took it too far. Larryw7 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
fastballspecial Posted December 26, 2019 Share Posted December 26, 2019 (edited) All the critics reviews and Social media from people with no lives just ignore it. The movie is fine, its not a blockbuster, but at least it was better then the last one that I call "Lets turn Luke Skywalker into a ". There are several open plot holes and scenes that don't make a lot of sense, but you can excuse all that as a fan. The point is in the end they get the film right and the franchise right in the end especially. The last 5-10 minutes are just great for fans like me that grew up with it. Those that have already gone and viewed the movie know what I am talking about. Rogue One by far is still my favorite. The pivotal moments are a little jumbled, but end up right. Abrahms got a ton of flack , but when its all laid out in the end he got it right. And really from a fan point of view that's all that should matter. If I was nitpick without spoilers they are below. I would have liked to see more with the main villain and his crowd that was creepy. They short change Rey's big scene at the end with the Jedi they could have done more. I still say Kylo Ren was a poor acting choice. The helmet is still ridiculous. The death of Fischer I am sure hurt the film as I thought they could have put her in more of the film and it would have helped development. The main villain should have gotten more attention in the film then he did I though. Edited December 26, 2019 by fastballspecial Black_Adam and Azkaban 2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
speedcake Posted December 26, 2019 Share Posted December 26, 2019 (edited) 59 minutes ago, Bosco685 said: I think you may be reading into the situation. What the author is referring to is the toxic situation where some hardcore fans got so excited over her casting they attacked her online directly... Kelly Marie Tran Speaks Out About Online Harassment: ‘I Won’t Be Marginalized’ ...so it is just that situation referred to here. Unfortunately, any reasonable commentary on her performance can then turn into a sensitive situation because of THOSE toxic fans that made it such a sensitive situation. I wouldn't blame the actress for this. naw. I read what the author wrote. "Rose was introduced in “The Last Jedi” and became a point of contention for some toxic “Star Wars” fans." Not just implying that contention with the character is due solely to fan toxicity, but outright declaring it. Reasoned, logical criticism of the character and her plot line isn't allowed. If you disagree, then you are being toxic. it's a popular logical fallacy. I'm aware of what happened to the actor on social media, and don't condone that behavior at all. I didn't like her character in The Last Jedi, but still found it pretty ridiculous to have sidelined her to the extent Abrams did in Rise. What a mess. Edited December 26, 2019 by speedcake bentbryan 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Popular Post N e r V Posted December 27, 2019 Popular Post Share Posted December 27, 2019 I think we have arrived at a point though where it’s no longer just someone stating a critique or viewpoint. People are trying to start social media “movements” to get their way with anything they don’t care for. The case of the recent Captain Marvel movie and its “critics” is a case of trying to sabotage something just because you personally have issues with it for some reason. Theres a lot of stuff I don’t care for but if someone else likes it and is willing to pay to see it who am I to try and sink it? I’m still allowed to dislike it as long as I’m not actively trying to destroy it or someone over my own personal tastes. There are lines to not to be crossed with these things.... fastballspecial, Mr Sneeze, Cozmo-One and 2 others 5 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bosco685 Posted December 27, 2019 Share Posted December 27, 2019 (edited) 1 hour ago, speedcake said: naw. I read what the author wrote. "Rose was introduced in “The Last Jedi” and became a point of contention for some toxic “Star Wars” fans." Not just implying that contention with the character is due solely to fan toxicity, but outright declaring it. Reasoned, logical criticism of the character and her plot line isn't allowed. If you disagree, then you are being toxic. it's a popular logical fallacy. I'm aware of what happened to the actor on social media, and don't condone that behavior at all. I didn't like her character in The Last Jedi, but still found it pretty ridiculous to have sidelined her to the extent Abrams did in Rise. What a mess. I read what they wrote as well. But feel like the focus was on the toxic fans (if you can even call them fans), and not anyone that had an issue with her acting. Hence why the author noted 'some toxic Star Wars fans'. Otherwise, the article writer would have noted 'anyone that had an issue with Kelly Marie Tran, which I then consider them toxic'. See what I mean? 15 minutes ago, N e r V said: I think we have arrived at a point though where it’s no longer just someone stating a critique or viewpoint. People are trying to start social media “movements” to get their way with anything they don’t care for. The case of the recent Captain Marvel movie and its “critics” is a case of trying to sabotage something just because you personally have issues with it for some reason. Theres a lot of stuff I don’t care for but if someone else likes it and is willing to pay to see it who am I to try and sink it? I’m still allowed to dislike it as long as I’m not actively trying to destroy it or someone over my own personal tastes. There are lines to not to be crossed with these things.... There is so much of that now. It takes the fun out of these films and TV shows at times. Even with Birds of Prey, I may not be a fan just yet. But I see those that are already demanding monthly trailer releases because they want access to all new scenes from the film. Yet these same people would then complain later 'They revealed the entire plot of the movie in the trailers'. But right now, they act like better marketing planners then the actual professionals. Until they get what they demand, and get agitated over that. Edited December 27, 2019 by Bosco685 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MetalPSI Posted December 27, 2019 Share Posted December 27, 2019 On 12/22/2019 at 11:37 PM, zhamlau said: Just saw the movie...sigh... Just to level set, The Last Jedi was an abomination...it basically destroyed huge parts of Star Wars lore and mythology, as well as being a badly written illogical poorly acted placeholder cash grab of a movie. “Rise of the Skywalker” was so badly hamstrung by that garbage movie, it’s almost unfair to judge its failings without understanding what a bad spot Rian and KK put them in. Having said all that, J.J. did himself and the audience absolutely no favors in this new film. He could have recovered the core in so many ways, instead he created a chaotic meandering video game of a movie. Rey is still an overpowered no personality ultra mega superhero. Kylo is somewhat interesting but mostly irrelevant foil. The rest of the characters are plug and play interchangeable. This movie is just never ending mission runs and throw away dialogue. When I heard the emperor laugh in the ads then saw him in the trailers, I knew no one at Disney actually loved or cared about Star Wars or it’s fans. They had no respect for the characters and their importance to fans over many generations. They just care about CYA and grabbing as many short term nickels as possible. This is a bad movie that could have been more but decided against it. The only thing good it does is completely all over Rian Johnson and “The Last Jedi”. That felt good to see. Bring on Baby Yoda. Disney should be falling at Jon Favreau’s feet thanking him for (so far) saving them. Well said Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MetalPSI Posted December 27, 2019 Share Posted December 27, 2019 On 12/22/2019 at 7:47 PM, bentbryan said: Aaaaaaaand will never be in another Star Wars or Disney project ever again. Kinda funny since his character completely sucked and he way over-acted the role in probably the weakest episode in the show anyway. Hey now, only classy people have naked ladies tattooed on them Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bentbryan Posted December 27, 2019 Share Posted December 27, 2019 1 hour ago, Bosco685 said: I read what they wrote as well. But feel like the focus was on the toxic fans (if you can even call them fans), and not anyone that had an issue with her acting. Hence why the author noted 'some toxic Star Wars fans'. Otherwise, the article writer would have noted 'anyone that had an issue with Kelly Marie Tran, which I then consider them toxic'. See what I mean? There is so much of that now. It takes the fun out of these films and TV shows at times. Even with Birds of Prey, I may not be a fan just yet. But I see those that are already demanding monthly trailer releases because they want access to all new scenes from the film. Yet these same people would then complain later 'They revealed the entire plot of the movie in the trailers'. But right now, they act like better marketing planners then the actual professionals. Until they get what they demand, and get agitated over that. It is super aggravating to have a legitimate point of contention with a film only to be drowned out by insufficiently_thoughtful_persons who most likely live in their moms basement. However the author made no effort to differentiate between the two so I can’t tell if they are playing up the “everyone who dislikes TLJ is toxic” or not (which is a pretty common theme) Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Larryw7 Posted December 27, 2019 Share Posted December 27, 2019 (edited) NVM Edited December 28, 2019 by Larryw7 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
@therealsilvermane Posted December 27, 2019 Share Posted December 27, 2019 (edited) Go see Rian Johnson’s Knives Out. What an awesome movie and I can see how it was made by the director of Last Jedi in one way. Edited December 27, 2019 by @therealsilvermane Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bosco685 Posted December 27, 2019 Share Posted December 27, 2019 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bosco685 Posted December 27, 2019 Share Posted December 27, 2019 The RT Audience Score seemed locked in at 86% though the count of contributors has grown substantially. Yet compared to Metacritic and IMDb results (50% to 70%), statistically something seems off. IMDb's user votes are in the thousands as well for US and Non-US contributors. So it's not like RT is the more popular site for such user ratings. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bosco685 Posted December 27, 2019 Share Posted December 27, 2019 Rise of Skywalker: The Mighty 86% Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bosco685 Posted December 27, 2019 Share Posted December 27, 2019 Quote Another big day for Disney’s Star Wars: Rise of Skywalker with a Dec. 26 estimated gross of $30.7M, -4% from Christmas Day. Industry sources are forecasting that through the ninth-quel’s first ten days by Sunday, the J.J. Abrams directed movie will hit $380.9M, pacing 3% ahead of Last Jedi at the same point in time. Pretty impressive for a pic we dinged for having a slow start. Skywalker‘s Dec. 26 bests that of Last Jedi‘s ($27.7M) and is just under Rogue One‘s $32M which was on the Monday after a Christmas Sunday. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Popular Post jsilverjanet Posted December 27, 2019 Popular Post Share Posted December 27, 2019 I don't get this "I need to see it again" mindset. That's a flawed movie. Why waste your money on something that wasn't made correctly? The object of storytelling shouldn't be "read it once, then read it again and then you'll understand". This somehow has become Disney's signature movie. The are counting on multiple viewings from movie goers. The other day I saw an ad for Frozen that said "see it again" Has anyone ever read a book then read it again to understand it. No you read the next one. Unless it's great, will I see something again or read it again. Or even a TV show. Watch it back to back because it was so damn good. No you watch the next thing. Ishtar failed because it didn't have the right marketing "see it again, it sucks even more the 2nd and 3rd viewings" WTF Bosco685, paperheart, bane and 2 others 5 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bosco685 Posted December 27, 2019 Share Posted December 27, 2019 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
